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Gini Wijnaldum (CM) to Barcelona

Anfield rd Dreamer

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The Pjanic deal can't be viewed in isolation. It and the Arthur sale were very much priced the way they were because of FFP accounting rules.
Edwards won't care about that. Barcelona have put a valuation on a 30 year old central midfield player this summer and that will and should be used to help set a value on Wijnaldum should they try to buy him. It just becomes a question of how much the reduction is for him being in his final year.
 

rab

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Edwards won't care about that. Barcelona have put a valuation on a 30 year old central midfield player this summer and that will and should be used to help set a value on Wijnaldum should they try to buy him. It just becomes a question of how much the reduction is for him being in his final year.
Every extra quid we try and squeeze out of Barca becomes an extra quid Bayern can point to for Thiago. As good as Edwards is, I think if we see Thiago as an improvement on Gini we should be prepared for him to possibly cost more.

A reasonable balance will need to be struck and Panjic isn't really a true barometer.
 

redfanman

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Edwards won't care about that. Barcelona have put a valuation on a 30 year old central midfield player this summer and that will and should be used to help set a value on Wijnaldum should they try to buy him. It just becomes a question of how much the reduction is for him being in his final year.
Whether he cares about it or not is somewhat irrelevant. There is no one formula for valuing players and the agreed price will depend on a range of factors.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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Every extra quid we try and squeeze out of Barca becomes an extra quid Bayern can point to for Thiago. As good as Edwards is, I think if we see Thiago as an improvement on Gini we should be prepared for him to possibly cost more.

A reasonable balance will need to be struck and Panjic isn't really a true barometer.
Whether he cares about it or not is somewhat irrelevant. There is no one formula for valuing players and the agreed price will depend on a range of factors.
Well I for one won't be surprised if the fee we get off Barca for Gini ends up being higher than we pay for Thiago. Guess we will have to wait and see. My faith is in Edwards.
 

rab

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Well I for one won't be surprised if the fee we get off Barca for Gini ends up being higher than we pay for Thiago. Guess we will have to wait and see. My faith is in Edwards.
I see a game of chicken emerging. Barca want to know what we're paying for Thiago so they bid on Gini accordingly. Bayern want to see what we get for Gini so they can price Thiago accordingly. We want to do both deals without the other parties getting wind of the other figure.

That's if it happens at all of course.
 

Kopstar

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I see a game of chicken emerging. Barca want to know what we're paying for Thiago so they bid on Gini accordingly. Bayern want to see what we get for Gini so they can price Thiago accordingly. We want to do both deals without the other parties getting wind of the other figure.

That's if it happens at all of course.
We should just tell Barcelona to buy Thiago for us and in return we'll give them Gini. Easy.

For the record I'd rather have both, second prize keep Gini, third prize sell Gini buy Thiago.
 

rab

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We should just tell Barcelona to buy Thiago for us and in return we'll give them Gini. Easy.

For the record I'd rather have both, second prize keep Gini, third prize sell Gini buy Thiago.
Inclined to agree. Better the champion you know but think it's being made quite clear it'll be one or the other for next season.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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I see a game of chicken emerging. Barca want to know what we're paying for Thiago so they bid on Gini accordingly. Bayern want to see what we get for Gini so they can price Thiago accordingly. We want to do both deals without the other parties getting wind of the other figure.

That's if it happens at all of course.
I think Bayern have already laid their cards down with the price they want and our reaction has been "ooo I don't know..... covid and all that.... very little money.... I mean we've a full squad... Not sure we can stretch to that....."!

And the game of chicken has probably been on for awhile.

Bayern are sitting there saying the price is the price but hand weakened as they have also accepted publicly that they need to sell but probably not believing a word about our no money and no room in the squad when we have 1 thousand fringe players up for sale most of which we will successfully sell.

Barca saying they may be interested in Gini and trying to see if we'd accept a curly wurly and some lose change because, after all, they're Barcelona and everyone is willing to go on strike to join them and we won't possibly be willing to let him go for free whilst desperately hoping we don't notice how the shit show over there is making them desperate.

