Virgil van Dijk (CB) Southampton

Discussion in 'Rumour Mill - Transfer Talk' started by Nikola, Apr 14, 2017.

  1. 1dragon

    1dragon TIA Regular

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    60M is still too high a price to pay for a defender. We are talking about a fee for a world class, one in a kind defender. While I cannot identify any similar defenders, I am sure our scouting department can.

    I am wishing at the moment that the scouts can pull a "Sami" out of the bag this time. An unknown, promising defender that can go on to become a stalwart in our defence. It has been some time since we got such a great deal.
     
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  2. lfc.eddie

    lfc.eddie "¿Plata... O Plomo?" Valued Member

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    Let's dissect reason behind your thinking of this being a bad comparison (although just for the record I used it as comparison because someone actually compared the players to "house and cars"/properties).

    You claimed that..
    1. You know exactly what you are getting for your money when you bought those cars. Need you to elaborate that bit though. If you are telling me about their performance based on the stats you read when they launched the car, then I agree with you. But after 15-20 years, things in the car do go off a bit. Wear and tear replacement may never be as perfect as it was coming out of the factory. These are also individually hand made cars, which also prone to some human error. Certain things will need tighten and fixing for it to perform to its optimum level. Now take that and apply it to the players. We know what they could do on the pitch with the previous clubs, hence why we are interested. But they may not perform as well as they used to be with their other outfit, so they need some adjustments and tweaks in their game for them to perform in their optimum level. Not the same as fixing and tuning them cars to make it perfect? For me it is mighty similar.

    2. Rare and expensive cars go on sale with limited numbers, probably hundreds. Great players available in the market is the same too. In fact if they are extremely great performer, there are only 1 or 2 of them in the world, in the case of Messi and Ronaldo. Players like Van Dijk and Salah can be akin to super cars or exotic cars because they are also rare, and players with similar ability is also not easily found in the market. You are right that we are the only one willing to pay for Van Dijk at the price quoted, but before hand there were two other buyers.

    Nothing in life is guaranteed. You may think that with footballers you could find someone better with half the price paid, which I do agree with you. But in recent history, our group of recruitment fellas do not seem to be able to pull off that sort of feat. Coutinho and Sturridge was an unwanted gem, much like a Shelby Cobra some farmer own, left it to rot in his garage. We found it, fixed it up and unleash it to the world. Ever since then we have not done too well in that department, mostly hit and miss, and I'd say more misses. More often than not, our haggling ended up us paying the sticker price anyways, here are some examples - 1. Suarez, weeks of negotiation, we ended up paying a couple of quid more than initial quoted price. 2. Lallana, weeks of seducing the player to encourage him to tell Southampton to let him go, we haggled, in the end, we parted with their asking price, and we didn't bother after that with Clyne and Lovren and also Mane. 3. Benteke, weeks after weeks of not wanting to pay his release fees, the fees that was stipulated in his contract which Villa was asking, in the end we paid the £32.5m that Villa wanted in the first place. History tells us we always cave when it comes to buyig players, so why bother puffing that chest? Just paid the fee and get on with our planning for the season to come.
     
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  3. legalalien

    legalalien The Tweetherder

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    Couldn't agree more. If we have the money then pay the initial asking price, otherwise some club that doesn't have penny-pinching as its guiding philosophy will swoop in and get the player who was our first choice. Leaving us to scramble to Plan B or decide to leave it until the next window. Salah could have been done and dusted by now if we hadn't come back to Roma with an offer that tried to take advantage of their position, instead of putting strengthening our playing position as the first priority. And i don't need to mention the first time we tried to buy Salah. Whoops! I just did.
     
  4. Dutch

    Dutch Active Member Valued Member

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    Did we not say we had no longer any intrest in VvD? :tongue:
     
  5. redfanman

    redfanman TIA Regular Valued Member

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    Could have been done and dusted, but do you know for certain the delay was due to penny pinching? And given the rise in costs of targets this summer isn't it better to avoid splurges were possible? After all our planning was probably around 25m for Brandt, a little more for Keita and 40-50m for VVD. Now we are faced with 50-60 for VVD or similar, 50m for Keita and Roma asking 35-40 for Salah...and we still have other spaces in the squad to bring in.
     
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  6. Kopstar

    Kopstar ★★★★★ Valued Member

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    Yep, maximising the price we get for those leaving and playing hardball on the price of those we want allows for another first team signing.

    Let's say we manage to get an extra £5m for Sakho, £3m for Markovic, £3m for Moreno (for example) by sticking to our guns and then negotiate a 'discount' of £5m for each of Salah, Keita, VVD...that's effectively another £26m that is then available that otherwise wouldn't be if we just went in and took the first offer for our players and immediately paid what the selling clubs first asked for. So play hardball and we also manage to add Oxlade-Chamberlain (for example) or become push-overs and yet again fail to properly address areas of the squad in need of strengthening.
     
  7. The Elusive 19th

    The Elusive 19th TIA Youth Team

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    Looks good advice on paper. But have we ever done that in the last decade? And do you have confidence on our folks to do it now suddenly on the incoming transfer? But have to agree - last summer we grew spine and stood our ground a bit on the outgoing transfer, which was a bit encouraging.
     
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  8. Kopstar

    Kopstar ★★★★★ Valued Member

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    Yes, we have. After asking whether we have ever done that in the last decade you seem to then answer your own question.

    Do I have confidence in us being able to do it on an incoming transfer? Yes.
     
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  9. GermanRed

    GermanRed Member

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    There are reports that Ryan Giggs could become the new Soton manager. I wonder what that does mean for VvD LFC
     
  10. LaurazRed

    LaurazRed The hopeful one

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    The only thing is if we do go back in for him, my worry is, we could end up with a blanket transfer ban.
     
