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Kai Havertz (AM) Bayer 04 Leverkusen

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Hope in your heart

Loyalty and patience, two undervalued concepts.
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No, I don’t think that’s true. It’s hard to judge what is going on, because the circumstances of the City case were unique. They were guilty, and but for a batshit decision by CAS, would have been screwed. I don’t think it’s quite the blueprint for fiddling FFP that people think it is. City got very lucky, behind closed door I’ll think they’ll understand that, and ‘being lucky’ is not really a strategy that any other club is going to be keen to follow.

What I think is happening at Chelsea is that they have a manager they believe in long term, and they are giving him a big summer. They haven’t spent anything for a couple of seasons, they got over 100m in the bank they weren’t allowed to spend, they expect to raise more money through sales, and for all we know they could be planning another couple of fallow years after this summers splurge.

I don’t think they’ll have any trouble meeting FFP.
You still believe that the world is a fair place. Bah... ;) :LOL:
 

jgw_geneseo

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I'm glad he's coming to the premier league. I like watching good players. Was never on the cards for us with everything going on outside of football right now. From a spectator standpoint, the league is always more exciting when there are more than 1 or 2 teams able to actually win the thing.

And he won't fix their obvious flaws, but he may paper over a few of the cracks in the back line. You know, just gotta score more than the other team. It'll be interesting to see who will be top of the pecking order with the attacking talent they are putting together. If he can slot in the middle instead of Abraham or Giroud, that'll be a big upgrade and they'll be very dangerous going forward. Don't watch much of the German league though, so not really sure where he'll play in that team.
 

Lowton_Red

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No, I don’t think that’s true. It’s hard to judge what is going on, because the circumstances of the City case were unique. They were guilty, and but for a batshit decision by CAS, would have been screwed. I don’t think it’s quite the blueprint for fiddling FFP that people think it is. City got very lucky, behind closed door I’ll think they’ll understand that, and ‘being lucky’ is not really a strategy that any other club is going to be keen to follow.

What I think is happening at Chelsea is that they have a manager they believe in long term, and they are giving him a big summer. They haven’t spent anything for a couple of seasons, they got over 100m in the bank they weren’t allowed to spend, they expect to raise more money through sales, and for all we know they could be planning another couple of fallow years after this summers splurge.

I don’t think they’ll have any trouble meeting FFP.
I'm not sure that they have "got over 100m in the bank". According to their most recent accounts (June 2019), Fordstam Ltd (cheatski's parent company) had £36.581 million cash at bank and in hand. Add in the £50 million they got for Morata, less the £47 million they paid for Werner, leaves ca. £40 million, well short of the likely bill for Havertz.
 

rab

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You think getting rid of Sarri and hiring Lampard was because they thought it was improving their manager situation?

Sarri is a top manager, however has a very abrasive style, him and Chelsea were never a good match, especially him being stuck with players he'd fell out with due to a ban for 12 months.

If you think Lampard, with no transfers of his choice and losing the teams best player (by a comfortable margin) should have bettered the results of a top manager like Sarri who got a £100 million net spend I think you had unrealistic expectations!

It was never about improving. They gave Lampard a go because 1 No proven manager would have touched that poison chalice with a ten foot barge pole and 2 Frank being loved at the club would get a couple seasons free pass which would conveniently include the banned period which another manager may not get that free pass during.

The fact that Frank (love him or hate him) might actually match the finish of a top manager like Sarri despite the circumstances is actually quite some achievement. As it is hes only 9 points off what Sarri achieved. Hes gone from Championship so-so new manager level to European chasing clubs manager level in one season.
CL qualification is par. CL plus FA Cup would be two under. Anything but CL qualification is about ten over.

Their season needs to be seen in the context of the overall league, not just their individual circumstances. Minimum expectations would be CL football.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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CL qualification is par. CL plus FA Cup would be two under. Anything but CL qualification is about ten over.

Their season needs to be seen in the context of the overall league, not just their individual circumstances. Minimum expectations would be CL football.
So 1 you've not paid attention at all to the fact the manager changes were not to seek improvement. And 2 you're one of these that have completely been suckered in by the "poor league" narrative used to try and demean our achievements.
 

ILLOK

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Lampard's done well at Chelsea. Not spectacularly, but well.

Some seem to believe you are doomed if you don't sign players every window (no matter how good you are) which has gone in his favour. They obviously had Pulisic and a bunch of loan players returning who have bolstered the squad.

His results in the league are about par, they got battered by Bayern in the CL and will almost definitely be going out but they're in the FA Cup final, all whilst having a number of academy players in the squad. I would think Chelsea fans will be happy enough with that.
 

