What would constitute a good summer?

Discussion in 'The Albert - LFC Talk' started by Zinedine Biscan, Feb 20, 2017.

  1. MikeOscar

    MikeOscar Klopp Klopp

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    A good summer would start with appointing a proper ceo, someone who can provide leadership off the pitch, taking some of the publicity burden and attention away from Klopp. Second requirement would be he has enough knowledge to provide guidance on the footballing side of the matter. He doesn't need to be an expert, but needs to know enough to be able to know when the real experts working for the club are fucking things up. Getting these qualities in would already be a good step.

    On the field I'll list my issues in order of importance:

    - Coutinho is a fantastic player, but does not offer enough goal threat for where he is playing in our system, especially if our main forward is Firmino. Eight goals last year, five so far this year, he's on an eleven game barren run. I'd love to see him integrated in our midfield, rather than our attack, where I feel he would be most effective. This would mean we don't need to buy any midfielders, but it does lead into my next point...

    - We've all seen the impact Mane has made. What we need is more of that; Genuine pace and goal threat from out wide. One for the left flank for Coutinho's spot, one as a rotation/back up option. We're far too one paced without such an attacking threat.

    - Central defence: Question marks over both our two main centrebacks for me. Both seem injury prone. Lovren I'm still not fully convinced about if he's the required quality. Matip started like a train but got injured, came back in an unsettled defence and looked a lot less imperious. Hard to say right now how good he really is. Collectively our defence has been nowhere near good enough this season and we need to fix this with some priority. Shipping two goals or more against Swansea, Hull and Burnley is simply unacceptable.

    - Goalkeepers: Is the defence making the keepers look worse than they are, or are the dodgy goalies unsettling the defence? It's probably a bit of both. Mignolet is not good enough. Karius may or may not be good enough, all we can right now is he's had a terrible start. We cannot let this fester for another season. A hard and potentially unfair choice must be made this summer - at least one of them will have to be shipped out and that goalkeeper will feel hard done by. But we've had massive goalkeeping issues since the decline of Reina, probably from 2010 onwards. We got to stop fucking about and sort it out, the position is far too important to just ignore.

    - Finally we've got the centre forward position. Listen, I see what Firmino offers. He does a hell of a lot of work to make our system function and in a certain way he's neigh on irreplaceable. He's a very important player for us. But with almost threequarters of the season gone, he's only scored 8 goals for us. That is an issue. I also feel that while he's often amazing against good teams who want to play football themselves, he's a lot less effective against the hoofdball teams. After all it's hard to press when the ball is getting launched towards Mars. Ideally I'd like to see another forward being brought in (or developed in Origi's case - such a shame he has regressed this season) who can play along side him or instead of him against the dross. Sometimes you just simply need some physicality in there to make something happen. I certainly don't want us to replace Firmino, but I'd like us to complement him in some way. If Origi can be that player, fantastic! Last year I was sure he would be, but this season has just been so disappointing in the regard.

    We've seen this season that when all our players are on form, player their A-game that we're probably the best team in the league. The trouble is our system is so demanding and complex that as soon as the players form wavers just a little (as is natural throughout the season), the entire system collapses to a large degree. Healthy rotation, to keep players fresh, on their toes and to simply play the in form player would seem the solution. But for midfield and attack combined we've had one useful sub this season: Emre Can. Even he is tremendously controversial and with reason - many of his performances have been subpar. We need to solve this next season by adding some true strength in depth in midfield and the forward positions. Unlike other seasons when you'd look ahead to the summer, I do feel we have the makings of a good team here. We've already got a very good (but not great) first eleven. What we need to add is some genuine depth and competition for places.
     
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  2. ptt

    ptt Mane I'm excited for this season

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    I'd like to never see Mig, Lucas and Lovren in a Liverpool shirt again. If they're moved on and replaced with proper tallent, not tomorrow's nor 3 season's hence, all the better. Sadly Ings has to go, too seriously injury prone. I would like to see a fully continuously fit DS playing for us next season but it won't happen so I'm sad to say that he should go too. World class replacement is critical to our long term success. Break the bank and sign a boss striker who fits Klopp's system with a young promising understudy.

    There's a great summer.
     
  3. legalalien

    legalalien The Tweetherder

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    A good summer would be buying three or four players who are not "ones for the future" but who have proved themselves already by excelling in one of Euope's top leagues. We all know which positions need to be taken care of so I won't bother reeling off that list again, but if the only forward we buy is, for example, Solanke, and the only left back is Chilwell, then I would not be happy. The more prospects we buy when our competitors are buying the finished, or almost finished, article, then the further we slip behind them.

