Jürgen Klopp: 2018 - 2019

C

Caradoc

Guest
My mate sat next to me at this game said we are playing diamond (Vs Red Star at anfield). Fab was holding, gini and mane either side of midfield, with Shaqiri behind Salah and Bobby. I didn't see it myself, but he was adamant that was the system we were playing.

Strange because Klopp himself said we were playing a double ‘6’ system with Gini and Fabinho i.e. the inverse triangle as my son calls it with Shaqiri in front of the other two. That makes a lot more sense to me because it compensates for Shaqiri’s defensive issues.
 

RazvanLFC

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 26, 2008
Messages
1,508
Results have been far better, performances not so much, which is indicative of the quality that has been injected in the team. Playing just enough to win against average opposition isn't necessarily a bad thing; on the contrary, it's a smart tactic as long as it doesn't lead to complacency. Against stronger teams however we need to be more proactive, more intense, more like last year. The performances against City, Napoli and Arsenal weren't good enough.
But the performances compared to the start of the last season are better. As are the results as you mentioned, also salah's form is better not by much, but better than the start of the last season. Yet we compare these performances from the second part of the last season, to the performances of the start of this season after a World Cup.
I thought that against City we were good, but maybe the game at Napoli was the worst I've seen in a while from the reds. Credit to Ancelotti there. Against Arsenal we could've won, but we could've lost, can't hide my disappointment with the result, but it was the right one...
Maybe we'll see the same type of performances like last season, after january or february.
 

Fowler's Left Peg

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 4, 2015
Messages
159
We have improved this season, no doubt about it.

Yes we are not as swash buckling as last season but the integration of new players could be contributing not forgetting the fact we are coming off the back of a World Cup year.

I expect us to finish the season stronger then we start it, whether that will be enough who knows, I don't think anyone could live with City if they repeat last season, we need them to drop off.
 

Red_Jedi

Anfield kick about
Joined
May 30, 2017
Messages
1,578
Results have been far better, performances not so much, which is indicative of the quality that has been injected in the team. Playing just enough to win against average opposition isn't necessarily a bad thing; on the contrary, it's a smart tactic as long as it doesn't lead to complacency. Against stronger teams however we need to be more proactive, more intense, more like last year. The performances against City, Napoli and Arsenal weren't good enough.
For me on the only limp performance was against Napoli. Against Arsenal, we should have been 2-0 and the game becomes different. City, we are the only team they haven't scored against this season... which takes something.

The other games like Leicester, Tottenham, Brighton - once we took the league, we pretty much closed up shop - which we weren't doing last year.
 

Gone Kloppo

Formerly known as Ʒan
Joined
Jul 15, 2016
Messages
2,051
Strange because Klopp himself said we were playing a double ‘6’ system with Gini and Fabinho i.e. the inverse triangle as my son calls it with Shaqiri in front of the other two. That makes a lot more sense to me because it compensates for Shaqiri’s defensive issues.
Yep. I don't know how it was presented on the team sheets before the match started, but certainly we are playing with a double 6. Not that they sit side by side but one of them is the deeper when one steps out to confront the ball carrier. I saw plenty of occasions where Gini was our deepest player, and plenty where Fab was. Klopp has said that although the formation is different to the 433 we usually play, apart from the kickoff its very similar in terms of the roles the players play. When we played with a right and left mid in front of a DM, I don't think that is miles different to our double 6, just that two players switch that role depending on what position the other 6 is on the field and the cover he has to provide. In fact, most positions save the back 4 and GK interchange at least with one other position. Football these days isn't some static position you can draw on paper and expect that player to be there. Its far more fluid, particularly with forwards and midfielders.
 

Commando

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 23, 2016
Messages
1,699
Yep. I don't know how it was presented on the team sheets before the match started, but certainly we are playing with a double 6. Not that they sit side by side but one of them is the deeper when one steps out to confront the ball carrier. I saw plenty of occasions where Gini was our deepest player, and plenty where Fab was. Klopp has said that although the formation is different to the 433 we usually play, apart from the kickoff its very similar in terms of the roles the players play. When we played with a right and left mid in front of a DM, I don't think that is miles different to our double 6, just that two players switch that role depending on what position the other 6 is on the field and the cover he has to provide. In fact, most positions save the back 4 and GK interchange at least with one other position. Football these days isn't some static position you can draw on paper and expect that player to be there. Its far more fluid, particularly with forwards and midfielders.
I miss the good old days of watching football when the only two choices of formation were 4-4-2 or 4-3-3. It's so confusing now. Double 6s, false 9s, midfield diamonds inverted Christmas trees. I much prefer it when I can just say "that was good/shite". I wonder is it anything to do with the fact that I'm not a gamer and have never played Football Manager?
 

