England Discussion

Discussion in 'Pitchside - Football Forum' started by Ataturk, Sep 23, 2012.

  1. darkvoid

    darkvoid Tiocfaidh ár lá

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    I think he was only wumming. I think he had been lurking the forum since he was banned and when someone mentioned him (might have been you i think) i think it spured him to sign up.
    Maybe he was a manc but was definitely taking the piss with the whole rooney thing
     
  2. ILLOK

    ILLOK In the Danger Zone.

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    Rashford is definitely better than Lingaard imo.

    redcanuck did love Rooney. After he became known for it he started putting it on a bit because he thought it was dead funny and made him edgy on a Liverpool forum, when in fact everyone saw the tedious shite for what it was.
     
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  3. darkvoid

    darkvoid Tiocfaidh ár lá

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    Fair enough so

    It was pretty obvious that canoe was canuck from his first post and even before that he liked that comment I mentioned in the post above.
    Tbf I'm surprised he lasted as long as he did.
    If only we could get rid of lovepool as easy
     
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  4. Jase

    Jase Well-Known Member

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    ahhh brilliant, that's gotta be one of my all time fav cringe moments
     
  5. darkvoid

    darkvoid Tiocfaidh ár lá

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    Whats embarrassing about that?
    I think he speaks perfect dutchlol
     
  6. Kopstar

    Kopstar ★★★★★ Valued Member

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    This is far more serious than the Allardyce 'sting'. I'm afraid it doesn't reflect well on either Sammy Lee or McParland (that's an understatement).

    https://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/nov/07/england-sammy-lee-bolton-transfer-deal-appeal-court

    Appeal court finds Sammy Lee gave false evidence over Bolton transfer deal

    • High court judgment upheld that England assistant manager lied
    • Case involved agents in Bolton’s signing of Gavin McCann in 2007

    David Conn


    Monday 7 November 2016 23.14 GMT Last modified on Tuesday 8 November 2016 00.35 GMT

    A high court judgment in which the current England assistant manager, Sammy Lee, was found to have knowingly given false evidence has been upheld by the court of appeal. Lee, when manager of Bolton Wanderers for a short period in 2007 having taken over from Sam Allardyce, was found to have lied about his club’s involvement in signing the midfield player Gavin McCann, who had been poached by the agents SEM.

    The Football Association has never taken any action against anybody involved in the case, despite findings revealing that Bolton and SEM then backdated the contract for McCann, and that Lee and other witnesses gave false evidence. Following the upholding of the judgment’s findings on appeal, the FA declined to comment.

    Tony McGill, the agent who had an agreement with McCann to represent the player, succeeded in September 2014 with his accusation that SEM, whose then chief executive was the well-known agent Jerome Anderson, had poached McCann at the last minute with the Bolton deal already agreed. Bolton paid SEM a £300,000 fee for doing “little or nothing,” the judgment stated. Lee and Frank McParland, Bolton’s then general manager, were found to have lied about two meetings they claimed had taken place with McCann in a restaurant in Liverpool, designed to show that they had discussed McCann with SEM earlier than they did.

    His honour Judge Waksman QC, in his 2014 judgment, said he did not accept that any such meetings took place and stated of Lee’s, Bolton’s and SEM’s evidence: “Their accounts do not stack up and are riddled with inconsistencies and different versions over time.”

    In a later ruling on legal costs Waksman recorded that Lee’s and McParland’s evidence about the meetings was “unreliable” and “false”, saying: “The events attested to by the Bolton witnesses concerning these meetings simply did not happen. True, I did not use the word ‘dishonesty’ [in his first judgment] but plainly, if their evidence on the facts on this issue was false, they must have known it to be so.”

    Waksman also found that Bolton, then chaired by the late Phil Gartside, an FA board member, backdated the contract signed by McCann, to make it look as if SEM had been involved earlier than they were. The judge found that Gartside’s evidence was also unreliable and said he “became visibly uncomfortable” under questioning about the contract, before finally admitting that he signed it at a later date than the one written on the contract.

    Bolton and SEM presented their commercial relationship as if SEM had acted for the club and not McCann, who was said to have resented paying tax when an agent’s fee was paid on his behalf by a club. This practice, of stating that an agent was acting for a club and not a player, was known as “switching.” Bolton, though, did record the £300,000 fee paid to SEM as a benefit for McCann anyway, the court was told, because Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs were conducting “an increasing number of investigations” into football transfers.

