Is this our best-ever team?

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Yes and I am loving the sight of it.... You do know we are just talking hypothetical here right? Dosen't matter what my opinion is on Kuyt. It's not like he is coming out of retirement. LOL! This is all opinion right here. No need to bring up the fact we are the best team in the world as of the moment
Well Salah is an integral and performing component of said best team in the world so it's highly pertinent.
 

ScouseLand

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Well Salah is an integral and performing component of said best team in the world so it's highly pertinent.
You think Liverpool would not perform the same way without Salah? You believe we will not be unbeaten if he didn't play all season? Honest question...
 

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You think Liverpool would not perform the same way without Salah? You believe we will not be unbeaten if he didn't play all season? Honest question...
That's a matter of personal opinion but as our leading goal contributor the objective answer to that is probably yes. You can't just take away his contribution and assume it would have been covered over such a long period without any drop off somewhere along the line.
 

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That's a matter of personal opinion but as our leading goal contributor the objective answer to that is probably yes. You can't just take away his contribution and assume it would have been covered over such a long period without any drop off somewhere along the line.
Fair enough. Maybe it's because i expect mane and bobby to pick up the slack if Mo was injured. Just like what bobby and mo are doing right now with mane injured.
 

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Fair enough. Maybe it's because i expect mane and bobby to pick up the slack if Mo was injured. Just like what bobby and mo are doing right now with mane injured.
As indeed Mané and Bobby, and the others it must be said, carried on when Salah was injured earlier on this season however that period did actually coincide with the one aberration on our otherwise perfect record. Small sample size (one game) but nonetheless. Bear in mind that there is also a knock on effect if Salah were not to have been available for the whole season in that Bobby and Mané simply could not, and should not, play every single game and they themselves would need a rest at some point.

Its all hypothetical, as you say, but personally I think that being without Salah from August to now sees us with a lead at the top of the league but one unlikely to be the vast chasm it is now. Just a normal chasm ;)
 

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Definitely. Most of our title winning teams of the past had stars carrying them to trophies, but did not have such a complete squad. Their mentality to win every game is alien like
 

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As an old git my love of the Dalglish double winning side of 85-86 will be hard to surpass, pipping the Blueshite for both trophies with a rookie Manager!
That being said, I do quite like this bunch!
The Dalglish side would probably have won another European Cup but for the ban. I think they were that good.
The current side is immense, and to be honest its nice to have a side that we can compare with the greats of past years.
We had wildnerness years that can be consigned to the bin, now we have a side worthy of celebrating.
 

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Mane is the goal scorer of this team... why do you think he is pissed whenever he plays with salah. Salah will get his goal by himself and dosen’t need a pass here or there. He is that skilled. Before mane got injured he was our main goal threat together with bobby. Salah does his own thing. When salah is playing at his best mane suffered and was a shadow of himself goal threat wise. Everything ran through salah. We play different now. We don’t rely on 1 goal scorer to put in the work every game.
Salah has been here a season less. Has both more goals for us and more assists. Mane hasn't scored more goals than Salah any season they've been here. Last season Salah made more key passes to Mane than Mane made full stop. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions but yours aren't in line with the evidence.
 

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Salah has been here a season less. Has both more goals for us and more assists. Mane hasn't scored more goals than Salah any season they've been here. Last season Salah made more key passes to Mane than Mane made full stop. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions but yours aren't in line with the evidence.
It’s not just stats. It’s their style of play.... vardy has outscored bobby mane and mo this season so far but does that mean he is the better player? Not in a million years. Even ings has outscored bobby. But he isn’t half the player bobby is.... it’s all relative really.
 