Gone Kloppo

Formerly known as Ʒan
Joined
Jul 15, 2016
Messages
2,051
I miss the good old days of watching football when the only two choices of formation were 4-4-2 or 4-3-3. It's so confusing now. Double 6s, false 9s, midfield diamonds inverted Christmas trees. I much prefer it when I can just say "that was good/shite". I wonder is it anything to do with the fact that I'm not a gamer and have never played Football Manager?
Yeah I don't have a clue either. Unfortunately I am not a regular match goer, so can't spend the game tracking exactly what players are doing on the pitch. And even if I was a regular match goer I think I'd be far to wrapped up in the game to be tracking particular players.

Only way is to listen to a Klopp post-matcher and then watch a few replays of the match (if it isnt the one vs Napoli..) to try and understand what is going on.
 

Red Armada

TIA Regular
Joined
Jan 3, 2008
Messages
2,828
I actually thought we played really, really well against City. They are smashing five and six past everyone, and we held them out.

Also thought we had the better of the first half against Arsenal, we certainly had the better chances and were unlucky to head in on level terms.
But the performances compared to the start of the last season are better. As are the results as you mentioned, also salah's form is better not by much, but better than the start of the last season. Yet we compare these performances from the second part of the last season, to the performances of the start of this season after a World Cup.
I thought that against City we were good, but maybe the game at Napoli was the worst I've seen in a while from the reds. Credit to Ancelotti there. Against Arsenal we could've won, but we could've lost, can't hide my disappointment with the result, but it was the right one...
Maybe we'll see the same type of performances like last season, after january or february.
For me on the only limp performance was against Napoli. Against Arsenal, we should have been 2-0 and the game becomes different. City, we are the only team they haven't scored against this season... which takes something.

The other games like Leicester, Tottenham, Brighton - once we took the league, we pretty much closed up shop - which we weren't doing last year.
Can't really comment on the Napoli game as I didn't watch it, but from what I've read the same issues were prevalent as against Arsenal and City. Mainly being poor in possession. Too slow, too cumbersome with very little fluidity especially among the front three. We have also been mediocre at counterattacking, which is suprising to say the least.

Everyone agrees that we got what we deserved against Napoli which was nothing. Against Arsenal I thought that we were dominated for large periods. We got away with it because we have high quality players, whereas Arsenal have to field Mustafi and Holding at the back. City having experienced first hand what it means to play openly against us sat back suprising just about everyone and we created almost nothing by resorting to the same unispired stuff of moving the ball laterally at a snail's pace. They weren't much better going forward but they did have the best chance of the game but thankfully Mahrez skied his penalty.
 

shachart

"You're supposed to help people that need a bit."
Joined
Oct 26, 2009
Messages
1,987
Each to their own!

But here are 3 comparisons:

1. 1st 11 games of last season compared to this season

Last Season - W5 D4 L2 Goals For 21 GA 17 Points 19
This Season - W8 D3 L0 GF 21 GA 5 Points 27

2. Same match comparison season v season as done by @Fowler's Left Peg here: https://forums.thisisanfield.com/threads/season-comparison-2017-18-v-2018-2019.25969/

Last Season 23 points
This season 27 points with a goal difference of +4 (compared to same matches last season)

3. Last 11 games of last season Vs first 11 games of this season
Last Season W5 D4 L2 GF 23 GA 7 Points 19
This season W8 D3 L0 GF 21 GA 5 Points 27

We've made progress across all 3 of these comparisons.
"Lies, damn lies and statistics ". Can't remeber who's quote this is.

You are right, results have been great compared to each way you can think of.
What do your eyes tell you ? Are we playing as well as last season ?
Put stats aside. Last season, let's say February and onwards ( VVD in, Coutinho out ), we played probably the most enjoyable football in Europe, high press, breaknecking speed attack, beautiful combinations between our front three. That was a team that was playing to its full potential.
When you look at us play now, you don't get that feeling any more. After each match you see the same comments,: grinding results, attack still not clicking etc. You and everybody else knows this team is at second gear at best.

Every team has it's off days, everyteam has a slump at some point. If after 15 matches from the start of the season we are still playing like the first 2, then I would say there is cause for concern.
 