    Waksman found that when McCann called McGill to tell him SEM were going to do the deal with Bolton, McGill had said: “Don’t do this, Gavin, we have an agreement, what about that?” McCann had replied: “I am sorry, I feel shit”.

    McGill complained first to the Football Association in 2007, even before McCann signed for Bolton, that SEM had poached McCann from him, in breach of an oral agreement they had made for McGill to represent the player, but the FA took no action and he began court proceedings. Despite Waksman’s findings of poaching, false evidence given by several senior football figures including Sammy Lee and the backdating of the contract, the FA still took no action in 2014. Waksman ruled that despite his findings about the conduct of the Bolton and SEM defendants, McGill could not in fact receive any damages, because he did not have a written agreement with McCann so could not prove he definitely would have ultimately concluded the Bolton deal for him.

    McGill appealed, and two court of appeal judges have now ruled that in fact he was the victim of an “unlawful means conspiracy” and should be entitled to damages for having lost the opportunity to conclude the deal for McCann to sign for Bolton. That issue, of how much damages McGill is entitled to from SEM, has been referred back to Waksman to be decided.

    The appeal court judges, Lord Justice Lloyd Jones and Mr Justice Henderson, upheld all the factual findings made by Waksman in his 2014 judgment, noting that although he did not grant McGill’s claim for damages: “The judge was very critical, however, of much of the evidence given by the defendants and their witnesses, and he concluded that they had fabricated some key events in a misguided attempt to improve their position.”

    McGill, who has spent nine years fighting to prove his case, told the Guardian that he informed the FA in May 2007 just after McCann was poached away from him, and had always kept the governing body informed.

    “They now know Bolton submitted a false and backdated contract, that Sammy Lee and Frank McParland gave evidence in court the judge dismissed as untrue, but the FA have done nothing,” he said.

    Lee, the former Liverpool and England midfielder, left Bolton in October 2007, then worked in senior coaching roles at Liverpool, back at Bolton and Southampton, before the FA appointed him to rejoin Allardyce, as the England team’s assistant manager, in July this year.

    After Allardyce, after taking charge of just one game, left by mutual consent following the undercover sting by the Daily Telegraph last month, Lee has been retained, and is currently working with the squad preparing for the forthcoming matches against Scotland and Spain.

    Asked if following the appeal the FA would now be taking action against Lee or any of the other defendants in the McGill case, a spokesperson said: “We understand there are still matters to be decided by the court and therefore it would not be appropriate to comment”.
     
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  7. Bodger

    Bodger Well-Known Member

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    I bloody hate the international break but I'm pretty excited for tomorrow's game. Should be a comfortable win for us. Expecting at least Henderson and maybe Sturridge to start from the LFC contingent. Clyne is somehow behind walker in the pecking order but yeah.

    Comfortable 3-1 win for england
     
  8. Zinedine Biscan

    Zinedine Biscan The patient one

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    Only thing I care about this week is our players staying free of injury.
     
  9. inaiq

    inaiq "Some people feel the rain others just get wet"

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    From a self-serving perspective, I have no problems if all of our players did not play a big part in any internationals this season, however, the reality is that they will be playing some part across 3 continents and I "ditto" @Zinedine Biscan post above.
     
  10. Limiescouse

    Limiescouse Well-Known Member

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    Potential positive, it will give Sturridge more game minutes and get him closer to game fitness than he would have got without the break. Hendo is back to his workhorse best, Clyne is behind walker. Coutinho is really the only one I worry about, especially as that game with Argentina tomorrow could get nasty.
     
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  11. SBYM

    SBYM I'm just living the dream

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    Turns out the only thing you had to worry about was Phil playing like the deadset legend he is, making a call from the Camp Nou inevitable...
     
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  12. SBYM

    SBYM I'm just living the dream

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    Rideo fellow Reds...someone give me the précis...I was working at the pub and although it was on the telly we were busy as feck.

    Liverpool v Scotland, yeah?
     
  13. treboeth

    treboeth Well-Known Member

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    I wonder if we can put a bonus in his contract, say £40,000 for not scoring in his internationals.
     
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  14. treboeth

    treboeth Well-Known Member

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    Yes 2 nil to us Studge and Lallana scored ;-)
    and some guy Cahill hit a cheeky goal for some reason.
     