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It’s not just stats. It’s their style of play.... vardy has outscored bobby mane and mo this season so far but does that mean he is the better player? Not in a million years. Even ings has outscored bobby. But he isn’t half the player bobby is.... it’s all relative really.
Actually stats can show what players bring. Just concentrating on one stat (such as goals scored by out an out strikers who play as the focal point for their teams) does not. But your words were "Mane is the goal scorer of this team" which is wrong. The guy with the Premier League (not just current Liverpool or even Liverpool in the Premier League) scoring record and Liverpool's all time best goals to games ratio is the goal scorer on this team. You also talk of Salah like he doesn't pass or join in team play. Since Salah arrived he is the player with the most key passes and assists. Sure Trent will take that from him soon but for now he is the biggest provider in our squad. Show some damn respect. Dirk Kuyt. Cult hero, brilliant guy, competent footballer but give me a break.
 

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Actually stats can show what players bring. Just concentrating on one stat (such as goals scored by out an out strikers who play as the focal point for their teams) does not. But your words were "Mane is the goal scorer of this team" which is wrong. The guy with the Premier League (not just current Liverpool or even Liverpool in the Premier League) scoring record and Liverpool's all time best goals to games ratio is the goal scorer on this team. You also talk of Salah like he doesn't pass or join in team play. Since Salah arrived he is the player with the most key passes and assists. Sure Trent will take that from him soon but for now he is the biggest provider in our squad. Show some damn respect. Dirk Kuyt. Cult hero, brilliant guy, competent footballer but give me a break.
Yes because that is how we used to play before last season and this season. We gave the ball to salah and let him create for others and himself. This Liverpool team is different now attacks come from our fullbacks and bobby who links up play with mane and salah. If you look at last season and this season salah you could say was not the same player as his first season when everything went through him. Mane links up better with bobby compared to mo. That’s why alot of us are frustrated with salah at times because he tends to be greedy and stops the attack and passing by taking on defenders which most of the time just outmuscle him. If mo is on form he is the better player than almost all in the premiership. But if not he does not offer much. Before scoring against Southampton last week a lot of supporters were willing to sell mo in exchange for mbappe or sancho. I for one am against that but hey... it’s being talked about right?
 

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Have you seen salah this season? Have you seen how many goal scoring opportunities wasted because he wanted to shoot instead of passing to mane or bobby? Salah is tremendous don’t get me wrong but just dosen’t fit the style we are playing when everyone is fit.
I was a huge Kuyt fan at the time, and his work rate was second to none, hence him playing a big role in Rafa's teams. So, I'll never ever criticise him, I actually loved him when he was at the club. But Salah is on another planet really, for different reasons:
  • His pace, which allows him to run almost as fast as a ball flying over the pitch. Kuyt in comparison was slow, and couldn't catch an opposing defender by surprise when on the ball. Salah's acceleration powers with or without the ball are stunning.
  • His close control. The way he runs at pace and is able to control a ball and take it immediately in his stride is breath-taking. I don't think that I've ever seen a player who is able to achieve this on such a regular basis. Also, his ability to give two, three defenders the turnaround in the opposing box, somehow finds a way through them and then fires a shot or gives it to a team-mate is again absolutely stunning. Kuyt never had the same technical skill to dribble his way past defenders like Salah does. Often, his first touch would let him down in key moments.
  • Finally, the clinical aspect of Salah shouldn't be underestimated. Look at his last game, and the way he put the ball past the goalie for his first one. It looked so incredibly easy. In fact, it was skill of the highest order. And he has done it so many times for us now... Kuyt, as much as I loved him, wouldn't have been able to do this.
Yes, Salah makes errors at times, makes the wrong choice, choses to shoot instead of passing the ball, or passes the ball when he could shoot. But that's a mere indication that he isn't a next-generation android (as one could be forgiven to think sometimes, when seeing him run at such a high pace) but still very much a human being.

As for Kuyt, I think that Rafa took out of him everything he could have. Those two were a great match for each other. Nowadays, Kuyt would probably be a valuable squad player, and Klopp would love him, no doubt about that. I'd compare him with Milner, who is another one I can't state enough how much I value him, and how big his role has been to transform this club from perennial underachievers to that relentless winning machine we are witnessing now. The mental aspect is huge, and Milner has played a big, big role, we can't thank him enough for that imo. Kuyt could have had a similar impact on the squad.
 