Zinedine Biscan

Half-man, half-Biscuit
Joined
Jul 31, 2009
Messages
22,209
I miss the good old days of watching football when the only two choices of formation were 4-4-2 or 4-3-3. It's so confusing now. Double 6s, false 9s, midfield diamonds inverted Christmas trees. I much prefer it when I can just say "that was good/shite". I wonder is it anything to do with the fact that I'm not a gamer and have never played Football Manager?
I don't mind it. I think in part it's down to the English game becoming more tactically sophisticated with top coaches from the continent (Pep, Klopp etc) bringing new ideas with them, and in some cases just putting a label on something that was already being done - there are probably loads of strikers down the years who were effectively 'false 9s' before the phrase was coined, we just thought of them as deep-lying strikers, maybe someone like Sheringham or Dalglish even?

In some case the ideas aren't new exactly but have taken a while to bed in - Rafa's 4-2-3-1 formation was quite radical at the time, and in some quarters he was ridiculed for playing a striker in a non-striking position (Kuyt for instance), when it's almost commonplace these days. On a previous forum myself and Limiescouse posted on, we coined the phrase 'stringer' (half striker, half-winger) to describe these players.

Similarly I can remember the first time I heard about a wide-player being played on their opposite side... I think it was Pahars although if not then someone of his era at Southampton, right footed winger played on the left or vice versa, and the media thought the manager at the time was nuts. Wingers go on their right sides and scamper up the line before belting a cross into the box, that's just the way it's done, dammit! Nowadays it's again something many if not most teams do on a regular basis, ourselves included.

Game is a lot more sophisticated these days with a lot more nuance in terms of what is required of players in different parts of the pitch, and also the media saturation and willingness to discuss those ideas rather than just scoff at some new foreign ridiculousness as in times past.
 

Red_Jedi

Anfield kick about
Joined
May 30, 2017
Messages
1,578
"Lies, damn lies and statistics ". Can't remeber who's quote this is.

You are right, results have been great compared to each way you can think of.
What do your eyes tell you ? Are we playing as well as last season ?
Put stats aside. Last season, let's say February and onwards ( VVD in, Coutinho out ), we played probably the most enjoyable football in Europe, high press, breaknecking speed attack, beautiful combinations between our front three. That was a team that was playing to its full potential.
When you look at us play now, you don't get that feeling any more. After each match you see the same comments,: grinding results, attack still not clicking etc. You and everybody else knows this team is at second gear at best.

Every team has it's off days, everyteam has a slump at some point. If after 15 matches from the start of the season we are still playing like the first 2, then I would say there is cause for concern.
Well my eyes tell me that we've had a number of games that we have won, that we should have won by even more but were a bit more measured and tighter - eg, West Ham, Leicester, Tottenham, PSG, Red Star, Brighton, Cardiff, Palace, Southampton

Then there were games like Huddersfield, Chelsea in League, Arsenal, Man City where we just about scraped a result - but probably fair.

The only real disappointing performance and result was Napoli. Chelsea in the cup was a weird one because we made so many changes and Studge missed an open goal, could have been 2-0 up, but end up losing 2-1.

I always compare the beginning of seasons together. End of the season you sometimes have different priorities. End of last season, do you remember Stoke, West Brom, Everton and Chelsea? - the performances were rubbish, but they were sandwiched in-between incredible Champions Leagues games - and finishing Top 4 was the only priority (in league). So I don't think we are that poor compared to last season, but know that we have more to come. It was only last week that we scored 8 goals in 2 games.

Anyway, each to their own.
 
Last edited:

i_still_miss_fowler

Open Your Eyes Morty!
Moderator
Joined
Jun 23, 2005
Messages
7,086
"Lies, damn lies and statistics ". Can't remeber who's quote this is.

You are right, results have been great compared to each way you can think of.
What do your eyes tell you ? Are we playing as well as last season ?
Put stats aside. Last season, let's say February and onwards ( VVD in, Coutinho out ), we played probably the most enjoyable football in Europe, high press, breaknecking speed attack, beautiful combinations between our front three. That was a team that was playing to its full potential.
When you look at us play now, you don't get that feeling any more. After each match you see the same comments,: grinding results, attack still not clicking etc. You and everybody else knows this team is at second gear at best.

Every team has it's off days, everyteam has a slump at some point. If after 15 matches from the start of the season we are still playing like the first 2, then I would say there is cause for concern.
What I am uncertain about is how much is tactical and how much is form.

