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Gini Wijnaldum (CM) to Barcelona

redfanman

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I understand Covid-19 has made the financial future uncertain but with what Klopp has achieved with us I think a bit of 'speculate to accumulate' was required this summer. Werner, Tsimikas and Thiago for around £90m would have made for a pretty incredible squad. This would then be recouped through the sales of Lovren, Shaqiri, Wilson, Grujic, Ojo, Ejaria, Phillips, Larouci, Origi, Awoniyi and Karius. If the owners rate Edwards as much as it appears from the outside this should have been doable.
Well run businesses dont speculate, they invest to accumulate.
 

redfanman

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What excuses? Heard nothing. It was completely quiet RE: Gini in the media and then Corona came.

Club was too stingy to pay the player who was very important in winning CL and PL what he deserves. Still on £90k while Firmino who i'd rate as important as Gini is on £150k or something.

Wijnaldum is almost 30 and players of midtable teams earn more than him. Can’t blame him if he walks out on a free or signs for a club that would pay him more than £200k now.
Its not the salary, its the length of contract on offer thats the issue. Neither side are to blame.
 

Brital

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Policy seems to be working
Our approach to the domestic cups for the last few years (last year’s league cup excepted, because of the ridiculous nature of that season) have quite frankly been embarrassing for a club of our size.
Unless we start adding the likes of Thiago whilst also keeping first teamer’s, then we chances are that won’t change.

How are Everton adding another 3 players?
Don’t they know they have to do them one at a time?

Honestly the idea we couldn’t sell Gini if we’ve already bought Thiago is laughable and it’s amusing to watch the logical contortions posters on here will go to, to defend the lack of funds at the managers disposal.

There’s one man responsible for us winning again & he can’t continue to perform miracles without any backing.
 

nikz200

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Firstly, given it's been known he was leaving Bayern for two months now, why has no one else come in for him? Surely all these other clubs would have moved by now rather than waiting like we've been doing?

Secondly, it is highly likely that part of the reason we haven't bought Thiago yet is because Gini is still here. He won't be let go without an agreement in place with Bayern and Thiago or for someone else. It's been made quite clear that we're not pushing Gini out the door. We're very happy to keep him for this season and if Thiago goes elsewhere, Gini won't be sold.

This isn't a mickey mouse club anymore.
Its been known sure, but we all know clubs usually wait for someone to make a move or be linked with some move before they come in. Its a tale as old as time and its part of the reason we usually get these deals done quietly. I remember for Van Dijk and Alisson it was after we pushed for those moves that the rats of Chelsea and city came scurrying from their holes to try and entice these players. Chelsea more so than others, they really try to push the bids up. This time around , that could potentially be City or United doing it , we don't know for sure. But i would not be surprised if the players is set on coming to us, but their agents go talking and then whisper into his ear.This has on paper affected many potential moves that could have happened in the past.

I agree with your 2nd point, however i have to argue, letting Gini go on a free would be bad form on our part. Mainly because we will be set to lose Gini for nothing, and i would rather the club sell and recoup the money so we can move on for the season.

We may not be a mickey mouse club anymore, but we certainly don't act our size. By right we should be bringing in Thiago and letting the wijnaldum situation play out. Its what all the other teams would do, but we decide to wait, and if we keep both Thiago and Wijnaldum, whats the problem with that? Good to have those options. But I'm sure someone will then lecture me about COVID and how spending and blah blah blah. I wish someone would tell that to the other teams, they seem to have not gotten this memo.
 

rab

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Its not the salary, its the length of contract on offer thats the issue. Neither side are to blame.
Can't really blame the club for not wanting to commit to a four year deal for someone who'll be 30 in a couple of months. Equally, you can't blame him for wanting to secure his long term future even if that means moving on.

What we do know is how hard it can be to shift older players on huge contracts should they not be able to match the performance levels they delivered previously. With Virgil, Henderson, Mo, Mane and Firmino all in that same age bracket, there's only so much investment into their long term combined salaries you'd want to be doing at this point.
 
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Kopstar

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Our approach to the domestic cups for the last few years (last year’s league cup excepted, because of the ridiculous nature of that season) have quite frankly been embarrassing for a club of our size.
Unless we start adding the likes of Thiago whilst also keeping first teamer’s, then we chances are that won’t change.

How are Everton adding another 3 players?
Don’t they know they have to do them one at a time?

