Mamadou Sakho (CB) Southampton, Galatasaray, West Bromwich Albion

Discussion in 'Rumour Mill - Transfer Talk' started by kipland007, Aug 24, 2016.

  1. i_still_miss_fowler

    i_still_miss_fowler Well-Known Member Moderator

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    Our measure should not be what we have today, but where do we want to be.

    We all know we have a fundamental problem in defence, by keeping Sakho it does absolutely nothing to resolve that problem. All he does is add squad depth. Hypothically lets say Matip does his hamstring first game of the 17/18 season. How many of us would shudder at that thought, even having Sakho to fill the void.

    I consider Matip a very good but not a particularly special player. We 100% need to upgrade on our CBs in the summer, if that upgrade is Sakho I would be disappointed as we know our defence has been poor for years. Personally the 20-30M that we receive for Sakho could go towards a player who really could make difference to the first team.


    My point is not to blame Sakho, but to illustrate he is not the solution. Neither is Lucas, Kalvin, Mignolet, or Moreno. Even Lovren I consider only good enough as our 3rd CB. As good as Sakho can be, half the time he gives the impression of a mistake just waiting to happen (like a Lucas foul on the edge of the box). To have that in the heart of defence for me does nothing to improve the issue of confidence, mistakes and panicking.

    Fundamentally we need to be aiming higher. I dont simply mean someone like Bonucci or Vertonghen, but someone whose strength is the mental part of the game rather than simply the physical.
     
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  2. Alex

    Alex since 2004

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    Who? Is he available this summer?
     
  3. i_still_miss_fowler

    i_still_miss_fowler Well-Known Member Moderator

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  4. Anfield rd Dreamer

    Anfield rd Dreamer Well-Known Member

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    Of all those only really Van Dijk could be considered a proven option ready to step in at Sakho's level from day 1. And even he could flop just like any signing. We need to sign as good or better than Sakho. It's easier said than done.
     
  5. Scott Jones

    Scott Jones Well-Known Member

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    VVD is better than Sakho.
     
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  6. Anfield rd Dreamer

    Anfield rd Dreamer Well-Known Member

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    Yes. But still might flop like any other signing. The others are not, yet, at the level of Sakho and we'd be signing them hoping they can get to and exceed his level. He would also cost 10-30 million more than we will get from selling Sakho. It's easy to say "let's replace Sakho for a better more consistent CB" but realistically? Can we sign one without costing mega money? Can we guarantee that player won't flop or disappoint?
     
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  7. Scott Jones

    Scott Jones Well-Known Member

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    I see VVD having more about him with a big pair of bollocks who is scared of nothing so can't see him being a flop for anyone,i like Sackho tbh and would rather bring him back and replace Lovren as he's just a bit wet and vulnerable,but Virgil is the fucking man imo and would be perfect.:-)
     
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  8. big noyd

    big noyd Active Member

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    assume/imagine matip was first a french speaker, like sakho. seems like they would complement each other well--matip is strong in the air & usually in the right place, aspects where sakho is weakest. and lovren fucked up another high, long ball against stoke--he doesn't do much better than sakho with them

    that sakho makes some people who watch him nervous is not especially compelling

    but again, not happening, and to fret over his not having a place next season is to succumb to the power of his personality IMO. and if we get top 4, no matter if it's through the back door or the kitchen window, then klopp got away with it this season
     
  9. James H

    James H "I dunno, I just work here"

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    I don't understand what he "got away with" if we get top four without sakho surely it vindicates his "Sakho is dispensable" attitude no?
     
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  10. redbj

    redbj crowd fund for you to shut up give me the details

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    no.

    whats your point? it really lacks logical thinking.

    your basically asking for...I don't know actually to be honest....some form of garuntee....bizarre.

    we need an upgrade at the back...its a simple game...and its a very simple fact....why the fuck do we always have to overcomplicate.
     
  11. redbj

    redbj crowd fund for you to shut up give me the details

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    its not as small fry as you assert.

    confidence is a major underlying factor in success.

    sometimes the stats can be awesome,sometimes a player can play a blinder , but that can be an outlying factor, its what he brings to the team...the fact a fullback doesn't vacate an area, the fact a midfielder checks himself before moving forward, the fact a keeper wont come off his line, the fact a Defensive partner will always be on the back foot....they are all massive factors.

    Sahko does look error prone, and im sure his colleagues 'allow' for it. in the heat of the moment, they aren't relying on historical statistics...its gut feeling.
     
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  12. Alex

    Alex since 2004

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    A couple of days ago there was a debate (in this thread or the player thread - not arsed to look for it) around Sakho doing good at palace because of the system CP uses.