Form wise Salah and Firmino have generally been poor compared to last season. On Salah IMO he had been in recovery. Uncertain if it was physical, mental, or both. I noticed early in the season he was not working as hard closing down the space. When one of the forwards does not press the whole system falls down (Mané and Firmino can easily be bypassed). This has noticeably improved in the last 2 or 3 games.

Firmino I don’t know. He started OK but has been way off the pace in a few games. It’s why Shaqiri has looked so good coming on because in effect he is providing the link up play/ clever balls we expect of Firmino.

Simultaneously or maybe because of this, Klopp has been far more pragmatic. Think about how he subbed Shaqiri at halftime after being the star man and being 3 up.

The real question is can we maintain winning games the way we are playing. To be honest I don’t know. However that’s largely because how our defence and keeper are exceeding my expectations.
 

redbj

hurry up, July 1st, let's get the show on the road
Joined
Jun 23, 2003
Messages
17,339
Strange because Klopp himself said we were playing a double ‘6’ system with Gini and Fabinho i.e. the inverse triangle as my son calls it with Shaqiri in front of the other two. That makes a lot more sense to me because it compensates for Shaqiri’s defensive issues.
What’s a double six / inverse triangle?
 

Iluvatar

Allez Allez Allez
Joined
Sep 13, 2015
Messages
7,068
What I am uncertain about is how much is tactical and how much is form.

Form wise Salah and Firmino have generally been poor compared to last season. On Salah IMO he had been in recovery. Uncertain if it was physical, mental, or both. I noticed early in the season he was not working as hard closing down the space. When one of the forwards does not press the whole system falls down (Mané and Firmino can easily be bypassed). This has noticeably improved in the last 2 or 3 games.

Firmino I don’t know. He started OK but has been way off the pace in a few games. It’s why Shaqiri has looked so good coming on because in effect he is providing the link up play/ clever balls we expect of Firmino.

Simultaneously or maybe because of this, Klopp has been far more pragmatic. Think about how he subbed Shaqiri at halftime after being the star man and being 3 up.

The real question is can we maintain winning games the way we are playing. To be honest I don’t know. However that’s largely because how our defence and keeper are exceeding my expectations.
Surely with Firmino is fatigue? He's played 69 games since the start of last season including a summer where he had a tiny break. He has probably the hardest job in the team in terms of energy requirements also.

Its one of the main reasons that despite my love for Sturridge we missed a trick not bringing in a player who can rotate with Firmino without any drop in the relentless pressing he provides (amongst other skills).
 

shachart

"You're supposed to help people that need a bit."
Joined
Oct 26, 2009
Messages
1,987
What I am uncertain about is how much is tactical and how much is form.

Form wise Salah and Firmino have generally been poor compared to last season. On Salah IMO he had been in recovery. Uncertain if it was physical, mental, or both. I noticed early in the season he was not working as hard closing down the space. When one of the forwards does not press the whole system falls down (Mané and Firmino can easily be bypassed). This has noticeably improved in the last 2 or 3 games.

Firmino I don’t know. He started OK but has been way off the pace in a few games. It’s why Shaqiri has looked so good coming on because in effect he is providing the link up play/ clever balls we expect of Firmino.

Simultaneously or maybe because of this, Klopp has been far more pragmatic. Think about how he subbed Shaqiri at halftime after being the star man and being 3 up.

The real question is can we maintain winning games the way we are playing. To be honest I don’t know. However that’s largely because how our defence and keeper are exceeding my expectations.
Like all things, I think it is down to more than one reason. I think Klopp's tinkering with Firmino's position has backfired. I also think that not having Hendo has probably hurt us more than we realized. The pressure to deliver might also be taking a toll on lads.

The thing the troubles me the most was that last season it seemed everybody was enjoying themselves, and whne I look now on the players it looks like the "fun" part has somewhat went away, but this just be me imagining things.
 

shachart

"You're supposed to help people that need a bit."
Joined
Oct 26, 2009
Messages
1,987
Well my eyes tell me that we've had a number of games that we have won, that we should have won by even more but were a bit more measured and tighter - eg, West Ham, Leicester, Tottenham, PSG, Red Star, Brighton, Cardiff, Palace, Southampton

Then there were games like Huddersfield, Chelsea in League, Arsenal, Man City where we just about scraped a result - but probably fair.

The only real disappointing performance and result was Napoli. Chelsea in the cup was a weird one because we made so many changes and Studge missed an open goal, could have been 2-0 up, but end up losing 2-1.