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Yes because that is how we used to play before last season and this season. We gave the ball to salah and let him create for others and himself. This Liverpool team is different now attacks come from our fullbacks and bobby who links up play with mane and salah. If you look at last season and this season salah you could say was not the same player as his first season when everything went through him. Mane links up better with bobby compared to mo. That’s why alot of us are frustrated with salah at times because he tends to be greedy and stops the attack and passing by taking on defenders which most of the time just outmuscle him. If mo is on form he is the better player than almost all in the premiership. But if not he does not offer much. Before scoring against Southampton last week a lot of supporters were willing to sell mo in exchange for mbappe or sancho. I for one am against that but hey... it’s being talked about right?
You realise he has 27 goal contributions this season right? More than anyone else again? 40 last year, 9 more than anyone else. The fact he got 60 in his first year (16 more than anyone else) was mostly due to the fact more opposition were not as prepared for him and weren't having as many dedicated players committed to trying to do something about him. We haven't changed anything he is still our focal point because (guess what?) that's what teams do when they have one of the best in the world on their books. The fact a (worryingly large/vocal) group of LFC fans like you do not fully appreciate how amazing he is and how essential he has been to our recent success is not evidence of anything. Most of those opinions seem to have been formed during the two month period he was playing through an ankle injury and out of form.
 

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I was a huge Kuyt fan at the time, and his work rate was second to none, hence him playing a big role in Rafa's teams. So, I'll never ever criticise him, I actually loved him when he was at the club. But Salah is on another planet really, for different reasons:
  • His pace, which allows him to run almost as fast as a ball flying over the pitch. Kuyt in comparison was slow, and couldn't catch an opposing defender by surprise when on the ball. Salah's acceleration powers with or without the ball are stunning.
  • His close control. The way he runs at pace and is able to control a ball and take it immediately in his stride is breath-taking. I don't think that I've ever seen a player who is able to achieve this on a regular basis. Also, his ability to give two, three defenders the turnaround in the opposing box, somehow finds a way though them and then fires a shot or gives it to a team-mate is again absolutely stunning. Kuyt never had the same technical skill to dribble his way past defenders like Salah does. Often, his first touch would let him down in key moments.
  • Finally, the clinical aspect of Salah shouldn't be underestimated. Look at his last game, and the way he put the ball past the goalie for his first one. It looked so incredibly easy. In fact, it was skill of the highest order. And he has done it so many times for us now... Kuyt, as much as I loved him, wouldn't have been able to do this.
Yes, Salah makes errors at times, makes the wrong choice, choses to shoot instead of passing the ball, or passes the ball when he could shoot. But that's a mere indication that he isn't a next-generation android (as one could be forgiven to think sometimes, when seeing him run at such a high pace) but still very much a human being.

As for Kuyt, I think that Rafa took out of him everything he could have. Those two were a great match for each other. Nowadays, Kuyt would probably be a valuable squad player, and Klopp would love him, no doubt about that. I'd compare him with Milner, who is another one I can't state enough how much I value him, and how big his role has been to transform this club from perennial underachievers to that relentless winning machine we are witnessing now. The mental aspect is huge, and Milner has played a big, big role, we can't thank him enough for that imo. Kuyt could have had a similar impact on the squad.
If salah is on form there is no other player in the league better than him. He proved this in his first season. I hope he can get back to the same level if not better next season. He just isn’t of form since last season. He will show his brilliance once in a while like against Southampton.... just hope he is more consistent nowadays. I’m not complaining though if it means winning the league with this version of salah then so be it
 

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If salah is on form there is no other player in the league better than him. He proved this in his first season. I hope he can get back to the same level if not better next season. He just isn’t of form since last season. He will show his brilliance once in a while like against Southampton.... just hope he is more consistent nowadays. I’m not complaining though if it means winning the league with this version of salah then so be it
The reason why he doesn't score as much as in his first season is because teams have learnt to double up on him. That's also why Mané and Bobby have been allowed to shine: he'll be double checked, but it will open up space for his team-mates.