Honestly the idea we couldn’t sell Gini if we’ve already bought Thiago is laughable and it’s amusing to watch the logical contortions posters on here will go to, to defend the lack of funds at the managers disposal.

There’s one man responsible for us winning again & he can’t continue to perform miracles without any backing.
This all feels so wearily familiar...

You were last here in September 2017 telling everyone what a shit transfer window we'd had.

Since then one of the players we signed that window won player of the year with a new PL scoring record, and got golden boot again this year, we've been to back-to-back CL finals, winning the most recent, got the third highest points in PL history, a player we tried to sign in 2017 joined us in January 2018, succeeded the previous player as player of the year and is arguably the best player in the world, certainly the best defender.

During these successes you posted nothing. Welcome back, thanks for the moan, looks like we're doing fine. Cheers.
You were last here in September 2017 August 2018 August 2019 telling everyone what a shit transfer window we'd had.

In between times, during the most successful period in our recent history, you posted nothing. Welcome back, thanks for the moan, looks like we're doing fine. Cheers.

I said our squad wasn’t strong enough in 2017. 20+ points behind City and although Klopp performed miracles to get us to the CL final we were running on fumes and unfortunately couldn’t get across the line. Our bench for the final was embarrassing for a club of our size.
Last year the club finally acted and look at the result.

All of the above merely confirms my arguments as valid. At what point do you question your stance?
If you remember I was threatened with expulsion for questioning the lack of ambition, hence my absence.
I didn’t feel the need to come on here one upping after the 2018 final.
But it’s fantasy to think this squad is big enough and good enough for the 5 competitions and Charity Shield and Super Cup.

I hope the club have something big planned for the final few weeks cos if we haven’t you can forget doing anything this year. City will not be worried about Wilson, Kent etc. And they will have to play or be on the bench cos the likes of Shaqiri, Lallana, Keita are perennial injuries.

Maybe they’re stockpiling funds for next year but it’s puzzling to say the least. The best always strengthen from a position of strength.

I will now go back into hibernation so you can flame me to your hearts content, but it won’t change the precarious position we are in at this moment - hopefully things will change over the next fortnight.
Rinse. Repeat. Rinse. Repeat.
 

rab

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Its been known sure, but we all know clubs usually wait for someone to make a move or be linked with some move before they come in. Its a tale as old as time and its part of the reason we usually get these deals done quietly. I remember for Van Dijk and Alisson it was after we pushed for those moves that the rats of Chelsea and city came scurrying from their holes to try and entice these players. Chelsea more so than others, they really try to push the bids up. This time around , that could potentially be City or United doing it , we don't know for sure. But i would not be surprised if the players is set on coming to us, but their agents go talking and then whisper into his ear.This has on paper affected many potential moves that could have happened in the past.

I agree with your 2nd point, however i have to argue, letting Gini go on a free would be bad form on our part. Mainly because we will be set to lose Gini for nothing, and i would rather the club sell and recoup the money so we can move on for the season.

We may not be a mickey mouse club anymore, but we certainly don't act our size. By right we should be bringing in Thiago and letting the wijnaldum situation play out. Its what all the other teams would do, but we decide to wait, and if we keep both Thiago and Wijnaldum, whats the problem with that? Good to have those options. But I'm sure someone will then lecture me about COVID and how spending and blah blah blah. I wish someone would tell that to the other teams, they seem to have not gotten this memo.
Clubs wait for other clubs to make a move before they show their hand? So what's the issue with us waiting then given no one else has moved?

If you think Van Dijk and Alisson weren't on other clubs radars before we made moves for them, well you're living in a fantasy land. We also bought both those players without much challenge from anyone else. The delay with Van Dijk was our fuck up with Southampton and the delay with Alisson was because Roma wanted £90m initially.

What we do know is on a daily basis Bayern are briefing that they are expecting a bid from us and that they expect him to join us. Every single day. They want us to bid for him because he wants to come here and there's no way he's that set on the idea unless we've already been talking to him. He will know what we need to do in order for us to make our move. Either raising funds, freeing up wage space or moving on Gini. Yes an agent could whisper in his ear but if he chooses to go elsewhere, we just keep hold of Gini. We're in a good place with this.

We are a well run club. We don't spend beyond our means. We don't stockpile players. Klopp has made it clear he understands this and that he wants to work with a smaller squad. Turn a blind eye to Covid all you want, just because we're being cautious and others aren't doesn't mean we should react rashly. The league has just binned off their Chinese TV contract today because it hasn't been paid. That's money clubs will have accounted for that they won't see and it won't be the last deal cancelled I suspect. That is the level of uncertainty we're living in right now.