I always compare the beginning of seasons together. End of the season you sometimes have different priorities. End of last season, do you remember Stoke, West Brom, Everton and Chelsea? - the performances were rubbish, but they were sandwiched in-between incredible Champions Leagues games - and finishing Top 4 was the only priority (in league). So I don't think we are that poor compared to last season, but know that we have more to come. It was only last week that we scored 8 goals in 2 games.

Anyway, each to their own.
Now that you've seen the Red Star match, you still think we are doing well ?

I am sorry if this came out as gloating. I hat eseeing us lose, and even more so like this. but his is exactly what I meant by if something doesn't change, the results will start to reflect that.
 

C

Caradoc

Guest
Now that you've seen the Red Star match, you still think we are doing well ?

I am sorry if this came out as gloating. I hat eseeing us lose, and even more so like this. but his is exactly what I meant by if something doesn't change, the results will start to reflect that.

Yes its coming out as gloating and its not really very clever. Sorry, but irrespective of the manner of the defeat, it doesn’t change an awful lot in terms of where we are, or the huge progress we’ve made under Klopp.
 

Red_Jedi

Anfield kick about
Joined
May 30, 2017
Messages
1,578
Now that you've seen the Red Star match, you still think we are doing well ?

I am sorry if this came out as gloating. I hat eseeing us lose, and even more so like this. but his is exactly what I meant by if something doesn't change, the results will start to reflect that.
I think if this continues for a few more matches than you have a point.

But that match could have been any other scoreline - it’s not like we didn’t create anything.

We also had 3 players start with not much match time between them... which may have contributed to the 1st half defensive display.

Red star actually have a very good home record. We are not out of it, sometimes teams need wake up calls. Hopefully this is it. I still think we are making good progress from last season.
 

Iluvatar

Allez Allez Allez
Joined
Sep 13, 2015
Messages
7,068
Leaving Shaqiri at home for footballing reasons was a fucking horrible mistake Jurgen. Not only did it give their crowd round 1 win, it meant we had to endure fucking Lallana.
 

Red Armada

TIA Regular
Joined
Jan 3, 2008
Messages
2,828
Leaving Shaqiri at home for footballing reasons was a fucking horrible mistake Jurgen. Not only did it give their crowd round 1 win, it meant we had to endure fucking Lallana.
The ones missing are always considered the problem.
It's a collective issue, Shaqiri or any player by his own wouldn't make a much of a difference when the team as a whole is dysfuntional.
 



Iluvatar

Allez Allez Allez
Joined
Sep 13, 2015
Messages
7,068
The ones missing are always considered the problem.
It's a collective issue, Shaqiri or any player by his own wouldn't make a much of a difference when the team as a whole is dysfuntional.
I don't agree, the team is crying out for a link player.

Our attack/midfield (in my opinion) is dysfunctional because no-one is driving from midfield into attack (something Oxlade was doing to fantastic effect). That player who operates between the oppositions defense/midfield causes space for our front 3 to operate. Our midfield (when Milner, Gini, Henderson, Lallana (even Keita for the most part so far) play) is far far too static, they prefer to pass it around and drift wide to accept the ball, pass to the already marked fullback and back it comes.. Rinse and repeat all game. When you drop in a player who plays on the turn and firsts instinct is to drive forward you quickly put the opposition onto the back foot, their central defense who were originally sitting 2 men on Firmino now has an option of staying or pushing out to combat your no.10 running towards them (remember Oxlade v's City?) If they stay the no.10 can shoot from distance, if one of them goes the backline is now fragmented and space opens up for our super mobile front 3.

Without that player Firmino is coming deep to provide that link himself, which causes huge problems as there are even less players in the box, and if he drops without a midfielder pushing beyond him (which isn't happening) it's easy for a central defender to push onto him or pass him onto a midfielder. Firmino then has to pick up the ball deep and is typically faced with 2-3 players ahead.

It is no surprise that we started smashing teams from November last season when Oxlade truly started to come into his own. It's also no surprise we have been toothless in attack since he got injured in Rome..

So yes in my opinion 1 player is the difference, a huge difference. Fingers crossed Keita/Shaqiri step up and claim that spot as we are marginal tweaks away from last seasons scintillating play imo.
 
C

Caradoc

Guest
I don't agree, the team is crying out for a link player.