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  15. Scott Jones

    Scott Jones Well-Known Member

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    It was shit with flashes of Liverpool players scoring,Scotland deserved a draw and got beat 3-0.:-)
     
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  16. SBYM

    SBYM I'm just living the dream

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    Hahahahah...top notch!!!

    :well done:
     
  17. T.C.B

    T.C.B Well-Known Member

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    As an Irishman I more or less agree. England were the better side but they should be given the players at their disposal.
    Sometimes little flashes of quality overcome effort.
     
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  18. SBYM

    SBYM I'm just living the dream

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    Typical...

    The League laughs at our current drought but when they need someone to step up it's one of those Red Men who answers the call.

    England-v-Poland-FIFA-2014-World-Cup-Qualifier.jpg

    Steven is one of the best players you can find. He has everything. As long as I was England manager, he was extremely important to me.
    -SVEN-GORAN ERIKSSON
     
  19. lfc.eddie

    lfc.eddie "¿Plata... O Plomo?" Valued Member

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    It would have been Liverpool 3 - 0 Scotland if Cahill didn't freaking push Lallana on full flight. Chelsea players, no matter who they play for, they will always be dirty fuckers.
     
  20. mattyhurst

    mattyhurst TIA Regular

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    It was ok for an England match, did like how Sterling tried his best not to score on several occasions.
     
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  21. koptician

    koptician We'll go again!

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    Well thanks a bunch England. Lallana injured
     
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  22. Scott Jones

    Scott Jones Well-Known Member

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    It doesn't look good but he didn't look uncomfortable coming off,beautiful ball for Vardy who fcuked it up but got penalty luckily from Reina,nice penalty,good headed goal by Vardy,2-0 now,counter attacks look mint as well for England with just a tad of the Liverpool pressing.
     
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  23. RaoulDuke

    RaoulDuke Wind-Down Merchant

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    Klinsi available now, after being sacked by the US.
    But the FA should rather stick with southgate in my opinion. Or find someone else. Never rated klinsi as a manager. He was good at selling himself to the media when loew did the work for him.
     
  24. EdWood

    EdWood TIA Youth Team

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    Gone for the cheapest management option once more I see. You usually get what you pay for, as even LFC has of late.;-)
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2016
  25. RaoulDuke

    RaoulDuke Wind-Down Merchant

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    Who else would have been available now?
    And please don't tell me klinsmann or some old-age pensioner.

    Hard to imagine southgate could do worse than roy in france or capello in south africa.
    I give him the benefit of the doubt. For now.
     
  26. Scott Jones

    Scott Jones Well-Known Member

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    With the previous bar set so low I think that will help definitely,not sure he will be successful but fcuk me when you remind yourself who we had before it's chilling,so onwards and upw..........:think:
     
  27. Limiescouse

    Limiescouse Well-Known Member

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    This has been the idea for years now. International football is no longer a job many top managers want, for any of the sides, and so you have to change up your perspective of what you should look for (in fact its never been clear that a good club manager makes a good international manager). He is a smart and likeable guy with pretty good tournament experience accrued over 3 or maybe 4 managerial regimes. He was with the U21s for exactly this purpose, so let's give it a go.
     
  28. Arminius

    Arminius FSG PR plant Moderator

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    Defoe called back to the England squad - on form, he probably merits it, but that really says something. He is 34 years old now, and his game was always pace plus finishing.
     
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  29. Zoran

    Zoran Fighting like beavers.

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    Glad for Defoe. :-)

    But Livermore?
     
  30. RaoulDuke

    RaoulDuke Wind-Down Merchant

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    I don't even want to check the squad.
    After reading that woodburn (born in chester, only one welsh grandparent) has been called up to the welsh senior squad:

    Those alleged puny FA attempts to make him switch to england: failed

    Good for defoe, but they should have called up lookman.
    Because the english players with african ancestry are defecting in droves (zaha, iwobi, moses, afobe).

    England has lost all its' drawing power and appeal. Pathetic.
    Not even the money and possible better sponsorship deals are enough to convince young players to play for england instead for some african teams.

    I'm sure lookman will switch to nigeria pretty soon.
    Thank god kane wasn't interested in ireland and Dele didn't check his roots properly.
    I hope that davies lad from everton has no welsh/irish/scottish ancestry.
     
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2017

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