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Anfield Atmosphere Discussion

Never Say Never

FSG are the iluminati
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Did this 'expert' look like he was in his late 40s?

Did he go to games in the 80s/90s with his mates and ask them how old they were and then, 24 years later, ask his same mates how old they were now?

"Yeah, well, me and me mates all went to games in the 80s/90s and we were in our mid twenties. Now look at us...we're all nearly 50. There's your evidence!"

It's twofold...tickets have become too expensive and fans are holding on to their season tickets for too long.

[I ought to add that this is another problem with having a long waiting list for season tickets. You probably only sign up once you can afford one but by the time you've reached the top you're fucking old!]
The Green Bay packers have a crazy long wait list (generations) and they have a pretty great atmosphere. Nfl teams seem to find a way to have good atmosphere, long waits for season tickets, and expensive tickets.
 

lfc.eddie

"¿Plata... O Plomo?"
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The Green Bay packers have a crazy long wait list (generations) and they have a pretty great atmosphere. Nfl teams seem to find a way to have good atmosphere, long waits for season tickets, and expensive tickets.
Aren't they one of the fans owned "franchise"?
 

Flobs

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The Green Bay packers have a crazy long wait list (generations) and they have a pretty great atmosphere. Nfl teams seem to find a way to have good atmosphere, long waits for season tickets, and expensive tickets.
All that happens in the NFL is that the fans chant 'DEFENSE' when defending so that the offense can't hear the calls. Not at all the same kettle of fish.
 

Herb

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Couldn't hear fuck all from the away fans today. And considering how quiet us lot were it was pretty embarrassing from them.

And I wish people in the Anfield Road end half way down who have good views wouldn't constantly stand up and ruin it for people behind. Created loads of animosity and frustration tonight, not least for my 4ft nothing mrs.
 

Flobs

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Couldn't hear fuck all from the away fans today. And considering how quiet us lot were it was pretty embarrassing from them.

And I wish people in the Anfield Road end half way down who have good views wouldn't constantly stand up and ruin it for people behind. Created loads of animosity and frustration tonight, not least for my 4ft nothing mrs.
Put her on your shoulders!
 

SupaLFC96

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@Rambler. There's your average age argument right there..... other than the players, you could count the number of under 40 fans in that shot.
It is quite embarrassing really. We were leading and the fans just sit there. I'm like make some noise, act a fool. Something.
 

Flobs

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I have been criticising ticket allocation for awhile now. I will now put forward something that I think is very important when it comes to ticket allocation. Supporters clubs must be involved with ticket allocation, they need to have a degree of control so that they can get groups of a few thousand supporters together in one section of the stadium. I am aware that the club and many supporters clubs are not on good terms, this for me is outrageous, no club should go down this route. The club must be held to account over this, communication for a club is not a option it is an obligation. Poor relations between club and supporters can only be down to poor day to day management. Supporters should be taken seriously.
In France clubs have different schemes to involve supporters and large supporters clubs get some say over ticket allocation. I am not asking the club to go as far as L'OM did giving one supporters club full controll of tickets for one end and another the other end of the stadium (which ended in complete chaos or unsavory tensions) but some degree of 'sharing' has got to be looked into.
Before anyone starts trying to shoot me down 1) what would you propose? 2)look at the atmosphere at Anfield, there's more noise at an F'ing tennis match? 3)answer me why the club has such poor relations with supporters clubs!
 

liver1

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@Rambler. There's your average age argument right there..... other than the players, you could count the number of under 40 fans in that shot.
Therein lies a big part of the problem. There are 28,000 Season ticket holders, and the turnover rate is apparently about 150 a year.

The average age of premier league season ticket holder is now 41.

A survey was done a few years ago from Manu and apparently the average age of a fan in the stretford end at old trafford in 1968 was 17 today its over 40.

