England Discussion

Discussion in 'Pitchside - Football Forum' started by Ataturk, Sep 23, 2012.

  1. Flobs

    Flobs FADA

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    Here I don' agree, you don't just try things in international football. There's just not the time (unlike for a club). Any half decent manager picks a basic system and just uses it's varients. If Southgate has tried a 5 xx formation then I presume he will continue down those lines. As stated i don't think it's a viable system for England.
    What was glaring with this friendly was the lack of attacking options out wide. It was calling out for wingers or 2 up front who are capable of playing down the wings. Not that I thought Vardy was poor, he wasn't, he was great running and pressing however England haven't another striker who proposes the same thing. Rashford epitomised this being ineffective in the role.

    Has he?
    That's news to me, I remember once this season for a very specific match with a very specific role for a derby. He's much more familiar with playing an attacking Full back role.
    Nowhere have I criticised the selection of Walker or Bertrand. All I have done is use their selections to highlight where a 5221 will probably fall short for England. As with the CB's, Who Have England got to fulfill 3 at the back?
    Cahill was our best element, I thought Smalling was poor until Stones came on and looked even worst. Keane defensively looked solid but didn't have the courage to pass the ball forward. Please name me one English defender who could remotely fullfil that central covering role. I suppose Dier might be capable of looking half decent there but he's far from being a specialist.

    Unless Southgate is going down the lines of 523, 532 this has no sense even as an option. A 4141 (or variants of 451) has much better options going forward considering the players at England's disposal.
    I see this as just a complete waste of time, a match that could have been used to develop something useful for the future rather than some option exercise for the whims of the manager and a few pundits who play football on pieces of paper or in a virtual world.
     
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  2. Limiescouse

    Limiescouse Well-Known Member

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    You are unaware that Spurs have played 3 CBs on numerous occasions?
     
  3. Kopstar

    Kopstar ★★★★★ Valued Member

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    The odd thing is that Spurs use Dier as one of the three, which I think he's well suited to, but Southgate chose to use him in midfield when only one of our other starting CB's (Cahill) is used to it. I would have had Dier in there with Cahill and Keane/Stones.
     
  4. Limiescouse

    Limiescouse Well-Known Member

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    That's a fair point, but the counter is we were already so short of CMs that he picked Jake Livermore. Going that route would have made us mightily close to going 5-0-5.

    As for the merits of the experiment, we have 4 players who are very familiar with the system and all of whom are, if not automatic picks, certainly at the front of the queue for their spots. Add in a manager who not only played it but whose presence was often the key to it working, and it's an experiment that makes sense. It is unlikely to change into the default, although if Walker, Rose, Cahill and Dier are going to play then there is an argument for it to be so, but if we want to go into a tournament and not be predictable and strategically rigid then it's the sort of experiment he is going to have to perform periodically before Russia.
     
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  5. Flobs

    Flobs FADA

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    I don't follow Spurs however personally 7 out of 28 matches isn't numerous in my book!
     
  6. RaoulDuke

    RaoulDuke Wind-Down Merchant

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    Well, Southgate obviously knew why to start Defoe over Vardy and Rashford.

    Assist from the little lad.
     
  7. Herb

    Herb Well-Known Member

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    The standard typically dull qualifier. No pace to the play, will probably eventually wear them out and get a second around 75 mins.
     
  8. redaderry

    redaderry Well-Known Member

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    Glenn Hoddle's senseless rambling would make any game seem dull. Rhubarb, rhubarb, rhubarb, rhubbbbbbaarrr........zzzzzzz
     
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  9. RaoulDuke

    RaoulDuke Wind-Down Merchant

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    Vardy was also conspiring against uncle roy and sam.
    Now after he got them sacked he scores again.
     
  10. RaoulDuke

    RaoulDuke Wind-Down Merchant

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    Was that a blackout from rashford?
    What a blatant, stupid handball.