    To be honest, I'm kind of pessimistic about us having a good summer. I think Klopp favors buying talented youngsters and we're for yet another period of rebuilding.
     
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  4. Anfield rd Dreamer

    Anfield rd Dreamer Well-Known Member

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    I think we can expect that. Last summer we brought in 3 that had immediate impact in Mane, Matip and Wjnaldum. If we brought in 3 comparable players for some of our needs this summer that'd be great. Add another such as Karius who hasn't immediately but may still get there, a talented young future talent such as Grujic and two older senior cover players like Klavan and Manninger and I'd be ecstatic! I think that's believable level of activity.
     
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  5. RedForever2014

    RedForever2014 Well-Known Member

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    We definitely need to upgrade the keeper, a centre back and left back. That's the bare minimum.

    In reality we need a DM, that would help us churn out results when our offense is off colour.

    A big time striker, like United have even though he is 35, helps you win things.

    Anyone remember Rush in 86, Owen in 2001?

    A left sided Mane style AM would be the icing on the cake, but until the defence is better, the midfield protects it better and we have a quality striker who delivers when it matters, we will win nothing.
     
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  6. lfc.8

    lfc.8 Well-Known Member

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    A good summer would be four top players who can walk straight into the first eleven. We have gaps right throughout the team and while we have greater needs than just four new players, anything less and I'm not so sure it will do.

    Areas of focus would be centre back, left back, a midfielder and a forward. Goalkeeping situation remains a concern but perhaps Karius can show some form here and be given another chance before the season ends. If not add a goalkeeper to the list.

    I have doubts however over the club doing whats required. Certainly a wait and see.
     
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  7. steveee

    steveee TIA Reserve Team

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    a good summer would be
    sell lucas, sturridge,and mignolet no matter what at all cost
    sell
    Lovren, Milner, and Can

    bring back sakho

    bring in the following in
    Virgil van Dijk
    Lacazette
    Julian Brandt


    bring a LB, DM, and Keeper..
    Karius can start... I don't care if you do everything else.. I think he will be better than migs at least some day for sure

    ok that would be a great summer but yeah
     
  8. mattyhurst

    mattyhurst TIA Regular

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    Signing some players that actually play in the positions they are supposed to play in.
     
  9. NickF

    NickF Well-Known Member

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    I'm not Lovrens biggest fan but when him and Matip have started together we've never been beat
     
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  10. ptt

    ptt Mane I'm excited for this season

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    He's still shit.
     
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  11. NickF

    NickF Well-Known Member

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    He'd be alright playing the role as first replacement if one of our CBs are injured but not as first choice
     
  12. Daniel Galloway

    Daniel Galloway New Member

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    Atletico Madrid have 2 great keepers both above our current standard. Why not take a shot because they have the potential to bring quality and a winning mentality, both much needed.
     
  13. Jase

    Jase Well-Known Member

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    My dream summer would start with FSG selling up to someone who would see the club as a status symbol rather than an investment opportunity.
     
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  14. redbj

    redbj crowd fund for you to shut up give me the details

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    dunno....Lovren needs games to play even just OK.

    its one of the hardest roles, back up Centre back, because basically, that role is the biggest one on the park where you need a true understanding with your playing partner.

    from memory even Rafa...(pauses, heart flutters)...... struggled to want to rotate there....
     
  15. Iluvatar

    Iluvatar Eru

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    The Key to a good summer is starting fast and early, we have our new management structure in place, so it should be already well underway with what is going to be a major squad re-mould.

    1) Say thank you and goodbye to Achterberg, whilst certainly not the main problem, this guy has overseen the regression over 4 goalkeepers at least during his time here. We need to be the best we can be and he most certainly isn't. It would be pointless bringing in another keeper if we don't remove the root cause of the keeper issues.

    2) Announce the stadium expansion, in whichever form is the best for bringing in general admission tickets.