In Germany to counter this, apparently Hamburg members over 35 are forced to join the seniors department. The club forbids more than half the tickets being sold to season ticket holders because it results in the fanbase in the stadium getting older and older. The average age of a supporter in Germany is in the low 20's and tickets can be bought for £17.

The problem isnt the out of towners and day trippers. Its actually the exact opposite. There isnt enough new blood going through the conveyor belt.

Lets say a typical fan and 3 friends fancy buying ticket for a game like you would for a concert - how would you go about it? Its almost impossible. The ticketing system is a mess.

Batches of tickets get sold on certain dates in advance for the rest of the year. You also have to join to become a member, who get priority , and then those members who attend x amount of games get further priority.

Quite frankly the likelihood of anyone just buying a ticket with some mates, and turning up for a game is zero.

Anfield is a private members club now and the age of those members is getting old.
 

lfc.eddie

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@liver1, I can see the rationale behind having membership system and offer them first right of refusal and I can also see the bad side of it too. Like you said, the bad side of it is the average age of people attending the games. You don't get those new and excited groups flooding the stadium, I hear you there. But at the same time you need a fixed revenue stream to know exactly how much you could earn when you do forecasting for each financial year. That way, you can then workout a budget for transfer and wage bill.

Now the difference between the Barcelona, Dortmund, type of membership and ours are the owners. Dortmund and Barcelona (and quite a number of clubs in Germany) are all owned by that group of members, the fans are the owners. So for those who have invested should definitely get a priority to purchase the tickets as these owners do not gain any yield in their investment. No dividends given out each year and all profit is being ploughed back into the club to fund for whatever is needed. So joining a member is like buying a share of the club, and that entitles them to get first right of refusal when tickets go out on sale is alright by me.

Yes - I am advocating fans ownership again.... ;-)

The other part is sitting vs standing. I think you can create a more festive environment when you are standing up, than sitting down. Sitting down, singing and swaying your body side to side, is like watching a boy band or gospel group concert. I think safe standing should be introduced in certain section of the stadium, that way it also control the age group that could go into that section.
 

Flobs

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@liver1The other part is sitting vs standing. I think you can create a more festive environment when you are standing up, than sitting down. Sitting down, singing and swaying your body side to side, is like watching a boy band or gospel group concert. I think safe standing should be introduced in certain section of the stadium, that way it also control the age group that could go into that section.
Sitting does change things however it has been around a while now. In all seated stadiums the emphasis changes to more singing than chanting, more clapping (even stamping feet when things are getting exciting) with la la lars. This is where it's for the fans to change and make an effort use a bit of imagination.
What we are appear to be seeing at Anfield is the loss of the traditional clanning amongst supporters either we completely change our culture or we go back a step to allow the clans to reform to an extent.
 

DEVGRU

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I want solutions now..I want action. I want fresh ideas from fresh people...
 

Mascot88

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There are people in Anfield who want to sing. But it is very hard to do so surrounded by 100 strangers who are all showing no interest. It's a miracle any songs happen at all.
 

Arminius

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All that happens in the NFL is that the fans chant 'DEFENSE' when defending so that the offense can't hear the calls. Not at all the same kettle of fish.
While I agree that traditional English supporter culture is a lot more dynamic and downright interesting than the average NFL crowd, nonetheless the example you cite (not the only noise, but anyway) is a large crowd getting involved in the game and en masse trying to create an advantage for their team. It may not be a song, but at Anfield right now we are not even hearing that.
 

ptt

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There are people in Anfield who want to sing. But it is very hard to do so surrounded by 100 strangers who are all showing no interest. It's a miracle any songs happen at all.
Strangers? Never stopped our fans in the past?
 

Flobs

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While I agree that traditional English supporter culture is a lot more dynamic and downright interesting than the average NFL crowd, nonetheless the example you cite (not the only noise, but anyway) is a large crowd getting involved in the game and en masse trying to create an advantage for their team. It may not be a song, but at Anfield right now we are not even hearing that.
Yes! anfield can't even come out with 'Com on Liverpool/you reds' which is for me the minimum at a match of football.
 

