Kai Havertz (AM) Bayer 04 Leverkusen

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With @Mascot88 's blessing, my first foray in a player rumour thread. You all can thank me later and in the meantime, I distinctly hope not to have an @Nikola effect on proceedings.

No links to the OP but as we know there have been links, tenuous or otherwise, to the player. As mentioned before, I really admire the player and think he is a rising star of the game. So without any further ado, have at it.
 

The Infamous

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Wasn’t sure about Havertz but the more compilations of him I watch the more I think he could be our Fernando Torres only difference is we have a great team now something we didn’t have when we made that gargantuan signing back then. He has a lot of strings to his bow I like that he is back to midfield this season and is controlling games with passes and take ons. Last season his best season where he played as a false 9. He would add another dimension to attack(firmino replica) and midfield(pure Kevin de bruyne in midfield) Preferred Sancho to Havertz but I have changed my mind. Mbappe isn’t probably possible so Havertz will do :)
 

Cologne-Liverpool

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Excellent player, major talent, fairly versatile, pretty unsual for such a fairly tall player - on that basis I certainly wouldn't mind us getting him.
He'll cost a lot though and whether or not we really need him that badly or have other priorities I'm not so sure about. Generally a lot more relaxed about transfers these days.
 

cynicaloldgit

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Good player but not worth the rumoured £100m+. Besides, signing him would only block Curtis Jones’ progression.

Pass.
 

jgw_geneseo

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Good player but not worth the rumoured £100m+. Besides, signing him would only block Curtis Jones’ progression.

Pass.
Where would Kai play? Is he a #8 type? I don't know much about him other than he's supposed to be good.

Where is Jones going to play? Seems like based on line-ups for the U23s he's been in the front 3 instead of in the midfield 3. But maybe he translates to one of the midfield spots. I don't know.
 

cynicaloldgit

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Where would Kai play? Is he a #8 type? I don't know much about him other than he's supposed to be good.

Where is Jones going to play? Seems like based on line-ups for the U23s he's been in the front 3 instead of in the midfield 3. But maybe he translates to one of the midfield spots. I don't know.
They’re both 8/10/LW type players. Probably better in an advanced role centrally (and the prospect of converting them to the false nine role is an intriguing one) but capable of cutting in from the left.

I just see Havertz as an expensive version of a homegrown player we already have.
 

Speckydodge

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Havertz is the type and level of talent that you just don't pass up if you have the chance to get him.
 

nobluff

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Damn, I was supposed to open this thread, anyway, about time.

Everything about this guy impresses me:

  • Speed.
  • Skill.
  • Acceleration.
  • Immaculate first touch and control.
  • Calm and composed.
  • So incredibly versatile.
  • Robust.
  • Strong.
  • Smart without or with ball.
  • No ego issues I know about.
I’ve compared him to a taller, stronger, faster, more skilled version of David Silva. I cringe when people compare him to Ozil, that’s just a lazy comparison. BOOM.

He has to come to Liverpool, we just can’t let a PL rival get him, especially city. He is smart enough to avoid Man U. I sort of hope he is the opposite of Gotze with regards to Klopp’s quote “I cannot make myself 15cm smaller and learn Spanish”. In fact if he speaks to Gotze, he will only play for us if he leaves Germany.

I think this transfer was planned from a funding standpoint, when we didn’t spend much this summer. Jurgen extended his contract, with murmurings that it added a sense of extended stability to any signings. To me this is a connection that I can’t overlook or ignore. I also argue that he won’t block any of the youngsters coming through.

I am sure I have left a few things out. I’m obsessed with this transfer. This is unfortunately not going to be one of those under the radar, ridiculous value transfer, we will have to pay the price. I think it’s sort of like we had to do with Virgil and Alisson, we paid the price, except you can argue that there is no pressing need.

Watch a full game, a highlight video will overlook so much.
 

DeathOrGlory

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I notice he scored a fair few last season, yet only has 4 this season. Any reason for this?
 

JibJab

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Havertz is my #1 target. Ahead of Werner. Ahead of Sancho. Obviously Mbappé would be glorious but I don't think he's moving.

He offers something this club lacks. World class play from the attacking midfield. No disrespect to Keita, Gini, or Ox. They can all have world class games (Gini was there against Man U), but they are not world class players right now. Havertz can be that guy for us.

Sancho would be wonderful but we have world class wingers.

Werner would be fine but we have Bobby and Origi.

Havertz gives us someone who can dribble well, distribute the ball to those forwards and can make glorious runs on his own.

It is true that he hasn't had an amazing season this year, but he's still so very young and will only get better with Klopp and his coaches building him up.