    Edit: that was a brilliant tackle from keane. The opposition doesn't have much quality, but keane is doing a solid job.
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2017
  11. Limiescouse

    Limiescouse Well-Known Member

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    That was a beautiful touch from Lallana to set up Vardy. A small bright spot in a turgid game (is there any other sort of qualifier these days?)
     
  12. FGred

    FGred Well-Known Member

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    The worse thing is he gave man of the match to Defoe when all he did in one hour was to score one goal but the real MOTM Adam Lallana who ran himself ragged and all the attacks started from him or Alli got nothing apart from the ITV panel who gave him all the credit. We will rue the day we didn't sign Alli his understanding with Adam was telepathic.
     
  13. Limiescouse

    Limiescouse Well-Known Member

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    Textbook England - http://www.espnfc.co.uk/team/englan...ashfords-time-with-england-u21s-he-needs-rest

    Cycle repeated ad infinitum:

    Summer youth tournament - England lose to much much stronger sides

    Response - We need to start taking these age group tournaments more seriously. Some of our limitations at the senior level is because our best young players lack the tournament experience of the Spanish/Germans/Dutch, all sides who use established players.

    Tournament approaches - this time we're definitely going to take this seriously

    Tournament gets closer - yeah, but we cant use him. And he needs a rest. And he has been playing for 12 months already, so not him either.

    Result - We send a B team full of players who have little chance of being established senior players.
     
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  14. RaoulDuke

    RaoulDuke Wind-Down Merchant

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    Rashford, the mou-fringe player, needs experience, not a rest.
    He can't be that exhausted after his few cameos this season.
    And I read a few days ago he himself wants to play in that tournament, but that it ain't his call to make.

    As a side note:
    A few weeks ago nigerian media allegedly reported that Lookmans' father wanted to hold talks with the nigerian FA to prepare a switch for his son. It was even said that lookman should be already called up to nigerian friendlies last week.
    Obviously that didn't happen and the kid is playing for england at a U20 tournament now.
    There is still hope he won't do an iwobi or zaha.

    But he started on the bench vs france a few days ago.
    I was surprised that he wasn't deemed good enough to start for the U20 side.
     
  15. jaffod

    jaffod Well-Known Member

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    I have an almost pathological hatred for everything surrounding cunting England. From the incompetent and corrupt FA through the vast majority of over-rated fucking dross that wear the shirt to the fucking knuckle-dragging, neanderthal, pig-ignorant shower of wankers who follow them. Just fuck right off.
     
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  16. RaoulDuke

    RaoulDuke Wind-Down Merchant

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    Then why even bother to read this thread or write something in it?

    Your post basically insults and tells everyone in here who is interested or cares to FO, too.
    Ignorant. Sad.
     
  17. Scott Jones

    Scott Jones Well-Known Member

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    Fucking joke this post here and should be seen as what it is,sounds like a hes talking about himself,ignorant.
     
  18. ILLOK

    ILLOK In the Danger Zone.

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    Appears to be pretty spot on to me.
     
  19. Scott Jones

    Scott Jones Well-Known Member

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    Not tarring many with them comments then,fuck the FA but not the fans who have to follow expensively the tarts who run and play the national game,his comments about fans is fucking ridiculous.
     
  20. Krimson

    Krimson • Supermané •

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    Hello, Jurgen.
     
  21. lfc.eddie

    lfc.eddie "¿Plata... O Plomo?" Valued Member

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    Actually if none of our players are being picked, there will be lesser people discussing in this thread though. Example, me... if we don't have anyone playing for England, I won't even care. Try put a thread about Scotland, I am pretty sure you won't see me there until we got someone playing for them.
     
  22. ILLOK

    ILLOK In the Danger Zone.

