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Anfield Expansion - Main Stand and potential Anfield Road End



andyclegs

Andy C Legs
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Aug 22, 2019
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180
Whatever we do, we have got to compete with Spurs and Arsenal and Man City for that matter - the sooner the better. There are just thousands of fans itching to get a seat at Anfield - that should be enough incentive for the club and lets be FSG have already constructed that new awesome, dwarfing new stand so investing in the ground...
 

legalalien

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What I would like to see is not just re-development of ARD, but also what is still, in effect, the Kemlyn Road stand, i.e. the Centenary or Kenny Dalglish stand for those of fewer years.

Despite the money that's been spent there over the years, the seating in the lower tier is the same as it was when it was the Kemlyn Road which means there is negligible leg room. Even the upper tier is no different. So, my pipe dream is both ARD and the Sir Kenny stand get raised to the ground and replaced with a L-shaped three-tier stand with better seating which should take our capacity into the mid-sixties, and I don't mean 1965.

Another part of this pipe dream is the new ARD having safe-standing across the whole of the bottom tier and the Kop enlarged also with safe standing. I don't think safe standing would do much for the capacity, as it would have to revert to seating for European games, but it would do lot for the atmosphere and make it cheaper for younger fans to go to the match.
 

Red_Jedi

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What I would like to see is not just re-development of ARD, but also what is still, in effect, the Kemlyn Road stand, i.e. the Centenary or Kenny Dalglish stand for those of fewer years.

Despite the money that's been spent there over the years, the seating in the lower tier is the same as it was when it was the Kemlyn Road which means there is negligible leg room. Even the upper tier is no different. So, my pipe dream is both ARD and the Sir Kenny stand get raised to the ground and replaced with a L-shaped three-tier stand with better seating which should take our capacity into the mid-sixties, and I don't mean 1965.

Another part of this pipe dream is the new ARD having safe-standing across the whole of the bottom tier and the Kop enlarged also with safe standing. I don't think safe standing would do much for the capacity, as it would have to revert to seating for European games, but it would do lot for the atmosphere and make it cheaper for younger fans to go to the match.
For the Kenny stand to go higher, it needs go further back - and that’s the 1st obstacle - there’s no space! There’s also the light issue for residents living behind. Same with kop.

Lovely idea, but practically almost impossible. What they managed to do with the main stand is outstanding but needed rows of homes demolished!

Annie Rd has no such issues... it backs on to the park. But it’s great that these discussions are taking place and the owners know they could add another 10k seats and they would sell out!
 

Iluvatar

Allez (x6)
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I think they will go to 62k, if you imagine the original plan was to add 4K to go to 58k, if you add another 4K to that (a 100% increase from the original - a huge number) you get 62k. There will be a point you can’t go much higher due to line of sight etc.

I wonder if its also helped that Everton are moving, so the transport strain is lessened somewhat?
 



Zoran

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I think they will go to 62k, if you imagine the original plan was to add 4K to go to 58k, if you add another 4K to that (a 100% increase from the original - a huge number) you get 62k. There will be a point you can’t go much higher due to line of sight etc.

I wonder if its also helped that Everton are moving, so the transport strain is lessened somewhat?
Maybe we're looking to overpass Spurs? They're at 62,062 I think. Next would be West Ham at 66k, not sure if that one is possible.
 

Iluvatar

Allez (x6)
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Aren’t the fixtures already organised so that us and the Ev aren’t both at home on the same day?
You are right, forgot about that. Although hasn't the council helped out Everton? They may have relax'd their "restrictions" on us, or may even work with us to improve transport infrastructure around Anfield etc.
 

legalalien

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For the Kenny stand to go higher, it needs go further back - and that’s the 1st obstacle - there’s no space! There’s also the light issue for residents living behind. Same with kop.

Lovely idea, but practically almost impossible. What they managed to do with the main stand is outstanding but needed rows of homes demolished!