I'm all in favor of him.
 

SithBaare

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Havertz gives us someone who can dribble well, distribute the ball to those forwards and can make glorious runs on his own.
Not at the price point being quoted for him. Ox,Keita,Gini do have those traits too. Also of the opinion that we've just begun to see Keita emerging after so many injuries. We're stocked at that position unless Gini is let go.
 

ILLOK

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Havertz is my #1 target. Ahead of Werner. Ahead of Sancho. Obviously Mbappé would be glorious but I don't think he's moving.

He offers something this club lacks. World class play from the attacking midfield. No disrespect to Keita, Gini, or Ox. They can all have world class games (Gini was there against Man U), but they are not world class players right now. Havertz can be that guy for us.

Sancho would be wonderful but we have world class wingers.

Werner would be fine but we have Bobby and Origi.

Havertz gives us someone who can dribble well, distribute the ball to those forwards and can make glorious runs on his own.

It is true that he hasn't had an amazing season this year, but he's still so very young and will only get better with Klopp and his coaches building him up.

I'm all in favor of him.
Havertz doesn't get in this team ahead of Wijnaldum, not a chance.

We can say Gini isn't world class but he's a mainstay of the best team in the world and has been for the previous 3 years. He's a world class team player.
 

Chewbazza

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Havertz doesn't get in this team ahead of Wijnaldum, not a chance.

We can say Gini isn't world class but he's a mainstay of the best team in the world and has been for the previous 3 years. He's a world class team player.
It might come down to if Gini has unequivocally stated his desire to leave, either this summer or at the end of his contract. We could do worse than bring in Havertz as a replacement.

Again though it creates the same issue as with Sancho, if you can sell the 'transition period' to the player or if he's looking to move to a club where he's a well paid first choice player from day 1.
 

Red over the water

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He’s a very good player and I’d be more than fine if we signed him. I would be slightly concerned about what it might do to Jones, but life is tough at the top, and Havertz will have several teams willing to pay a pretty penny for him, so if we are in there, bring it on. Squad space will be made when Lallana and probably Shaqiri move on.

Im intrigued by Sancho and Werner too. With Havertz that represents three cracking players. We can sign one of them and lose squad men to accommodate. If we are to sign two of them, you would have to think that we would lose a big player to make it happen. So it might be more likely that we sign one of them, e.g. Havertz, and stick with the current excellent front three, but maybe recruit a younger winger, like the lad in France we were linked to this week, to see if we can grow a world class talent that way.
 

nobluff

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Isn't he like 19-20 years old? There's bound to be some variations before he matures.
Havertz doesn’t mature, he mutates.

I notice he scored a fair few last season, yet only has 4 this season. Any reason for this?
Julian Brandt being sold, position change. The player analysis suggest current numbers should be higher. So a case of providing assists and players on receiving end are just not in same quality range, and then reverse for goals (and add position change).
 

Neukolln

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I notice he scored a fair few last season, yet only has 4 this season. Any reason for this?
There was a really good article written by Honigstein back in December on The Athletic app. Unfortunately it’s a pay app or I would repost here. A mate screen shot the text for me. It detailed why Havertz is having an inconsistent year this year, and it mostly comes down to outrageous expectations and pressure as the Bayer side has been inconsistent on the whole.

His goals per 90 averages have dropped but his expected goals average tells a different story. 2018/19 season he overperformed, this year he isn’t. Assists and expected assists are almost identical, as is his shot accuracy.

Again, the season he had last year created outrageously high expectations and in this age of fantasy football and judging a player on a scoreline, If he’s not scoring it causes concern.

Everyone loves fancy/advanced stats these days so taking a deeper dive into his production: His expected goal involvement is 0.36 per 90, he’s also assisting more shots this season, 2.41 up from 1.09, but he’s also attempting and completing more dribbles. He’s now completing 2.1 per 90 while last season he only attempted on average, 2.4.

I credit the article with this research, it’s not my own: he’s still getting into dangerous areas but this year he’s assisting more shots and completing more dribbles. Also attempting and completing more passes in the final 3rd and getting more touches in the penalty area.

The conclusion was that looking at his advanced stats doesn’t show a player that is underperforming or “struggling” but a young and raw player still maturing.

EDIT: Expect his fee to be substantial. Found this blurb; Bayer Leverkusen’s executive director Fernando Carro told Düsseldorf-based newspaper Rheinische Post he expects the club to use Félix’s transfer fee as a measuring stick. “João Félix cost Atlético Madrid €126million – and I definitely don’t see Kai Havertz being worse.”
 
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Semmy

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I would welcome it! He was my target in the recruitment thread by @Broomy

 
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