    3) Sell the following players;

    Lucas (5mil) - His time has come, nice guy, but we have far too many average nice guys.
    Moreno (10mil) - Brainless and not improved one iota since arriving.
    Can (10mil) - Just not good enough, not agile enough and certainly not at a level of the demands he is making for a new contract.
    Sturridge (30mil) - His heart isn't in it, his body is completely shot and I doubt he will ever trust it here again.. Wherever he goes I'm sure he will be brilliant, but his ship with us has sailed.
    Mignolet (15mil) - Just not good enough, a few decent performances dotted around complete abysmal ones. Your team's confidence starts with a solid keeper, he gives the defence that security which ours never has.
    Markovic (15mil) - No bottle at all, when we need fighters he is a wet blanket.
    Sakho (20mil) - His ship has sailed, he broke club rules too many times, if Klopp allowed him back it would completely undermine himself.

    Plus the fringe - Wisdom, Bogdan, Randall, Jones, Dunn etc.

    About 110mil from player sales.

    4) Give the following chances in pre-season, if they impress promote, if they show enough promise get them EPL loans, if not sell them on;

    Wilson
    Ojo
    Kent
    Ward
    Fulton
    Branagan

    5) Buy one of the following options (note the key here is buying players with a never say die attitude, a will to win at all costs.)

    GK - Oblak or Donnarumma (30mil or so)
    LB - Kolasinac or Tierney (Free or 15mil)
    CB - Gimenez or Romangoli (30mil +)
    CM - Nainggolan or Allan (30mil +)
    CF - Icardi (40mil)
    WF - Mbappe (40mil) or Brandt (2nd choice) (20mil)

    Total spent - 185mil

    So net - 75mil....

    Do that and we will challenge for the league.
     
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  16. redfanman

    redfanman TIA Regular Valued Member

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    Naingolan will not be coming here. Turned us and Chelsea down previously. Don't see what we could offer to change his mind.
     
  17. SirBillShankly

    SirBillShankly Joe and Holly's dad

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    A serious cull and a major influx of quality players.
     
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  18. Iluvatar

    Iluvatar Eru

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    Find the next one then.. I really like Allan at Napoli, bit like a midfield version of Suarez.
     
  19. Anfield rd Dreamer

    Anfield rd Dreamer Well-Known Member

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    I'd really like to see us able to produce some tactical flexibility whilst also being able to have players able to cover our "plan A" which I think falls down whenever we don't have our first choice 11 available (including Karius as Mignolet stays too deep when he plays dragging the defence back, stretching the midfield and attack instead of compressing the pitch).

    Due to that I think we need to bring in;
    GK who is experienced at top level to offer older support/mentoring to Karius.
    CB to challenge Lovren and Matip.
    LB so Milner can challenge both FB slots along with Clyne.
    CM who can play holding role like Henderson and Box to Box like Wjnaldum.
    Winger who can play like Mane on both flanks.
    Attacking midfield playmaker who can play tucked in on one side like Coutinho and as a false 9 like Firmino.

    On top of this we need an out and out defensive midfielder and a traditional number 9 or two so we can play other team shapes.

    Just to throw some semi realistic names out for the kind of players I think we need;

    GK: Muslera, CB: Sakho (if he shows professionalism till summer), LB: Kolasinic, CM: Keita, Winger: Promes, False 9/Playmaker: Pulisic. DM: Carvalho. Forward: Mbappe/Dembele (Celtic) as one and keep Origi as the other.

    Think for 25 man senior squad that'd be;

    Home grown; Ward, Flanagan, Clyne, Milner, Henderson, Stewart, Lallana, Ings.

    Foriegn: Muslera, Karius, Lovren, Sakho, Matip, Klavan, Kolasinic, Carvalho, Keita, Wjnaldum, Coutinho, Pulisic, Mane, Promes, Dembele/Mbappe, Origi, Firmino.
     
  20. ubermick

    ubermick Willing to drive Moreno to the airport Admin

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    This summer, I'm tired of the faffing about. Three world class players. Not one, not two, but three. A top wide player, a legitimate goal threat, a top destroyer that can either play CB or CM. Add in a couple of other quality players (GK and LB) and we're sorted.

    - Süle
    - Lacazette
    - Reus
    - Timo Horn (The German goalkeeper we SHOULD have gotten)
    - A left back that isn't Moreno. (I actually wouldn't mind Luke Shaw, since we like former Southampton players...)

    Doubt there'd be much change out of £125m for those five, but those five would make a fucking difference.

    Meanwhile bring Sakho back into the fold. Sell off Moreno, Mignolet, Can, and Sturridge. If they dither about leaving, as players have done in the past, take them behind the sheds at Melwood and beat them with a hose until they go.