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    Again, seems pretty spot on to me. It's pretty clear he's not saying absolutely everybody who supports England is like that (I couldn't imagine Raoul Duke with his pot belly sticking out his ill fitting, unwashed England shirt with a pint in his hand singing about world wars or the IRA or booing the German national anthem for example), just a lot of the regulars who go and watch them. He's right, a good number of them behave like bellends. Soz.
     
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  23. Scott Jones

    Scott Jones Well-Known Member

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    Ok,the dickhead inside me thought he was all and not some so fair enough,my neighbour went to Eng v Holland and hes a twat so i know some are, hes a manure fan as well so hes a knobhead too,
     
  24. jaffod

    jaffod Well-Known Member

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    I haven't read the thread, wouldn't waste my time. Just letting off some steam after hearing the Lallana news. Seemed the best place to put it.
    Another one of our players injured playing for a team 95% of our fan-base couldn't give the first fuck about. I don't know one decent Red who gives a shite about the national fucking team. All cheer on the Rooney's, Terry's, Ferdinand's and Cahill's do we? Not for me, cunts to a man.
    The whoppers who follow them deserve everything they get. S*n reading dickheads embarrassing themselves everywhere they go, I can't wait 'til they get weighed in in Russia next year, hopefully after Suarez dumps them out the World Cup again.
     
  25. RaoulDuke

    RaoulDuke Wind-Down Merchant

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    Klopp doesn't hate international football.
    On the contrary.
    At least when germany is involved.
    I still can remember him being a pundit on german TV during euros and world cups a few years ago, while he was managing mainz.

    Not everyone is as narrow minded as some think.

    All this stuff is hardly a problem anywhere else.
    Only in england self-loathing and hatred towards the national team is expected to be the "right way".
     
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  26. Hope in your heart

    Hope in your heart Loyalty and patience, two undervalued concepts... Admin

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    I wish England well. But I hate it too when one Liverpool player after the other gets destroyed by incompetent handling of injuries. There is something seriously wrong with it, and any caring Liverpool fan has good reasons to moan about the England team. Lallana is just the latest in case. Sturridge, Hendo, Gerrard, and many others before them are testimony for that.

    The problem is that it doesn't only have a short-term incidence on the players and on the club. Let's take Lallana: he's out for one month. In itself, it's four games. But in fact, it could be much more than that. He'll need time to find his form again, which will impact the club's results. Also, injured players tend to re-injure themselves, we should know that very well.

    Sturridge's body for instance was basically f.cked over by the ignorant way in which Hodgson treated him at the time. He continues to pay for it right until this day.

    Hopefully that won't be the case for Lallana though, but I can imagine Klopp having a right outburst of rage after learning how this occured. If Lallana was injured at half-time, he had to be taken off, full stop. There is no excuse for such an inept handling of this case.
     
  27. Livvy

    Livvy Well-Known Member

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    My question about this is..... if Lallana was injured at halftime...why couldnt he simply just refuse to play? He seems to be a really smart guy so why hasnt he said "sorry guys", i cant play anymore? Tbh this is what i would expect, he isnt a child anymore? :?:
     
  28. Cologne-Liverpool

    Cologne-Liverpool Well-Known Member

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    Don't know in this specific case, but from own experience - not every injury is as apparent immediately in its full extent even to the player himself, so he might have thought it wasn't that bad - ususally we would applaud a player for not giving up too easily...I'm sure if Lallana had realised/known how this would end up, he would have said something.
     
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  29. Rambler

    Rambler Bootle Boy

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    95% of our fan-base couldn't give the first fuck about.

    Not true at all. I live in the city & that certainly doesn't apply to the fans I know....When tournaments are on I see plenty of England flags in windows and on cars, taxis etc.
     
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  30. Flobs

    Flobs FADA

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    That would depend who you ask. Fans of clubs with internationals in general loath the international breaks. Hate that 'their players are called up .....etc.

    That is down to expectations. Have you heard the booing that the French rugby team gets when it doesn't live up to expectations?
    Or the criticism when the French football squad is put under when they don't behave 'properly'?
     

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