Meanwhile we are sitting there dangling Bayern hoping they negotiate on an already very good price (hopefully confident for a reason and had reassurance from Thiago) whilst also knowing we have no problem with Gini staying a year and leaving for free if nobody meets the asking price and confident in Gini being a model professional.
 

hoosierred

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Swapping Gini for Thiago and £5m will just confirm to some that FSG are money grabbing wankers who are bad for our club.
FSG are money grabbing wankers. They just happen to be the sort of money grubbing wankers who like winning.

As well as the sort who understand sometimes you need to spend money to make money. And that winning trophies will make them more money.

All in all that makes them good owners
 

Brital

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wait. What?
FSG “bought” the club by taking it on with over £200m of debt.
It is estimated it’s now worth close to £2B.

In that time they are using the clubs turnover to pay off the debt.
When they eventually sell, they will pocket all that money.
Paying off debt is how they extract money from the club.

£2B club sold with no debt = £2B to FSG
£2B club sold with £500m debt = £1.5B to FSG

We have the worlds best manager for four more years. They could back him and watch us win the fucking lot or (as they have for the last four transfer windows) hamstring him and pray for the best.

The general feeling on this forum seems to be Jurgen has to make the most of the crumbs that come his way. All the time ignoring we are a top ten club in terms of global support and turnover. No other global club makes their manager work under those restrictions.

Berating me is tiresome. Explain why we should be the exception.
Also explain why you all have a small town mentality when you’re supporting a global powerhouse, I don’t imagine many Barcelona fans think this way.

Jesus Christ Everton are now spending much more than us and no one here thinks that’s an issue!

Anchelotti is a good manager you know - the complacency is palpable.
 

rupzzz

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@Brital its simply down to making the club sustainable. Just because we haven't signed anyone yet and blown a fk load in the process, means they're continuing to be sustainable. As for them looking at making the club more valuable under their ownership is something I dont mind. Dont forget theyve also done a lot for the good of the club, including the new main stand, plans for the Anfield Road stand, and the state of the art facilities being built are Kirkby - none of that is cheap, and the club isn't being put into mountains of debt.

As for stating Klopp is being hamstrung, its pretty clear that he has a way of working that he's happy with. His expertise lies in working with players to make them better, rather than focusing on buying in key positions, which he has done ofcourse with Virgil and Alisson.

Ofcourse we want the fancy signings, but Klopp has proven he can make shrewd signings that can become world class.

More could be done on commercial revenues, but I think that, given how the team have performed the last couple of years, its a bit over the top to get worked up over not spending on players, just yet. Let's see what it looks like after the window closes,n then assess. Ofcourse, the assessments of the last few windows have been negative, although the results have clearly been the opposite.
 

gasband

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FSG “bought” the club by taking it on with over £200m of debt.
It is estimated it’s now worth close to £2B.

In that time they are using the clubs turnover to pay off the debt.
When they eventually sell, they will pocket all that money.
Paying off debt is how they extract money from the club.

£2B club sold with no debt = £2B to FSG
£2B club sold with £500m debt = £1.5B to FSG

We have the worlds best manager for four more years. They could back him and watch us win the fucking lot or (as they have for the last four transfer windows) hamstring him and pray for the best.

The general feeling on this forum seems to be Jurgen has to make the most of the crumbs that come his way. All the time ignoring we are a top ten club in terms of global support and turnover. No other global club makes their manager work under those restrictions.

Berating me is tiresome. Explain why we should be the exception.
Also explain why you all have a small town mentality when you’re supporting a global powerhouse, I don’t imagine many Barcelona fans think this way.

Jesus Christ Everton are now spending much more than us and no one here thinks that’s an issue!