    That to me would constitute a good summer. Not another eight or nine players brought in for overpriced fees that have question marks all over them. Oh, and some fucking Champions League football to look forward to would be nice.

    Time for the owners, the board, and the manager to step the fuck up and stop playing silly buggers.
     
  21. Kopstar

    Kopstar ★★★★★ Valued Member

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    I've done some YouTube scouting (I know, I know) and if we want a German goalkeeper we should go for this guy



    Sule's joining Bayern so he's out unfortunately. Can't see us getting Shaw unless United feel like they've fleeced us.
     
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  22. ubermick

    ubermick Willing to drive Moreno to the airport Admin

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    Ah bugger, forgot about that. Maybe we can go to them on bended knee and have him on loan, or see about nicking Javi Martinez.
     
  23. Kopstar

    Kopstar ★★★★★ Valued Member

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    That would be sensational - one of my favourite players. Alternatively, maybe Jerome Boateng's going spare with Sule's arrival and Benatia returning from his loan spell? I presume Badstuber wouldn't be an option due to his injury record.
     
  24. ubermick

    ubermick Willing to drive Moreno to the airport Admin

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    Martinez would be a tremendous pickup actually, better fit for what we need than Süle. THAT guy is the midfielder you want to press into the back when needed. And when our back line is fit and playing well, an outstanding option to play behind Wijnaldum and Lallana.
     
  25. legalalien

    legalalien The Tweetherder

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    @Anfield rd Dreamer suggested buying an experienced goalie as to act as a mentor for Karius. It's possible that that is on the cards as it would explain the recent rumours claiming we are interested in Dortmund's 36 year old Roman Weidenfeller. Of course we already have an aging German goalie but maybe he'll be moving on or moving up to replace Achterberg. Personally I think we should sell Mignolet, have Karius as no.1 with Ward as back up. Klopp brought Karius in and he should stand by him and not ditch him after one season.

    As for LB, I would also go for Luke Shaw. Maybe now Utd are in the post-Ferguson era there's more chance of them selling to us. If that's not possible, then what about Aaron Cresswell? He may not be world class but he is a Red and we need more of them in the team.

    As for the rest, 2 CMs with one being an experienced player, a CF (Lacazette?), at least one winger. Oh, nearly forgot. Think we need a center back. A leader, a warrior and one who can play football. Who is that? I don't know, but I do know that it's not Sakho. Taking him back would completely undermine Klopp's authority.

    The sell list:
    Mignolet
    Moreno
    Lucas
    Klavan
    Stewart
    Can
    Sturridge
    Ings
    Plus assorted 'reserves' who are never going to make it with us.
     
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  26. redfanman

    redfanman TIA Regular Valued Member

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    Was it Jerome Boateng who was talking up Klopp a month or so ago? There seemed to be a couple of players including Hummels, who were dropping comments about him and Liverpool around the same time.
     
  27. redfanman

    redfanman TIA Regular Valued Member

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    It was probably @Anfield rd Dreamer who started those rumours when he suggested Weidenfeller without realising he had already played for Klopp at Dortmund. If the boss has faith in Karius, then it is a signing that could make a lot of sense. lol

    However, Joyce seemed certain we were aiming to sign players this summer who would be recognised as fairly significant signings by fans. If true, perhaps signing a top goalie is financially easier to do than a top forward as the price for the former would be relatively expensive for keepers, but not for players overall.

    Of course, Joyce may be wrong, or we may struggle to get the players we thought we could get, or our vision of significant players could be players like Keite & Dortmund's Dembele who Klopp tried signing last year.

    Sakho could come back if he has shown to Klopp that he understands he has done wrong and wants to make things right. But, i guess it is more likely that Sakho will leave in the summer.
     
  28. Anfield rd Dreamer

    Anfield rd Dreamer Well-Known Member

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    lol in my defence I knew Weidenfeller played for Klopp and that, along with him being a free agent and kind of right playing style and experience, was why I was suggesting him lol.
     
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  29. Sound as a Pound

    Sound as a Pound TIA Midfield General

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    Just throwing this out there - not on the top of the priority list - but if a decent bid came in for Clyne - I'd consider it - he has been poor for 12mths now - distribution has been crap too.
     
  30. Arminius

    Arminius FSG PR plant Moderator

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    In the current market, I am not sure you could get four of those players with 125M - both Reus and Lacazette have had offers turned down for around a 1/3rd of that amount.
     
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