For an opposing team, it must be an absolute nightmare to play against us btw. You chose to double-check on Salah? Bobby and Mané will eat you alive. If you try to nullify Bobby by marking him out of the game, Salah and Mané will play Cat and Mouse with the remaining defenders. And if a team by any chance manages to defend really well against those three, then Ox, Hendo, Gini, Trent or Robbo will pop up and tear them apart... :LOL:

Also, why did Mo suddenly look the part during the second half? Because Southampton had to chase the game after our first goal, moved up a bit, and then...
 

ScouseLand

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You realise he has 27 goal contributions this season right? More than anyone else again? 40 last year, 9 more than anyone else. The fact he got 60 in his first year (16 more than anyone else) was mostly due to the fact more opposition were not as prepared for him and weren't having as many dedicated players committed to trying to do something about him. We haven't changed anything he is still our focal point because (guess what?) that's what teams do when they have one of the best in the world on their books. The fact a (worryingly large/vocal) group of LFC fans like you do not fully appreciate how amazing he is and how essential he has been to our recent success is not evidence of anything. Most of those opinions seem to have been formed during the two month period he was playing through an ankle injury and out of form.
You do know salah was not part of the team of the year for both uefa and pfa right? He won’t most probably be nominated as well this year as well. He has been out of form by his standard since last season really. Mane even beat him to the african player of the year.
 

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The reason why he doesn't score as much as in his first season is because teams have learnt to double up on him. That's also why Mané and Bobby have been allowed to shine: he'll be double checked, but it will open up space for his team-mates.

For an opposing team, it must be an absolute nightmare to play against us btw. You chose to double-check on Salah? Bobby and Mané will eat you alive. If you try to nullify Bobby by marking him out of the game, Salah and Mané will play Cat and Mouse with the remaining defenders. And if a team by any chance manages to defend really well against those three, then Ox, Hendo, Gini, Trent or Robbo will pop up and tear them apart... :LOL:

Also, why did Mo suddenly look the part during the second half? Because Southampton had to chase the game after our first goal, moved up a bit, and then...
Mo gets fouled so much and never gets anything for it. He basically has a defender with their arms around him for 90% of the game, any other player would be flopping on the ground and getting free kicks.. Not Mo.

He really is one of the best players in football.
 

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The reason why he doesn't score as much as in his first season is because teams have learnt to double up on him. That's also why Mané and Bobby have been allowed to shine: he'll be double checked, but it will open up space for his team-mates.

For an opposing team, it must be an absolute nightmare to play against us btw. You chose to double-check on Salah? Bobby and Mané will eat you alive. If you try to nullify Bobby by marking him out of the game, Salah and Mané will play Cat and Mouse with the remaining defenders. And if a team by any chance manages to defend really well against those three, then Ox, Hendo, Gini, Trent or Robbo will pop up and tear them apart... :LOL:

Also, why did Mo suddenly look the part during the second half? Because Southampton had to chase the game after our first goal, moved up a bit, and then...
Even at salah’s worst i would not exchange him for any player in world football as of the moment. And that includes mbappe or sancho. Our front 3 is the best in world football.
 

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The reason why he doesn't score as much as in his first season is because teams have learnt to double up on him. That's also why Mané and Bobby have been allowed to shine: he'll be double checked, but it will open up space for his team-mates.

For an opposing team, it must be an absolute nightmare to play against us btw. You chose to double-check on Salah? Bobby and Mané will eat you alive. If you try to nullify Bobby by marking him out of the game, Salah and Mané will play Cat and Mouse with the remaining defenders. And if a team by any chance manages to defend really well against those three, then Ox, Hendo, Gini, Trent or Robbo will pop up and tear them apart... :LOL:

Also, why did Mo suddenly look the part during the second half? Because Southampton had to chase the game after our first goal, moved up a bit, and then...
Yep an absolutely key component of our league form last year and this is that teams set up scared, they focus on trying to combat Salah due to what he did 2 years ago. Other teams can't cope with the rest of our team or hurt us if so much of their focus is centred on trying to deal with Salah. We wouldn't have got to 100 out of 102 points if every opposition we faced hadn't been working so hard in training, match prep and on the Salah threat.
 