Other clubs are borrowing money to buy players. If I were an Everton fan (must have been a serial killer in a past life to be reincarnated as one of them) I'm not sure I'd be celebrating their spending. About 80% of their revenue goes on wages. Revenue that is dropping off a cliff just as they're borrowing money to pay for a new stadium. And they're borrowing more money to buy players because they've been run like a shit show for since Moshri came on board. Boom or bust thinking and im glad our club isn't desperately chasing around like this right now.
 

Mascot88

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Our approach to the domestic cups for the last few years (last year’s league cup excepted, because of the ridiculous nature of that season) have quite frankly been embarrassing for a club of our size.
Unless we start adding the likes of Thiago whilst also keeping first teamer’s, then we chances are that won’t change.

How are Everton adding another 3 players?
Don’t they know they have to do them one at a time?

Honestly the idea we couldn’t sell Gini if we’ve already bought Thiago is laughable and it’s amusing to watch the logical contortions posters on here will go to, to defend the lack of funds at the managers disposal.

There’s one man responsible for us winning again & he can’t continue to perform miracles without any backing.
He’s been backed, and we’ve got two of the biggest shiniest cups in the cabinet. The only thing embarrassing at this point is fans absolutely shitting the bed over signings.

I’ve argued with people (probably you, by the look of Kopstars post) who said we wouldn’t win anything if we sold Coutinho, we wouldn’t win anything if we didn’t replace Coutinho. Last years transfer window was a disaster and we wouldn’t win anything, as was January (although, unfortunately for the moaners it was clear that we’d blazed the league by then).

I’m properly fucking sick of this now. We just won the thing we’ve been trying to win for 30 years, and a subset of fans are absolutely ruining it for all concerns. What’s embarrassing is logging on twitter and seeing people harassing John Henry and his wife, and spamming every club tweet with #FSGOUT shit.

It’s beyond pathetic.
 
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Mascot88

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How are Everton adding another 3 players?
Don’t they know they have to do them one at a time?
Because they are borrowing more money and loading more debt on the club.

Shall we do that as well. I mean, I remember when our previous owners were loading the club with debt to buy players. It was ace.
 

Kopstar

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He’s been backed, and we’ve got two of the biggest shiniest cups in the cabinet. The only think embarrassing at this point is fans absolutely shitting the bed over signings.

I’ve argued with people (probably you, by the look of Kopstars post) who said we wouldn’t win anything if we sold Coutinho, we wouldn’t win anything if we didn’t replace Coutinho. Last years transfer window was a disaster and we wouldn’t win anything, as was January (although, unfortunately for the moaners it was clear that we’d blazed the league by then).

I’m properly fucking sick of this now. We just won the thing we’ve been trying to win for 30 years, and a subset of fans are absolutely ruining it for all concerns. What’s embarrassing is logging on twitter and seeing people harassing John Henry and his wife, spamming every club tweet with #FSGOUT shit.

It beyond pathetic.
Does this bring back memories? It's your reply to one of his posts from 2017. :)

You’re the kind of Chicken Little kneejerker that would have had us sign Johnny Evans when Van Dijk fell through. I don’t know how you’ve got the brass neck to claim reflected glory in Klopp’s achievements - a manager who’s ethos is the complete opposite of yours.

The club is in a position of strength right now because it has spent the last three years acting shrewdly, spending only when necessary and making sure the player is right for the club - to the point of waiting it out if necessary.

I’d like that to continue, and if the club do nothing before August 9th it won’t be through contentment or complacency. It will be because in the opinion of the recruitment team, on who’s work so much of our success has been based, the right player isn’t available.
 

redfanman

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Because they are borrowing more money and loading more debt on the club.

Shall we do that as well. I mean, I remember when our previous owners were loading the club with debt to buy players. It was ace.
Pretty sure last season they were close to breaching FFP and were looking at solving it through a dubious sale of stadium naming rights at an overvalued price to Usmanov, who is probably the real owner. Will be interesting as to how many of these three targets they actually get over the line.
 

mattyhurst

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Our approach to the domestic cups for the last few years (last year’s league cup excepted, because of the ridiculous nature of that season) have quite frankly been embarrassing for a club of our size.
Unless we start adding the likes of Thiago whilst also keeping first teamer’s, then we chances are that won’t change.