Annie Rd has no such issues... it backs on to the park. But it’s great that these discussions are taking place and the owners know they could add another 10k seats and they would sell out!
I know you're right but money does talk and the residents would be compensated. But it would take years to acquire all the properties so we'll have to settle for what's on offer in the here and now.

The Kop could be enlarged though if WBR is redirected.
 



Iluvatar

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Maybe we're looking to overpass Spurs? They're at 62,062 I think. Next would be West Ham at 66k, not sure if that one is possible.
I hope (as I'm a sucker for asthetics) we fill in the corner between ARD and the main stand. That could be how we give it a 1k boost to 63k!

Then we mirror the mainstand for the Kenny one, filling the ARD Corner and KD Standard etc.

The final one is an all safe standing Kop of 18k (just over Spurs single tier beast!)

ARD Currently = 9074 (so an 8k increase) to 17k
Kop Currently = 12409 (so an 5.6k increase) to 18k
Kenny Dalglish = 11762 (so an 10.5 increase) to 20.5k
Main Stand = 20500

Final capacity = 76000
 

Hope in your heart

Loyalty and patience, two undervalued concepts.
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What I would like to see is not just re-development of ARD, but also what is still, in effect, the Kemlyn Road stand, i.e. the Centenary or Kenny Dalglish stand for those of fewer years.

Despite the money that's been spent there over the years, the seating in the lower tier is the same as it was when it was the Kemlyn Road which means there is negligible leg room. Even the upper tier is no different. So, my pipe dream is both ARD and the Sir Kenny stand get raised to the ground and replaced with a L-shaped three-tier stand with better seating which should take our capacity into the mid-sixties, and I don't mean 1965.

Another part of this pipe dream is the new ARD having safe-standing across the whole of the bottom tier and the Kop enlarged also with safe standing. I don't think safe standing would do much for the capacity, as it would have to revert to seating for European games, but it would do lot for the atmosphere and make it cheaper for younger fans to go to the match.
I don't hope that this will happen to be fair. Yes, the seating isn't very comfortable compared to other stadia, I grant you that. But it applies to the new main stand as well. Why? Because it wasn't a 100% reconstruction, but built on the structure of the ancient main stand. That allowed us to maintain that special kind of density you had before.

The same applies to the other stands. They are near to the ground, and their seating comfort is zero (hence many people prefer to stand, haha!). But the density allows that special atmosphere that you won't find in any modern stadium. That's because people are near to each other and to the ground. If you destroy the ARD and Sir Kenny stands to the ground and reconstruct them entirely, you'll have to abide to some construction laws for new buildings. Your stands will have more distance to the ground, and the better seating comfort will mean that people aren't as near to each other as is the case now.

That's why the reconstruction of the main stand was a uniquely smart move. It enhanced the attendance without taking away anything of the density and atmosphere. Hopefully any other enhancement of Anfield will respect this as well.

(Totally agree with the safe standing part of your post.)
 

William Clarke

REDSHIRT ~ I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one
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What I would like to see is not just re-development of ARD, but also what is still, in effect, the Kemlyn Road stand, i.e. the Centenary or Kenny Dalglish stand for those of fewer years.

Despite the money that's been spent there over the years, the seating in the lower tier is the same as it was when it was the Kemlyn Road which means there is negligible leg room. Even the upper tier is no different. So, my pipe dream is both ARD and the Sir Kenny stand get raised to the ground and replaced with a L-shaped three-tier stand with better seating which should take our capacity into the mid-sixties, and I don't mean 1965.

Another part of this pipe dream is the new ARD having safe-standing across the whole of the bottom tier and the Kop enlarged also with safe standing. I don't think safe standing would do much for the capacity, as it would have to revert to seating for European games, but it would do lot for the atmosphere and make it cheaper for younger fans to go to the match.
I am in full agreement with you when you talk of, what I still regard as, the Kemlyn Road stand seeing development to its previous design. FSG have shown us the way with the 3-tier Main stand, which is fantastic, so why not 3-tier stands to the Anfield Road and Kemlyn Road stands. The only true obstacle I can envisage is the high cost of such a project, but if their is a will to improve the ground by our owners, then I believe it should be given the green light and let work proceed.
 

liverpool8

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In the early days of live games on tv attendances were reduced. For the last 20 years or so though crowds have held up, or increased as capacities have been increased. The owners will need to take a view about future prospects, whether innovations like virtual reality tv might one day start a trend of reduced attendances. Think also that in the future all PL games could be live on tv/internet in the uk, as with the CL.
 