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Mo gets fouled so much and never gets anything for it. He basically has a defender with their arms around him for 90% of the game, any other player would be flopping on the ground and getting free kicks.. Not Mo.

He really is one of the best players in football.
I think that’s because rival fans used to brand him as a diver last season. Refs are reluctant to call the foul on him eventhough its so blatant
 

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Yep an absolutely key component of our league form last year and this is that teams set up scared, they focus on trying to combat Salah due to what he did 2 years ago. Other teams can't cope with the rest of our team or hurt us if so much of their focus is centred on trying to deal with Salah. We wouldn't have got to 100 out of 102 points if every opposition we faced hadn't been working so hard in training, match prep and on the Salah threat.
We were supposed to get all 102 pts if the ref called the foul on origi against the scum.
 

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You do know salah was not part of the team of the year for both uefa and pfa right? He won’t most probably be nominated as well this year as well. He has been out of form by his standard since last season really. Mane even beat him to the african player of the year.
Underappreciated does not equal not good.

Let me break it down for you;

In form Salah>out of form Salah=in form Mane>out of form Mane.

Salah isn't getting recognition because he has done better and set a high bar. Other players playing in the best form of their lives are therefore getting recognition for being as good or even worse than Salah is currently performing.
 

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Underappreciated does not equal not good.

Let me break it down for you;

In form Salah>out of form Salah=in form Mane>out of form Mane.

Salah isn't getting recognition because he has done better and set a high bar. Other players playing in the best form of their lives are therefore getting recognition for being as good or even worse than Salah is currently performing.
That i can i agree on. On form salah is the best foreign goal scorer the premiership has ever seen. I guess the reason i can compare mane and salah now is because salah is out of form. 2017 salah hands down was our best player up there with prime torres and prime suarez
 

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If salah is on form there is no other player in the league better than him. He proved this in his first season. I hope he can get back to the same level if not better next season. He just isn’t of form since last season. He will show his brilliance once in a while like against Southampton.... just hope he is more consistent nowadays. I’m not complaining though if it means winning the league with this version of salah then so be it
If 14 goals and 6 assists by 1st Feb is inconsistent mate, then we're really pushing the bar to levels unattainable consistently by anyone not named Messi and Ronaldo. I blame the media narrative after Burnley for this sort of thinking.
 

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Speak for yourself mate, the man is a legend, and I for one recognise the absolute ridiculousness of what he is achieving.

Seems like a top human as well.

Further on that, I think most of the perceived lack of appreciation you refer to is more in line with people actually talking up guys like bobby firmino and Jordan Henderson, it shouldn’t be confused with not appreciating Salah, it’s almost as if the generic match reports from media outlets give Mo the big praise, and a lot of us are more like ‘don’t forget about what sadio brings ‘ etc etc.

Shouldn’t be confused with not rating Salah though
Well you did ask!
 

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The Dalglish side would probably have won another European Cup but for the ban.
Another?

They’d have won two or three. Indeed, we should have won the Heysel match itself, despite everything that was going on off the field- Gillespie’s foul on Boniek was well outside the area for a start and we had a couple of promising attacks brought back with dubious calls.
 

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If 14 goals and 6 assists by 1st Feb is inconsistent mate, then we're really pushing the bar to levels unattainable consistently by anyone not named Messi and Ronaldo. I blame the media narrative after Burnley for this sort of thinking.
He will probably get his 3rd golden boot on a trot. He still doesn't even take that many free kicks and penalties. He doesn't get injured against Real Madrid and we have 7 CL trophies not 6 too. We had them playing scared.
 

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If 14 goals and 6 assists by 1st Feb is inconsistent mate, then we're really pushing the bar to levels unattainable consistently by anyone not named Messi and Ronaldo. I blame the media narrative after Burnley for this sort of thinking.
Well that is the standard we’ve set now. And i love it!!!!! We should aim to be the best team in the land with the best players.