Billy Biskix

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So 1 you've not paid attention at all to the fact the manager changes were not to seek improvement. And 2 you're one of these that have completely been suckered in by the "poor league" narrative used to try and demean our achievements.
Agree, it's not a poor league. Fed up with hearing that. We've just been bloody brilliant and made everyone else look poor.

Lampard's done well. If he finishes top 4 I'd say that was an excellent start. Hazard had carried that team for ages. Big loss. They now have a unique opportunity to snap up quality players. Only clubs funded by oligarchs and states are going to have much money to spend this window so it's no surprise to me they've gone for Havertz. Good signing. Just hope he bombs disastrously.
 

rab

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So 1 you've not paid attention at all to the fact the manager changes were not to seek improvement. And 2 you're one of these that have completely been suckered in by the "poor league" narrative used to try and demean our achievements.
1. Of course they were looking to improve.
2. No I'm not. But perhaps you might have a look at the state of Arsenal, Spurs and United (prior to Fernandes) and tell me that they're also having good seasons.

Or maybe just accept someone has a different opinion to you instead of trying to grind them down to agree with you all the time.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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1. Of course they were looking to improve.
2. No I'm not. But perhaps you might have a look at the state of Arsenal, Spurs and United (prior to Fernandes) and tell me that they're also having good seasons.

Or maybe just accept someone has a different opinion to you instead of trying to grind them down to agree with you all the time.
The league is more competitive than ever before. Bottom placed Norwich nearly gave us a heart attack and beat City, reigning champions who may yet become Champions League champions. Thats not a weak league. That's a narrative that was started to diminish what we were achieving, we weren't really all that good, it was just a weak league. The fact is teams like Wolves, Leicester and Sheffield United have given teams like Arsenal, Spurs and United a real challenge. Those teams have finished in the top 4 before with weaker sides than they've got this year. The "weak" English league might still have champions in both European competitions and dominated both last season.

You don't get that the changes Chelsea made were not about trying to improve but to lessen the impact of hard times?
 

rab

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The league is more competitive than ever before. Bottom placed Norwich nearly gave us a heart attack and beat City, reigning champions who may yet become Champions League champions. Thats not a weak league. That's a narrative that was started to diminish what we were achieving, we weren't really all that good, it was just a weak league. The fact is teams like Wolves, Leicester and Sheffield United have given teams like Arsenal, Spurs and United a real challenge. Those teams have finished in the top 4 before with weaker sides than they've got this year. The "weak" English league might still have champions in both European competitions and dominated both last season.

You don't get that the changes Chelsea made were not about trying to improve but to lessen the impact of hard times?
*in your opinion
 

legalalien

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BBC Gossip page:

Chelsea are in talks with Bayer Leverkusen over a £70m deal to sign Kai Havertz, with all other suitors for the 21-year-old Germany forward thought to be out of the race. (Sky Sports)

There's also this and if they actually pay that much then it would seem that Abramovic is taking an interest once more.

Chelsea will have to pay Slovenia international Jan Oblak's 120m euros (£110m) release clause to force talks with the 27-year-old Atletico Madrid goalkeeper. (Goal)
 

Red over the water

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If you are thinking of Havertz as a front three option, he isn’t going anywhere as a kick up other lads arses. He’s going to play first team football week in, week out.
I agree. But IF we got him now (unlikely) he’s versatile enough so that he can cover all front three positions, and even play as an attacking midfielder in the midfield three. He would see plenty of action, and in time replace one of our stars himself as his own star continues to rise.
 
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Iluvatar

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Lampard's done well at Chelsea. Not spectacularly, but well.

Some seem to believe you are doomed if you don't sign players every window (no matter how good you are) which has gone in his favour. They obviously had Pulisic and a bunch of loan players returning who have bolstered the squad.

His results in the league are about par, they got battered by Bayern in the CL and will almost definitely be going out but they're in the FA Cup final, all whilst having a number of academy players in the squad. I would think Chelsea fans will be happy enough with that.
Not going to lie, I thought he was going to fail. He’s clearly a decent manager, a level above Ole for example.

But I agree with an earlier post of yours they are a couple of years away from challenging (if their team grows).
 

jim bouki

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Yee of little faith, Edwards has it all planned out. It won't be this year like some fans are hoping. Havertz is taking the Salah route to Liverpool. Do fuck all at chelsea, get shipped off to italy, then bought by us for 1/10th his market price after we smash that team in the Champions League.
 

Mascot88

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I'm not sure that they have "got over 100m in the bank". According to their most recent accounts (June 2019), Fordstam Ltd (cheatski's parent company) had £36.581 million cash at bank and in hand. Add in the £50 million they got for Morata, less the £47 million they paid for Werner, leaves ca. £40 million, well short of the likely bill for Havertz.
You know what I mean - they have got the money from Hazard and Morata to account for in their FFP response. They are likely to be taking in instalments, as transfers are generally paid, but it still offsets their spending.