Our attack/midfield (in my opinion) is dysfunctional because no-one is driving from midfield into attack (something Oxlade was doing to fantastic effect). That player who operates between the oppositions defense/midfield causes space for our front 3 to operate. Our midfield (when Milner, Gini, Henderson, Lallana (even Keita for the most part so far) play) is far far too static, they prefer to pass it around and drift wide to accept the ball, pass to the already marked fullback and back it comes.. Rinse and repeat all game. When you drop in a player who plays on the turn and firsts instinct is to drive forward you quickly put the opposition onto the back foot, their central defense who were originally sitting 2 men on Firmino now has an option of staying or pushing out to combat your no.10 running towards them (remember Oxlade v's City?) If they stay the no.10 can shoot from distance, if one of them goes the backline is now fragmented and space opens up for our super mobile front 3.

Without that player Firmino is coming deep to provide that link himself, which causes huge problems as there are even less players in the box, and if he drops without a midfielder pushing beyond him (which isn't happening) it's easy for a central defender to push onto him or pass him onto a midfielder. Firmino then has to pick up the ball deep and is typically faced with 2-3 players ahead.

It is no surprise that we started smashing teams from November last season when Oxlade truly started to come into his own. It's also no surprise we have been toothless in attack since he got injured in Rome..

So yes in my opinion 1 player is the difference, a huge difference. Fingers crossed Keita/Shaqiri step up and claim that spot as we are marginal tweaks away from last seasons scintillating play imo.

Have to agree with this. I was hoping that Keita could take over AOC’s role in his absence. Its early days yet. The Ox took a good few months to get up a full head of steam so we need to give young Naby enough time to do the same.
 

RedBaron

Curse you RedBaron!!!!
Joined
Nov 6, 2006
Messages
2,441
It’s all about balance.
Three years, three finals and three losses.
He’s try to tighten up the defence, which in general he has done, and keep hold of a lead or control a game without heavy metal football, which hasn’t been quite so successful.
It will be ok, not so much about players, more about game management.
 

theres always tommorrow

If we win it this year I’m changing my name tag
Joined
Nov 13, 2010
Messages
6,081
It’s a strange situation we find ourselves in. Second top of the league and in with a great chance of qualifying for the play offs in the CL but completely pissed about our (recent) performances.

I think the boss is making mistakes but he’s still got this. We need a squad that can be consistent and I actually think we have but last night team selection was just the wrong options. On another day DS would have scored a worldie and Matip would have head butted the ball through the back of the net but for that you need a confident platform and control of the game. We never had that.

Red Star actually countered our tactics really well with high energy determination. If we had controlled the ball and frustrated them it would have left huge gaps at the back as they pressed for a result. We just didn’t command the midfield either defensively or offensively.

I reckon that Gomez and Hendo would have made a big difference in the first half but we know why they were not played or present. It happens but it’s not a reason to be too worried. JK can sort this and get us back on track.

A few games of high energy heavy metal footy is probably the order of the day for now. Get the confidence back and feel good factor. Then sort out the rest of the season with team selections suited to the situation.

He’s learned a lot about this squad in the last few games. My guess is that he now understands how he can play them.
 

Red_Jedi

Anfield kick about
Joined
May 30, 2017
Messages
1,578
It’s a strange situation we find ourselves in. Second top of the league and in with a great chance of qualifying for the play offs in the CL but completely pissed about our (recent) performances.

I think the boss is making mistakes but he’s still got this. We need a squad that can be consistent and I actually think we have but last night team selection was just the wrong options. On another day DS would have scored a worldie and Matip would have head butted the ball through the back of the net but for that you need a confident platform and control of the game. We never had that.

Red Star actually countered our tactics really well with high energy determination. If we had controlled the ball and frustrated them it would have left huge gaps at the back as they pressed for a result. We just didn’t command the midfield either defensively or offensively.

I reckon that Gomez and Hendo would have made a big difference in the first half but we know why they were not played or present. It happens but it’s not a reason to be too worried. JK can sort this and get us back on track.

A few games of high energy heavy metal footy is probably the order of the day for now. Get the confidence back and feel good factor. Then sort out the rest of the season with team selections suited to the situation.

He’s learned a lot about this squad in the last few games. My guess is that he now understands how he can play them.
At this point last season, we had drawn to Sevilla and also Spartak in the CL. We had lost PL matches to Man City and Spurs, and drawn to Burnley, Watford, Newcastle and United.

We are much better off in the league, and a little bit worse in the CL - but all in our hands. If we beat PSG away then we will have qualified, if we draw then it goes to the last game where we most likely will have to win.

I think we are in an ok place, and Klopp's teams usually improve as the season wears on... We still to see the best out of Keita, Fabinho and Shaqiri, and at the same time he's trying to get the best out of Studge and Lallana - who do have something to offer still but have no game rhythm.

It'll be interesting how it all unfolds.