Billy Stevo's left boot

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Therein lies a big part of the problem. There are 28,000 Season ticket holders, and the turnover rate is apparently about 150 a year.

The average age of premier league season ticket holder is now 41.

A survey was done a few years ago from Manu and apparently the average age of a fan in the stretford end at old trafford in 1968 was 17 today its over 40.

In Germany to counter this, apparently Hamburg members over 35 are forced to join the seniors department. The club forbids more than half the tickets being sold to season ticket holders because it results in the fanbase in the stadium getting older and older. The average age of a supporter in Germany is in the low 20's and tickets can be bought for £17.

The problem isnt the out of towners and day trippers. Its actually the exact opposite. There isnt enough new blood going through the conveyor belt.

Lets say a typical fan and 3 friends fancy buying ticket for a game like you would for a concert - how would you go about it? Its almost impossible. The ticketing system is a mess.

Batches of tickets get sold on certain dates in advance for the rest of the year. You also have to join to become a member, who get priority , and then those members who attend x amount of games get further priority.

Quite frankly the likelihood of anyone just buying a ticket with some mates, and turning up for a game is zero.

Anfield is a private members club now and the age of those members is getting old.
Yep, Anfield looks like the Darby and Joan club these days, half the crowd look like they are settling down to watch an episode of Coronation Street not a football game, in fact they probably get more animated watching Corrie than they do the match.
There have been some truly embaressing moments recently at Anfield non moreso than when Jurgen was unveiled to the crowd against Rubin, after all the hype and meltdown on social media over his appointment he must have been stuffing cotton wool in his ears in the tunnel expecting the roof to come off Anfield but when he finally did emerge he was greeted by a polite round of applause. I actually knew what was coming and was trying to prepare myself mentally for an embaressing moment but even so I actually felt my @rse cheeks clench I was cringing that much, it really was awful, even I didn't expect his welcome to be that pathetic.
Seriously Billy Bremner and the rest of the Leeds team got ten times that applause when they won the title at Anfield and they were our heated rivals at the time.
Most fans look forward to transfer windows but I dread them, I just dread having to listen to new signings waffle on about our fans and our great atmosphere and all that, even worse is when they get asked after their first game what it was like to experience the wonderful Anfield atmosphere for the first time etc.
Awful.
 

POOL4EVER

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Just had a thought on this subject. Don't know if it's been done before but as an idea to get a flavour of the ages of the posters on this forum how about the mods setting up an age poll ie 10-15, 16-20, 21-25 and so on. We can post our ages (anonymously) but then we could extend this and explore how many go to games etc ?

I don't live in the area and only manage to get to games 2/3 times a year but sing when I'm there and don't leave early so consider myself a "good" fan but I would be interested in others posters circumstances. I'm 53 and have supported Liverpool since I was about 18 ( being Welsh I idolised Ian Rush ) but as a matter of interest would any posters here over the age of say 40 willingly give up their ticket to a youngster say 18 who would sing at a game ?

If we reduce prices to get youngsters in then I'm pretty sure that "older" supporters would try and buy them and after all we Asia club would be losing revenue so it's not a easy problem to solve.

After all we sit in front of our PCs and iPads etc and make sweeping assumptions on others etc but coming up with answers is not easy and I don't think this is a Liverpool problem it's a football l problem - yes Leicesters ground is jumping but look at the season they are having they are living the dream at the moment but wood this be the same if they were bottom 3 ?
 

liver1

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Probably Crystal Palace is one of the liveliest grounds in the premier league right now, along with the likes of Leicester and West Brom. Look at the age of the fans.




Now Anfield.



There is for sure a major difference in average age. Even the Kop is getting old:

 

Semmy

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Tell me if I am wrong, but when was the last time Anfield had less than 95% of seats filled?

Local Vancouver MLS team has a livelier support section than the Kop these days. Same with Seattle and Portland.