    It got me thinking. What if VVD looks good because of soton's system? Lovren looked good in it too.
    Carroll looked good at newcastle
    Downing looked good at villa
    Benteke too

    might happen that VVD comes in and stops everything, wins all headers and tackles. Or he might also do a lovren
     
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2017
  13. Anfield rd Dreamer

    Anfield rd Dreamer Well-Known Member

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    That if Sakho can't prove his professionalism and is sold on by Klopp this summer we need to bring in a new CB. That player should be as good or better than Sakho. It's easier said than done as there are actually few attainable players for us that fit that description and they tend to be much more expensive than we'll be selling Sakho for. Add to that a new signing, no matter how good on paper, can always flop unexpectedly. Far too many seem keen on the idea of moving Sakho on (probably because they think he looks unconventional and don't rate him) without actually acknowledging how big a challenge it gives us.
     
  14. ILLOK

    ILLOK In the Danger Zone.

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    His Palace and France teammates seemingly don't care about how he 'looks'. Maybe Sakho himself was more hesitant because he had to play with the worst left back in the league?

    I don't remember Lovren being on the back foot when playing with Sakho and I don't remember Mignolet being dominant coming off his line when Sakho wasn't in the line up. And never missing a chance to stick the knife into the hapless idiot, Moreno vacated his area constantly.

    He's a very good player. Not world class, not our saviour, but very good nevertheless. Far better than Klavan and Lucas and imo better than Lovren.

    Klopp may well get rid of him (which I won't necessarily disagree with) but it's not a footballing decision. He's the 3rd best centre back at the club at the very least.
     
  15. Iluvatar

    Iluvatar Eru

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    We wanted VDV before he went to Southampton, probably similar to Mane in that we wanted to see them with more high level experience. There is a reason Chelsea and ?Utd want him as well as us.. Lovren was only wanted by us, tells,a different story?
     
  16. Soyasource

    Soyasource Member

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    An ideal situation would be a swap for Van Djik.
     
  17. Makati Red

    Makati Red Well-Known Member

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    My concern is VVD really that good or is it just the Southampton defensive system that make players better than they really are. They have lost both Fonte and VVD since January but they have really not missed them with the possible exception of the cup final.

    I am sure Southampton will sell but my question does he look better than he really is, ideally you want a defender who looks good from say Arsenal or Man City who are attacking teams and then you can see you good they really are.
     
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  18. Makati Red

    Makati Red Well-Known Member

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    Maybe we would have won the title with him in the team
     
  19. Makati Red

    Makati Red Well-Known Member

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    Both Sakho and Matip are light years ahead of Lovren, Sakho is easily one of the top two CBs at the club
     
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  20. i_still_miss_fowler

    i_still_miss_fowler Well-Known Member Moderator

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    That's not really an argument anfield road dreamer. There is an inherent risk in the game.

    By the same logic I could argue, can you guarantee me he won't miss significant time due to doping violations in future, or that he won't be injured for long periods like he was in 2015 or 2014. Even this season lets not forget if Klopp had wanted to play him at the start he couldn't because he was injured.

    Keeping him when you have an offer of 20-30m, with 4M wages is in it self a risk. Just as a new transfer may flop, Sakho's poor form of earlier seasons may return.

    If we are so risk averse that we have issues selling a player who will contribute nothing at all this season, and would be 3rd choice cb if he does stay then we will never progress as a club.

    My argument is quite simple. Given our problems we need a CB that improves our first 11 (in place of Lovren or Matip) Sakho is not that, no one argues he won't improve our depth, but for me that does not solve the critical problem at the heart of our defence.
     
  21. James H

    James H "I dunno, I just work here"

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    Anyone who actually believes that is naive at best.
     
  22. Iluvatar

    Iluvatar Eru

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    Spot on, we need to improve, not go sideways. Just like Lovren needs upgrading, Sakho is a similar level to him.
     
  23. Hope in your heart

    Hope in your heart Loyalty and patience, two undervalued concepts... Admin

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    VVD is overrated anyway. At least in this forum. Just like Lovren at the time... ;-)
     
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  24. James H

    James H "I dunno, I just work here"

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    VVD=Jesus
     
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  25. Kaliberbeats

    Kaliberbeats Well-Known Member

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    Couldn't agree more about Benteke. That's the perfect example of our flawed transfer policy. He's a player who on paper is world class. 20+ goals a season in a bad side. A player we bought based purely on his stats yet the world and his cousin knew he thrived on long balls and crosses into the box which has never been our game. There was a massive disconnect between who we were targetting and the style of football we play.
     
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  26. Scott Jones

    Scott Jones Well-Known Member

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    Not the Navas one though surely.lol
     
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  27. Hope in your heart

    Hope in your heart Loyalty and patience, two undervalued concepts... Admin

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    Haha, he's probably even better than that, as one would have to assume that Jesus wouldn't have been able to make a proper tackle or to be physically strong enough to compete against a strong and pacy striker.
     
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  28. Cologne-Liverpool

    Cologne-Liverpool Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, probably would have just turned the other cheek.
    Had the leadership abilities desperately needed in our squad though...;-)
     
  29. James H

    James H "I dunno, I just work here"

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    VVD=Jesus + Goliath?
     
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  30. Cologne-Liverpool

    Cologne-Liverpool Well-Known Member

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    When has Goliath ever won anything? Doesn't turn up in the big games, when it really counts, ,sucks against smaller opposition!
     

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