Red_Jedi

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Aren’t the fixtures already organised so that us and the Ev aren’t both at home on the same day?
But with Everton moving it lessens the load in the local area. And this is a critical piece on the restrictions that the current planning had. This will all be different now.
 



Mascot88

Yours for £1m. Need to make room for Dean Saunders
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But with Everton moving it lessens the load in the local area. And this is a critical piece on the restrictions that the current planning had. This will all be different now.
Of course, ‘Everton moving’ is a rather major ‘if’.
 

rupzzz

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But with Everton moving it lessens the load in the local area. And this is a critical piece on the restrictions that the current planning had. This will all be different now.
Not really - we never play matches on the same day, so there wouldn't be an offset, if they move, beyond regular daily visits.

I can't imagine they have that many visitors daily to the club shop and (empty) trophy cabinets that would make a difference.
 

Kopstar

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But with Everton moving it lessens the load in the local area. And this is a critical piece on the restrictions that the current planning had. This will all be different now.
Beyond turning Goodison into a coach park/bus and/or train station etc to serve Anfield, I'm not sure it will make much of a difference. The amount of regular disruption to local residents would diminish, of course, but the size of it will hopefully go the opposite direction. Perhaps local residents will prefer a total of 70k once a week to a total of 85k (?) twice? I've never been to Goodison though but I'd expect only a small number of residents are impacted both by Liverpool and Everton games?
 

Red_Jedi

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Not really - we never play matches on the same day, so there wouldn't be an offset, if they move, beyond regular daily visits.

I can't imagine they have that many visitors daily to the club shop and (empty) trophy cabinets that would make a difference.
We never play at the same weekend, but its the same vicinity and effects locals on a weekly basis. By Everton going, it reduces the "weekly" disruption - which means that if there are another 10,000 odd fans attending LFC matches it will only be on that week.

This was also part of the criteria when Anfield was hosting the concerts over summer. All councils can't look at at just one-off events - they have to look at the overall impact on the area. Everton moving reduces things when looking at it as a whole.
 



rupzzz

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We never play at the same weekend, but its the same vicinity and effects locals on a weekly basis. By Everton going, it reduces the "weekly" disruption - which means that if there are another 10,000 odd fans attending LFC matches it will only be on that week.

This was also part of the criteria when Anfield was hosting the concerts over summer. All councils can't look at at just one-off events - they have to look at the overall impact on the area. Everton moving reduces things when looking at it as a whole.
In planning terms, it's about the severity of the impact from development at peak times. It's the peak times that are relevant - and at peak times, I imagine most toffee's avoid the area anyway.

Any development proposal at the ARD, to add more than the outline permission requires, would be based on the current traffic flows (using fixed point permanent data collection points, and additional collection data (during match days they would probably do additional counts)). Basically, it's not about the general conditions on a week to week basis, with regards to people/traffic flows.

The cumulative impact in the area, from the move away of Everton, therefore local residents only having football on twice a week in the area, would form part of the assessments as to whether permission would be granted, but not in terms of traffic/people movement, and the ability of the roads/public transport networks to manage the extra folk (at peak times). That's more down the amenity side of things.

Furthermore, until there is anything firm regarding Everton, you cannot (in planning) take account of a conditional change. On top of all of that, we can assume that Goodison Park would be redeveloped, probably to housing (as there's a general housing crisis in the country), therefore there would likely be more people in the area week to week, than if the football ground stays (which sees 30,000 odd people in every 2 weeks, rather than the residents every day.
 

legalalien

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I don't hope that this will happen to be fair. Yes, the seating isn't very comfortable compared to other stadia, I grant you that. But it applies to the new main stand as well. Why? Because it wasn't a 100% reconstruction, but built on the structure of the ancient main stand. That allowed us to maintain that special kind of density you had before.