I went to Seattle with a Liverpudlian last month to watch Gerrard play, and we were bogh shocked how good the atmosphere was.

I am 100% certain the scousers will scoff at MLS. Inferior league and uneducated fans and blah blah blah.

Sorry boys and girls but if you don't do something to change what is happening at Anfield then you have nothing to complain about

If you aren't part of the solution, you are part of the problem
 

Arminius

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Tell me if I am wrong, but when was the last time Anfield had less than 95% of seats filled?

Local Vancouver MLS team has a livelier support section than the Kop these days. Same with Seattle and Portland.

I went to Seattle with a Liverpudlian last month to watch Gerrard play, and we were bogh shocked how good the atmosphere was.

I am 100% certain the scousers will scoff at MLS. Inferior league and uneducated fans and blah blah blah.

Sorry boys and girls but if you don't do something to change what is happening at Anfield then you have nothing to complain about

If you aren't part of the solution, you are part of the problem
In the league, I think it was Bournemouth at the end of October, 92% capacity, Bordeaux was also below 95%. However, 95% attendance may be shooting high, given away team reserved seating.
 

redyukka

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So that was YOU!?!
Hah yeah you got me!

Seriously though, I've never sat in the Kop, only Centenary and main stand. Chants like the Torres or Garcia chants stand out and obviously the Stevie G chant. But alot of people sit watching intently and clapping good play, cheering when the our guys get the ball and make positive movement towards the goal. They clap the opposition as well. A really respectful family of fans.

What doesn't happen is a constant dirge of noise and chanting like the away fans bring and it's been like that for years. I watched us beat hull 6-1 and the Hull fans are chanting that we weren't singing even if we were winning. But then our away support is amazing every time as well. What we are missing is some recent success for us to get singing about rather than (great) songs about older players and old achievements. It's tough.

If I had to suggest one thing the owners could do, it would be to create singing sections of like-minded fans in each of the 4 stands. They can try to outsing each other all match. Just give them cheap beer and priority queuing in the bar :)

YNWA
 
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RedSeven

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5,963
High ticket prices,leading to an older average age of fans within the ground is ruining the atmosphere at Anfield.

Too many older lads sitting on their hands instead of jumping up from their seat and cheering the team on,either that or they have just being going so long and so often that they have become complacent,set in their ways and couldn't be bothered anymore unless something exciting or controversial happens.

Whichever reason,we need to get involved or make it possible for younger fans to get in so they can get actively involved in the games by supporting the team and encouraging them by screaming,shouting and cheering from start to finish.
 

Billy Biskix

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Anyone thinking we're going to return to the days of the Kop 'sucking the ball into the net' etc is dreaming. It's not just Liverpool that's changed, football has changed and the whole match-going demographic is completely different.

I don't think you prove yourself as a supporter by knowing all the words to 'Poor Scouser Tommy' or by waving a giant flag anyway. I think you prove it by getting behind the team when it's struggling rather than getting on its back or walking out. I think that's the big difference between now and years ago. The crowds are much bigger now than they were in the 80s, for instance. I regularly went to games where there were barely 30,000 in the ground and the atmosphere could be fairly flat, especially as most of the time we were winning games easily. But if we ever went behind it added an edge to the atmosphere. It was like a rage within the crowd if we were losing but it was never directed at the team. It was directed at the opposition and the referee. By putting them under pressure the hope was they'd crack and they frequently did. It's at times like that where 'atmosphere' matters and can make a real difference.

Now, the home crowd make the team edgy. The moans and groans over a misplaced pass increase when we're struggling. The frustration is aimed at our players, not the opposition or the match officials. Or worst of all, people give up completely and walk out thinking it's not our day and there's nothing they can do. I think that's what Klopp was getting at with his comments. No one is realistically expecting a wall of noise for 90 minutes and it's easy to sing when you're winning anyway. It's when we're up against it that the support really needs to kick in.