Anchelotti is a good manager you know - the complacency is palpable.
Ok sure
 

Incognito

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Berating me is tiresome. Explain why we should be the exception.
Also explain why you all have a small town mentality when you’re supporting a global powerhouse, I don’t imagine many Barcelona fans think this way.
People have done, maybe read? Because when people are explaining you, you choose to ignore and get in the discussion but begin the same rant over and over.

Is spending the only way to become global powerhouse? What has spending done for Barcelona? They have spent on Coutinho, Dembele, Greizmann without a plan and players worth 350 MN are warming their bench or winning trophies for other clubs while Barca loses 8-2, that's what you want?

Their fans and many others are entitled ones who think this is FM and our club should have the next best toy, doesn't matter he fits in or not.. buy him, make him succeed else throw him and you as a manager fck off as well.. is that how you want this club to operate?

These are tough times and our owners are risk averse and Klopp understands it. He's not the kind of guy who will do anything for winning, put the club's future in doubt for his short term gain. And that's the reason he's one of the best. He's not just an amazing manager but a responsible human being unlike many managers who don't care about anything else but them winning. And for them winning means getting just the players they want, they can't coach players. Yes we should be an exception, because we are winning trophies being an exception and many others despite spending like crazy are in worse situation than us.
 

gasband

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There is no need to try to convince Brital. Its one thing to have differing opinions but another thing when all his posts are basically berating the owners for not spending money. There is only one thing he wants to talk about, not about our achievements, not about how we have made leaps and bounds on and off the field, but just to berate the owners. So just let him be, and then he will disappear for 2 years again until he decides to come back and berate the owners again.
 

Dutch

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@Brital its simply down to making the club sustainable. Just because we haven't signed anyone yet and blown a fk load in the process, means they're continuing to be sustainable. As for them looking at making the club more valuable under their ownership is something I dont mind. Dont forget theyve also done a lot for the good of the club, including the new main stand, plans for the Anfield Road stand, and the state of the art facilities being built are Kirkby - none of that is cheap, and the club isn't being put into mountains of debt.

As for stating Klopp is being hamstrung, its pretty clear that he has a way of working that he's happy with. His expertise lies in working with players to make them better, rather than focusing on buying in key positions, which he has done ofcourse with Virgil and Alisson.

Ofcourse we want the fancy signings, but Klopp has proven he can make shrewd signings that can become world class.

More could be done on commercial revenues, but I think that, given how the team have performed the last couple of years, its a bit over the top to get worked up over not spending on players, just yet. Let's see what it looks like after the window closes,n then assess. Ofcourse, the assessments of the last few windows have been negative, although the results have clearly been the opposite.
The big question is how much better can this group become just by training when other clubs are getting better by training and adding better players than they had true transfers. Last few months I did not get the feeling we were getting better, rather the opposite. This group needs an injection of quality players in midfield and upfront to push our squad :cool: IMHO.

But as you say the window is still open for a month, let's see what happens.
 

gasband

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The big question is how much better can this group become just by training when other clubs are getting better by training and adding better players than they had true transfers. Last few months I did not get the feeling we were getting better, rather the opposite. This group needs an injection of quality players in midfield and upfront to push our squad :cool: IMHO.

But as you say the window is still open for a month, let's see what happens.
That is a fair point and I think most fans are not saying that we SHOULD NOT buy any players. It is more that with Klopp and the coaching team and with a now robust youth pipeline, we might not have to buy players everytime there is a problem area. And you can see Klopp and the club's flexibility here. If they are not out to spend when necessary, they would not have bought Tsim and just use Larouci. Instead, Klopp after having a good look at Larouci, decided that he was not going to be good enough, is willing to let him go and goes out and bought someone like Tsim whom I think most fans would agree that looks really good at least what we saw so far. Championship winning teams have always emphasized that its important to keep a winning team together and make changes and improvements when necessary. So I do not think we are not improving the team, but for a few posters here to berate the owners for not spending, its beyond belief. Because we will spend when necessary but we are not going to be like Roman of Chelsea or the Scums who is now half a billion in debt.