Conspiracy? Bias? Dumb luck? Why do LFC get shit decisions?

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Quicksand

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Hopefully they get a bigger fine/punishment this time, I know some will say they won’t get punished but if they do it will likely be much bigger than last time.
Probably.
Maybe £50 million and they cant sign any under 4 year olds from countries with an X or Z in their name for two seasons.
 

Zinedine Biscan

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Who said it is?
My point us, thus far they have not been punished. Why are they not being punished?
1) You're posting about it in this thread, why do that if you're not implying a conspiracy. Also the point about people deriding Jaffod for saying City have been cheating the ffp system for years is nonsense.

2) they have been punished.
 

Quicksand

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1) You're posting about it in this thread, why do that if you're not implying a conspiracy. Also the point about people deriding Jaffod for saying City have been cheating the ffp system for years is nonsense.

2) they have been punished.
He has received an amount of stick in fairness. To use the term conspiracy theorist is an insult, and @jaffod has been called that.

City are treated pretty favourably, their is very little in the media about possible sanctions etc. If Liverpool or the new pariahs Chelsea behaved in the same manner the Murdoch machine would be churning out bile about them.
And as for City being punished? Are you actually serious?
 

Zinedine Biscan

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He has received an amount of stick in fairness. To use the term conspiracy theorist is an insult, and @jaffod has been called that.

City are treated pretty favourably, their is very little in the media about possible sanctions etc. If Liverpool or the new pariahs Chelsea behaved in the same manner the Murdoch machine would be churning out bile about them.
And as for City being punished? Are you actually serious?
He does spout conspiracy theories and calling him such is justified, just that no-one has ever claimed City aren't cheats, which is what you suggested.

And someone has already posted about City's previous conviction and punishment, which you have already responded to, so what exactly are you objecting to here?
 

Zinedine Biscan

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Probably because it was the equivalent of taking a fiver off your wages
Irrelevant. His point was that a poster has been derided for saying City are cheats (he hasn't). That is a ridiculous statement when they've already been proven guilty once before in recent times. The level of punishment is a separate discussion.
 

Quicksand

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He does spout conspiracy theories and calling him such is justified, just that no-one has ever claimed City aren't cheats, which is what you suggested.

And someone has already posted about City's previous conviction and punishment, which you have already responded to, so what exactly are you objecting to here?
Punishment for gross misdemeanour should be meaningful. But you already know that.

And I dont think its fair to denigrate people because their views dont match yours. Maybe @jaffod is correct in some of his views and people are naive not to take that on board?
 

Dane

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Irrelevant. His point was that a poster has been derided for saying City are cheats (he hasn't). That is a ridiculous statement when they've already been proven guilty once before in recent times. The level of punishment is a separate discussion.
It is and it isn't.
Guilty yes, punished no.
Free reign to do it again.

Plus, correct me if I'm wrong, but weren't they "punished" for irregular dealings over youth players, and not FFP contravention?
 

Irishanfield

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Punishment for gross misdemeanour should be meaningful. But you already know that.

And I dont think its fair to denigrate people because their views dont match yours. Maybe @jaffod is correct in some of his views and people are naive not to take that on board?
I think the reason jaffod gets stick is because he is also going on about this fa conspiracy to stop us winning. They have apparently instructed the referees to give decisions oh and then there is the uefa conspiracy against....
 

Zinedine Biscan

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It is and it isn't.
Guilty yes, punished no.
Free reign to do it again.

Plus, correct me if I'm wrong, but weren't they "punished" for irregular dealings over youth players, and not FFP contravention?
Did you read the link posted on the last page? It was for an FFP breach. And being unable to register a full CL squad did hurt them, and let's be honest, a £50m fine is not exactly peanuts is it?

But I'm not getting sucked into a discussion on that. I was responding to a post claiming something about swathes of this forum that is patently untrue, something I always find incredibly disingenuous.
 

Quicksand

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Did you read the link posted on the last page? It was for an FFP breach. And being unable to register a full CL squad did hurt them, and let's be honest, a £50m fine is not exactly peanuts is it?

But I'm not getting sucked into a discussion on that. I was responding to a post claiming something about swathes of this forum that is patently untrue, something I always find incredibly disingenuous.
It is also disingenuous to litter threads with insulting remarks about other peoples view points. I am not wearing a tin hat, I am not a conspiracy theorist but that doesnt stop people having a dig at posters who recognise that biases exist against Liverpool. I explained that already.
Regarding City, the punishment wont match the crime, because they have money and power and the bias is with them.
 