The basic gist is, that they won’t struggle to meet FFP.
 

Lowton_Red

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You know what I mean - they have got the money from Hazard and Morata to account for in their FFP response. They are likely to be taking in instalments, as transfers are generally paid, but it still offsets their spending.

The basic gist is, that they won’t struggle to meet FFP.
You know, I'd quite forgotten about Hazard. :oops:

The promise of payment, via letters of credit, are [almost] as good as cash to the bank, so they'll have effectively about £140 million plus any sales to splash.

That should easily cover both Oblak and Havertz.
 

Dutch

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Werner and Ziyech already set them back £ 83 million at Oblak £ 72 and Havertz for £ 100 million and they are spending roughly £ 250 million this summer.
 

ILLOK

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Oblak is the one I don't want them to get. Signing young attacking players is one thing but players like Oblak will help them breach the gap with us and City. Not next year, but not in the too distant future. Havertz, Werner and co will be good additions but Oblak is genuinely top 2 in the world for his position.

I'm still hoping City or Chelsea drop 50-60 million on Chilwell.
 

Dutch

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Similar to us 2 years ago then?
Nah 2 years ago 17/18 we spend £ 155 million on VvD, Salah, Ox and Robertson, The year later18/19 we spend £ 163 on Becker, Keïta, Fabinho and Shaqiri according to Transfermarkt.
 

gasband

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Let them buy all they want. If a great team is only as easy as buying expensive players.
 

rupzzz

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Oblak is the one I don't want them to get. Signing young attacking players is one thing but players like Oblak will help them breach the gap with us and City. Not next year, but not in the too distant future. Havertz, Werner and co will be good additions but Oblak is genuinely top 2 in the world for his position.

I'm still hoping City or Chelsea drop 50-60 million on Chilwell.
Considering they only signed Kepa 2 years ago, I very much doubt they're about to go and splash on another keeper, unless is one of those rare swap and cash deals.

Imagine Kepa, the most expensive goalkeeper in the world for 2 years, sitting on the bench watching the new words most expensive goalkeeper in the world. It'll be like City and their full backs.

As for Havertz - fuck it, if he goes there he goes there. I suspect it's media BS.
 

costared

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Considering they only signed Kepa 2 years ago, I very much doubt they're about to go and splash on another keeper, unless is one of those rare swap and cash deals.

Imagine Kepa, the most expensive goalkeeper in the world for 2 years, sitting on the bench watching the new words most expensive goalkeeper in the world. It'll be like City and their full backs.

As for Havertz - fuck it, if he goes there he goes there. I suspect it's media BS.
Doubt if we are interested in Havertz at the sort of money they want for him and the sort of wages he will want.
 

[email protected]

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Considering they only signed Kepa 2 years ago, I very much doubt they're about to go and splash on another keeper, unless is one of those rare swap and cash deals.

Imagine Kepa, the most expensive goalkeeper in the world for 2 years, sitting on the bench watching the new words most expensive goalkeeper in the world. It'll be like City and their full backs.

As for Havertz - fuck it, if he goes there he goes there. I suspect it's media BS.
Given his antics, I'd have more fun imagining him handcuffing himself to the goal posts to keep his place.
 

redfanman

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Considering they only signed Kepa 2 years ago, I very much doubt they're about to go and splash on another keeper, unless is one of those rare swap and cash deals.

Imagine Kepa, the most expensive goalkeeper in the world for 2 years, sitting on the bench watching the new words most expensive goalkeeper in the world. It'll be like City and their full backs.

As for Havertz - fuck it, if he goes there he goes there. I suspect it's media BS.
If the right player is available and they have the money to make it happen, i'm sure they would do it. Kepa has been fairly poor the last couple of seasons. If they brought in Oblak, they would probably be open to offers for Kepa. However, that doesnt mean that they would bring just anybody in to replace Kepa.
 

rupzzz

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If the right player is available and they have the money to make it happen, i'm sure they would do it. Kepa has been fairly poor the last couple of seasons. If they brought in Oblak, they would probably be open to offers for Kepa. However, that doesnt mean that they would bring just anybody in to replace Kepa.
No doubt,

But all things considering, they have bigger problems in defence than their aggy little prick of a keeper.

In all honesty, I don't care. Suits me if they blow there budget on a keeper. A keeper in a 1 v 1 situation will concede goals no matter how good they are. Defenders that stop the 1 v 1 opportunities means more clean sheets, even if you have a steaming pile of horse shit for a keeper.
 
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