  11. Kopstar

    Kopstar ★★★★★ Valued Member

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    That would be sheet. But it all depends on what they valet di'van at, duvet sell at £60m or not?
     
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  12. The Elusive 19th

    The Elusive 19th TIA Youth Team

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    It means that we can pick him up on cheap 20m when soton gets relegated this coming season.
     
  13. GermanRed

    GermanRed Member

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    Honestly it wouldn't surprise me if they fight for Relegation next season. 4 managers in 5 years could become very dangerous for them. In the last 4 years they always ended up 6-8th but for me they don't have many players that are good enough for the top half of the table.
     
  14. KillerBeeLFC

    KillerBeeLFC TIA Reserve Team

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    Not a chance giggs would sell him to us
     
  15. mattyhurst

    mattyhurst TIA Regular

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    I'd be more concerned on what that means for Southampton if I was their fans.
     
  16. redfanman

    redfanman TIA Regular Valued Member

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    I can't see Giggs getting the Southampton job. The board have appointed managers with experience and at the very least would want the same if they are selling the club.
     
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  17. eythor

    eythor New Member

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    Although I don't agree fully with your post, you make some excellent points.
     
  18. legalalien

    legalalien The Tweetherder

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    Well no, of course none of us know anything for certain, but I do get frustrated when I see the Manchester clubs simply paying the asking price and getting the deal done while we faff around seemingly trying to save 5 million here and there, when getting the player we're after could easily recoup that 5 million if the player contributes to a successful trophy winning team.

    Obviously the Manc clubs have apparently limitless funds, but it's not as if we're all that far behind this time around. We do appear to have a substantial amount to spend on players, thanks to the TV money and Jurgen and the owners understanding that a negative spend isn't going to win us the Premier League, and we're likely to raise a pretty sum through sales. So we can absorb these inflated prices.

    I don't know what the club's planning was but I would have thought that at least 50 million for VVD should have been expected given what City paid for Stones, and 25 mil for Brandt seems a bit on the low side given what we paid for Mane.

    Anyway, I'm sure I'll feel a lot better once Salah is doing the 'Lean'. Perhaps I'm just annoyed that Jurgen's birthday is just one day out from mine. Just one day earlier Jurgen and we could have gone for a bevvy together. But it was nice of him to send his birthday greetings. More than I did for him.
     
  19. Limiescouse

    Limiescouse Well-Known Member

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    Holding up the Manchester clubs as examples of a succesful approach to the transfer market seems a little blind to the fact they have both been utterly shit in the market for the past several years.
     
  20. Makati Red

    Makati Red Well-Known Member

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    This is pretty much dead in the water, time to move on before we lose our next targets
     
  21. liver1

    liver1 Well-Known Member

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    Its not as simple as paying the asking price as there isn't really an asking price.

    If I knew someone would pay it no matter what id raise it to £70million.

    If I wanted £50million for Van Dijk and you offered me £50million early on id ask for £60million+, irrespective of whether £50million is acceptable to me or not. The art of negotiation is to play against the other side, do not put all your cards on the table.

    On a side note, and im digressing on this, I remember listening on the radio to a top negotiator explaining how to negotiate be it corporate deals, hostage negotiations, buying a car, the key is not just to give the other side what it wants but to hold back, test the water, and use any leverage to get something you want.

    The example was a guy came to him asking about getting a good deal from a new employer, they offered him £70,000 for his services which was acceptable to him. But should he ask for more, could he ask for more, would asking for more look greedy and hurt his chances?They wanted him to start soon because they had a project , but he had a big holiday already paid for and booked due to go in the next few weeks, yet giving up that holiday was no big deal to him to get the job. But instead of just saying sure ill quit my holiday its no big deal, he was told to pretend it was a big deal to use it as leverage, knowing how important it was for the other side for him to start soon, and said if I give up this holiday its very inconvenient for me would you give me an increase in pay to compensate me, which for the company wasn't a problem.

    What was important to him, greater pay, wasnt important to the company and what wasnt important to him, that booked holiday, was important to the company, so he traded it to get a good deal.

    Long story short, you need to know whats important for the other side, not just whats acceptable to you, to get the best deal in any situation.
     
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2017
  22. KillerBeeLFC

    KillerBeeLFC TIA Reserve Team

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    How do you know the club hasnt moved on? You can finger more than one pie at a time you know?
     
  23. Keeno

    Keeno TIA New Signing

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    That's what she said.
     
  24. lfc.eddie

    lfc.eddie "¿Plata... O Plomo?" Valued Member

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    One of his alter ego in Manila is doing this - "Huh huh, you said...... "
     
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  25. ubermick

    ubermick Willing to drive Moreno to the airport Admin

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    "Manchester United have signed Virgil Van Dijk on a free transfer, along with Ryan Bertrand"
     
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  26. Makati Red

    Makati Red Well-Known Member

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  27. lfc.eddie

    lfc.eddie "¿Plata... O Plomo?" Valued Member

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    Don't think it would be a free transfer, they won't make it so blatant. Probably headline with something like this "Soton profited from a swaps with United, gaining 4 players, Rooney, Jones, Smalling and Carrick while sending Van Dijk and Bertrand the other way".
     
  28. SoftGerman

    SoftGerman Well-Known Member

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    Just checked the twitter thread full with hope and read that Andre Wisdom was sold. That's like unwrapping a christmas gift that's supposed to be a new ecxiting race bicycle and it turns out to be a note which says you just sold your old one for 50 pounds on ebay. Okay, even I start panicking. Poor Andre Wisdom.
     
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  29. redbj

    redbj hurry up, July 1st, let's get the show on the road

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    Agree, that would be like sleeping with your brothers wife
     
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  30. prest

    prest Member

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    A man has to have a code.
     
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