How are Everton adding another 3 players?
Don’t they know they have to do them one at a time?

Honestly the idea we couldn’t sell Gini if we’ve already bought Thiago is laughable and it’s amusing to watch the logical contortions posters on here will go to, to defend the lack of funds at the managers disposal.

There’s one man responsible for us winning again & he can’t continue to perform miracles without any backing.
To be honest if we hadn’t been forced to play the U23’s against Villa and hadn’t made the mistakes we made against Chelsea, we might have made two semi finals in those domestic cups.
 

Noo Noo

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We just won the thing we’ve been trying to win for 30 years, and a subset of fans are absolutely ruining it for all concerns. What’s embarrassing is logging on twitter and seeing people harassing John Henry and his wife, and spamming every club tweet with #FSGOUT shit.

It’s beyond pathetic.
really? Glad I'm not on twitter then. Memories of a goldfish spring to mind.
 

gr_sounder

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Pretty sure last season they were close to breaching FFP and were looking at solving it through a dubious sale of stadium naming rights at an overvalued price to Usmanov, who is probably the real owner. Will be interesting as to how many of these three targets they actually get over the line.
That's a lot of speculation in that first sentence without any real basis.... "pretty sure they were close"... "dubious sale"... "overvalued price".... "probably the real owner".
 

gr_sounder

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Too many fans (including Brital) seem to get more enjoying from winning transfer windows rather than trophies.
So true, and the only way to assess who wins a transfer window is by looking back from at least 1-2 seasons after that window has closed.
 

The Hermit

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Crazy a club like ours has a 1 in 1 out policy.
There’s loads of fringe players who will go so no idea why we have to sell a starter. We never have any depth.

Yes, but I think it's more about the number of MF in the match day squad than it is about the total number of MF, fringe players included. There just isn't room
And all this 'Gini out and Thiago in will be great business and we will even improve'.

For me that can go either way. Fifty-fifty.

I don’t have the numbers but wouldn’t surprise me if Gini played 40% more minutes than Thiago in the last 2 years.

Like I said - we can improve or not but without Gini our football will be different and we might even have to say goodbye to our high pressing midfield.
Not if we switch to a 4-2-3-1, which I think is the direction we are going. Plenty of bodies to high press in the formation.
 

redfanman

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That's a lot of speculation in that first sentence without any real basis.... "pretty sure they were close"... "dubious sale"... "overvalued price".... "probably the real owner".
Not really. A championship club fell foul with a similar stadium deal to what Everton are proposing.

The last two Years Everton have spent £94m more than they have earned. USM, Usmanov's company are now a key commercial partner for Everton. They have given Everton £30m not for the naming rights of the new stadium but for the option on those rights.

Moshiri previously worked as Usmanov's right hand and is believed by some football journalists not to have the sums of money available to spend what he has done.
 

CymruRed

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He seems to be copying and pasting his, we should definitely just be dialling in our responses right now. Maybe direct his posts to the spam folder?

He's pretty much a piss poor WUM tbh,to win every major honour over the last year or so and then complain about not wining the shitty domestic cups,then claim us being an embarressment because of it,is just laughable,i'd put him on ignore if i didn't find his stupid posts funny.
 

Kopstar

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Fuck the CL and end of our 30 year title drought. Until we make a deep run in the league cup FSG will always be chancers in my eyes.
They promised so much. I mean, who can forget that epic victory over Cardiff City in 2012? Ever since then it's been failure, after failure, after failure.

FRAUDS
 

gr_sounder

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Not really. A championship club fell foul with a similar stadium deal to what Everton are proposing.

The last two Years Everton have spent £94m more than they have earned. USM, Usmanov's company are now a key commercial partner for Everton. They have given Everton £30m not for the naming rights of the new stadium but for the option on those rights.

Moshiri previously worked as Usmanov's right hand and is believed by some football journalists not to have the sums of money available to spend what he has done.
All correct - and it could be that in the end Usmanov will be the person in charge at Everton, but for now he's not.
Moshiri is valued at $2.4B and has the financial clout to do what has been done. If he brings in his long time friend and old partner, they definitely have the money to spend and would have much more than our owners in FSG.

Does all this have the signs of Usmanov eventually taking over or at least equal footing? Yes, but so far that's not what has happened.
Either way, I'm not sure what the problem would be is Usmanov is intending to take over or be the financial backing behind Moshiri.