Irishanfield

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It is also disingenuous to litter threads with insulting remarks about other peoples view points. I am not wearing a tin hat, I am not a conspiracy theorist but that doesnt stop people having a dig at posters who recognise that biases exist against Liverpool. I explained that already.
Regarding City, the punishment wont match the crime, because they have money and power and the bias is with them.
But if you believe there is a bias against us and towards city then you you are a conspiracy theorist
 

Zinedine Biscan

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It is also disingenuous to litter threads with insulting remarks about other peoples view points. I am not wearing a tin hat, I am not a conspiracy theorist but that doesnt stop people having a dig at posters who recognise that biases exist against Liverpool. I explained that already.
Regarding City, the punishment wont match the crime, because they have money and power and the bias is with them.
So, nothing about making an accusation against other posters, being unable to back up that accusation and evading any reference to it in subsequent posts in favour of shifting the goalposts to talk instead about the severity of the punishment against City you initially refused to recognise the existence of.

Good to know where I stand on this one. I'm out.
 

Irishanfield

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Bias, shown in the form of shockingly bad decisions, by some individuals (referees) does not equate to a conspiracy.
There is when there is no bias. I'm sure city fans could point to penalty decisions they should have got in games they dropped points. Tbh I expected more from you of all people on here not going down this road.

If you believe that there is a bias against us by certain refs and towards city (or just against us) then that is a conspiracy.
 

Quicksand

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So, nothing about making an accusation against other posters, being unable to back up that accusation and evading any reference to it in subsequent posts in favour of shifting the goalposts to talk instead about the severity of the punishment against City you initially refused to recognise the existence of.

Good to know where I stand on this one. I'm out.
There are many 'accusations' and assumptions made. Case in point a couple of posts up. Claiming bias doesnt make you a conspiracy theorist, more a realist in my view.
I genuinely did not set out to offend you. Not my style, I just answer what I see. I dont think its really fair to dwell on one point of my post whilst ignoring the tone set in general in this thread.
Apologies if I was disengenous to other posters. I do think some people have got the piss taken for holding specific views.
 

Kopstar

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There are many 'accusations' and assumptions made. Case in point a couple of posts up. Claiming bias doesnt make you a conspiracy theorist, more a realist in my view.
I genuinely did not set out to offend you. Not my style, I just answer what I see. I dont think its really fair to dwell on one point of my post whilst ignoring the tone set in general in this thread.
Apologies if I was disengenous to other posters. I do think some people have got the piss taken for holding specific views.
They have, fairly or unfairly, but nobody has had the piss taken out of them for saying City are cheating the system as you alleged had happened to Jaffod.
 
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Quicksand

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The creation of this thread has served it's purpose, I'm done.
The discussion should have been about recognising or refuting biases against the club, without derision or faux comedy. Maybe I muddied the waters in some of my posts, unintentionally. City and FFP suggests to ne that some lenience is evident, bias in their favour maybe. But maybe I was awkward in delivery.
I stand by my view,I really dont mind if people agree or not. I just got a bit pissed off at the baiting and uncalled for barbs in other threads, and the reaction of posters who got called on it.
 

Irishanfield

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The discussion should have been about recognising or refuting biases against the club, without derision or faux comedy. Maybe I muddied the waters in some of my posts, unintentionally. City and FFP suggests to ne that some lenience is evident, bias in their favour maybe. But maybe I was awkward in delivery.
I stand by my view,I really dont mind if people agree or not. I just got a bit pissed off at the baiting and uncalled for barbs in other threads, and the reaction of posters who got called on it.
Jaffod has alluded to a bigger bias against us which also includes uefa. So that's 1-refs, 2-FA and 3 Uefa
And you refer to him as a realist

I don't want to be harping on about him as he hasn't been involved in this (I think) and I have no issue with him but you have defended his views a few times here
 

Quicksand

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Jaffod has alluded to a bigger bias against us which also includes uefa. So that's 1-refs, 2-FA and 3 Uefa
And you refer to him as a realist

I don't want to be harping on about him as he hasn't been involved in this (I think) and I have no issue with him but you have defended his views a few times here
He could be correct though?
Anyway, I have explained my views.
 