The same applies to the other stands. They are near to the ground, and their seating comfort is zero (hence many people prefer to stand, haha!). But the density allows that special atmosphere that you won't find in any modern stadium. That's because people are near to each other and to the ground. If you destroy the ARD and Sir Kenny stands to the ground and reconstruct them entirely, you'll have to abide to some construction laws for new buildings. Your stands will have more distance to the ground, and the better seating comfort will mean that people aren't as near to each other as is the case now.

That's why the reconstruction of the main stand was a uniquely smart move. It enhanced the attendance without taking away anything of the density and atmosphere. Hopefully any other enhancement of Anfield will respect this as well.

(Totally agree with the safe standing part of your post.)
Sorry, I can't agree with what you're saying. To me that's kind of living in the past, and the past was a time, in Britain, when football fans were treated like cattle. Those days are gone, and stands that try to cram as many people as possible into a limited space should be gone too.

Is the main stand really like that, with limited leg room? I don't know. I haven't been there. Yet.
 

Hope in your heart

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Sorry, I can't agree with what you're saying. To me that's kind of living in the past, and the past was a time, in Britain, when football fans were treated like cattle. Those days are gone, and stands that try to cram as many people as possible into a limited space should be gone too.

Is the main stand really like that, with limited leg room? I don't know. I haven't been there. Yet.
How is it the past? Our new main stand is the biggest in Europe now. While hugely impressive, it is not only preserving, but enhancing the atmosphere of Anfield. What's wrong about that, and why shouldn't the other stands be inspired of what was achieved there?

And yeah, I've been sat in the new main stand and the seating comfort isn't great, especially for people with long legs like me, but that's totally ok imo, for the reasons outlined above.
 

Commando

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How is it the past? Our new main stand is the biggest in Europe now. While hugely impressive, it is not only preserving, but enhancing the atmosphere of Anfield. What's wrong about that, and why shouldn't the other stands be inspired of what was achieved there?

And yeah, I've been sat in the new main stand and the seating comfort isn't great, especially for people with long legs like me, but that's totally ok imo, for the reasons outlined above.
I’m 5’3” and I have to say that there’s plenty of leg room in the main stand.
 

liver1

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1,947
Sorry, I can't agree with what you're saying. To me that's kind of living in the past, and the past was a time, in Britain, when football fans were treated like cattle. Those days are gone, and stands that try to cram as many people as possible into a limited space should be gone too.

Is the main stand really like that, with limited leg room? I don't know. I haven't been there. Yet.
Is cramming people in close a negative or is it a postive? Theres plenty of new stadiums that have more space and legroom but they could be any old stadium. If you want a better atmosphere you want people packed in close.
 



CymruRed

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I hope (as I'm a sucker for asthetics) we fill in the corner between ARD and the main stand. That could be how we give it a 1k boost to 63k!

Then we mirror the mainstand for the Kenny one, filling the ARD Corner and KD Standard etc.

The final one is an all safe standing Kop of 18k (just over Spurs single tier beast!)

ARD Currently = 9074 (so an 8k increase) to 17k
Kop Currently = 12409 (so an 5.6k increase) to 18k
Kenny Dalglish = 11762 (so an 10.5 increase) to 20.5k
Main Stand = 20500

Final capacity = 76000

I'm just wondering how we could fill in the corner between the new main stand and a new ARD end,when there is a massive roof truss in the way, surely that stops the both stands being joined together with a seamless filled in seated corner,having that huge steel arch support in the way?
 

Maurice

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I think that the redevelopment of the Anfield Raod End stand will be the similar of that from the new Main stand. I cannot imagine that it will be looking diferent……..…. Below is a link from Skypercity (than scroll a little bit down) were you can look at a possible foto how it might look...….