Mascot88

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OK. I’ve changed the title of the thread, since it caused offence to some people (the same people who are oh so quick to decry others as snowflakes whenever the subject of PC crops up)

My own take on this

There are some people here who have claimed a conspiracy against LFC. This implies a conscious collusion between powerful actors to prevent Liverpool achieving success, like the FA, Premier League or referees. Jaffod is the most prominent advocate of this, bringing into his theory, at different times, the European ban, the Conservatives attitude towards the city of Liverpool, our success in the eighties, the establishment’s antipathy towards socialism and Liverpool’s working class roots etc etc.

Unfortunately to maintain this level of conspiracy, for twenty years, would be nigh on impossible without the lid coming off at some point. Too many people involved and too much scope for a slip up here or there.

But wait. The media are all in on it too. And all the journalists. Parliament too. They don’t want us to win it, whoever they are.

And this is the problem with conspiracies. The loop just keeps widening and widening until before you know where you are, half the world is conspiring against us.

I heard it said of the moon landings that it would have been more difficult to fake than actually land on it, such was the scale necessary for the deception to take place. I think it’s like that.

Then there is bias. I don’t think anyone has ever claimed that there is no bias against the club, and I’m sick to the back teeth of referees who see Anfield as a good place to show off the size of their bollocks by refusing any kind of home decision. I’m sick of playing ale house teams who are allowed to foul with impunity because the referee has decided that’s how he’s going to level it up for Sky.

But that isn’t conspiracy, and we’re not alone in these frustrations.

On the subject of City, they have unquestionably been allowed to get away with cheating, and maybe the games authorities are now realising they can’t keep turning a blind eye. Again I don’t see this as a conspiracy - it’s ineffective administrators of the game not having the stomach for a fight.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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I don't believe there's any kind of conspiracy against us. I do however believe the whole sport is riddled with bias, both unconscious and conscious. If people don't appreciate that basic fact I don't know what to say. There's also hand in hand with that a pitiful level of quality in officiating generally.

Now the bias in football that has a bearing on Liverpool largely effects us in a negative way in my opinion. Over the last 30 years Liverpool as a city (and us and Everton as clubs) and LFC along with its supporters in particular have been painted in a terrible light.

You had Thatchers regime trying to demonize and run the city into the ground. You had Heysel disaster leading to all clubs being put out of Europe and then the fight against the media and authority over our lost 96.

As a club we've been portrayed as trouble makers and Billy big bollocks and jumped up little shits for decades. Enemies of authority. In the meantime the media have had decades long love ins with the likes of Ferguson, Wenger and Jose until recently.

All of this plays an influence on officials and their decision making. General rule of thumb is smaller clubs suffer with bad calls and bugger clubs benefit more. Officials are swayed by the media reaction to their performance. They're only human. Going into a game knowing a bad call for Burnley against United will be all over the papers for days and get them demoted to the Championship is going to mean they aren't calling it till they are 100% sure (wrong or right).

For years (Suarez now Salah) the media has been against us on that because the media doesn't kick up a fuss in our favour they actually do the opposite. Any hint of embellishment and they're all over us for weeks about our diving. So guess who will be reserved about giving calls our way unless they are sure.

During his time at United the highest average time added on at the end of games was when Ferguson was chasing a goal when it reached the 90th minute. The lowest amount added on was when United were winning when it reached 90. If anyone still thinks the officials aren't influenced I think they're deluded.

I don't believe any/many believe there is an actual conspiracy. However pretending there is no possibility of bias negatively effecting us and stifling debate by calling others crackpots and tin foil hat wearers is a bit out of order in my opinion.
 

Mascot88

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I don't believe any/many believe there is an actual conspiracy. However pretending there is no possibility of bias negatively effecting us and stifling debate by calling others crackpots and tin foil hat wearers is a bit out of order in my opinion.
I appreciate your post, but I think the last bit isn’t really a thing at all. The only people get called tin foil hat wearers, are the few people who actually have batshit opinions.
 

Dane

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OK. I’ve changed the title of the thread, since it caused offence to some people (the same people who are oh so quick to decry others as snowflakes whenever the subject of PC crops up)
For the record, it takes much more than a corny thread title to cause me offence.
I didn't quote the rest because I didn't bother reading it.
I'm done in this thread.
 
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