• Hey Guest!
    Enjoy the This Is Anfield Forums but want to remove the adverts? Now you can do so by clicking here.
    Thanks for your support!

Kylian Mbappé (FW) PSG

What will Mbappe be leaning on?

  • The number 6, which he cheekily turns upside down into a 9, waggling his eyebrows

  • Mikey Edward's elephant-sized cock

  • Piled up lifesized cutouts of Benteke, Carroll, Jovanovic, and Voronin

  • Maria's tea set

  • ISMF's ego for starting this thread

  • A simple conference table, because he has fully accepted being a humble part of the red machine

  • The burnt-out remains of the redcafe server

  • None of the above coz he ain't fookin comin', man

  • A big VAR screen, to freak out all Abu Dhabi fans


Results are only viewable after voting.

Mascot88

Yours for £1m. Need to make room for Dean Saunders
Admin
Joined
May 24, 2007
Messages
22,389
No that's you incorrectly interpreting what I'm saying into your understanding of squad depth. You seem to believe there is a planned starting 11 and the other players are depth. I don't. Not for a club that averages 60+ games a season. If you are looking at an area like CM with three starting roles your 4th or 5th option (especially in an injury hit area of the squad) is as important as your 1st, 2nd and 3rd.

This is not the 70s or 80s were you have 11 players, 2 or 3 that play when injuries hit and a super sub. I don't agree that a player bought in to a position has to be only a squad option. I didn't see Salah coming in to join Coutinho, Mane and Firmino as a move to either bring in a squad option or demote one of those three to be a squad option. I wouldn't see the same now.

So far we have been incredibly lucky with Salah and Mane missing very few games due to injury. Its not the players as they have had injuries in the past and it's not our fitness team as they can't do anything about impact injuries and haven't been able to stop other players getting injured. It's pure luck.

Even when they have had injuries we have been lucky with the timing due to the amount of our games that fit into their time injured. Mane with his latest injury missing the least number of games possible due to FA cup, a period of one game a week and the break. Salah going off in the Champions League final was fully recovered by the time we started playing again. Either of those injuries could have seen them miss 5-10 league games if they happened at different times.

Salah and Mane could pick up big injuries at any time missing 10+ league games. They will both miss lots of games next season guaranteed because of AFCON. At the same time. They both also play far too much as it is, can't really be afforded to be rested in most CL and Premier League games as we can't risk not playing them. Salah just spent two months playing through pain and bad form with an ankle injury and hardly getting any rest.

Something has to give, if it's not a player to ease the burden on them two coming in soon then it'll probably be them. Either one or both of their bodies starts breaking down into lots of niggly injuries, or one or both of them decide they've done what they can here and it's time to move somewhere else where it is less hard.
Are we going to keep going round in circles on this?

You can make an excellent paper case that we need another forward. You can get your pen and paper out and work out how many games you can give each of them and how theoretically they should all be happy.

But we are actually taking about human beings, with their own desires and motivations and egos and anxieties.

Sadio Mane and Mo Salah are brilliant, brilliant footballers with aspirations to be the very best in the world. They want to play as much football as possible. Do you want to tell them they aren’t starting a Champions League game or a big weekend league fixture because it’s Sancho’s turn to start?

If we need further depth up front (I don’t think we do) what we need is a lad who will be happy to sit behind them in the pecking order, get his 20 odd starts and not kick off if he’s not starting the big games.

We won’t be breaking our transfer record to sign this lad.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Ad-free Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
11,917
Klopp, November 9, 2019:

"Buying this calibre of player is difficult. I don't see any club at the moment who can buy Kylian Mbappe from PSG. I don't see any club, that is how it is. And we are involved in the clubs that cannot do it. It is as easy as that.

"OK, from a sporting point of view, there are not a lot of reasons to not sign him. What a player he is. But it is about the money of course. No chance. Absolutely no chance. Sorry for killing that story."


But someone is buying him this summer or next summer. If not he leaves on a free the summer after at the age of 23. Maybe that's a veiled message to PSG to lower their demands on fee? Like we did with Roma and Alisson with the "we are happy with Karius/Ward talk"!
 

Mascot88

Yours for £1m. Need to make room for Dean Saunders
Admin
Joined
May 24, 2007
Messages
22,389
But someone is buying him this summer or next summer. If not he leaves on a free the summer after at the age of 23. Maybe that's a veiled message to PSG to lower their demands on fee? Like we did with Roma and Alisson with the "we are happy with Karius/Ward talk"!
Where’s the Picard meme.

He wants to go to Real. It’s his dream and he’s gone on the record saying this. As soon as his fee reaches a point where he’s gettable, Real will get him.

Yeah but. He said he played as Liverpool on FIFA!
 

Hope in your heart

Loyalty and patience, two undervalued concepts.
Admin
Joined
Jul 16, 2007
Messages
23,480
But someone is buying him this summer or next summer. If not he leaves on a free the summer after at the age of 23. Maybe that's a veiled message to PSG to lower their demands on fee? Like we did with Roma and Alisson with the "we are happy with Karius/Ward talk"!
IF it comes to that and he's available on a free, we'll of course be among the dozens of clubs standing in the queue for him. But Madrid will most likely come in this summer, offer a bumper fee for him and take him in. And as Klopp stated, we won't pay bumper money for him.

But there is also a big chance that he'll sign a new contract before it comes to that. His recent shenanigans aren't much different of what other big players have done when they thought that they deserved a contract improvement. Messi and especially Ronaldo have done it multiple times.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Ad-free Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
11,917
Where’s the Picard meme.

He wants to go to Real. It’s his dream and he’s gone on the record saying this. As soon as his fee reaches a point where he’s gettable, Real will get him.

Yeah but. He said he played as Liverpool on FIFA!
Where is this quote?
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Ad-free Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
11,917
IF it comes to that and he's available on a free, we'll of course be among the dozens of clubs standing in the queue for him. But Madrid will most likely come in this summer, offer a bumper fee for him and take him in. And as Klopp stated, we won't pay bumper money for him.

But there is also a big chance that he'll sign a new contract before it comes to that. His recent shenanigans aren't much different of what other big players have done when they thought that they deserved a contract improvement. Messi and especially Ronaldo have done it multiple times.
As Klopp said nobody can afford him. As we would only have to add one player and Real multiple I'd actually back us to beat them on which club could muscle up the most cash for a fee right now. And he has said he isn't.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Ad-free Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
11,917

Hope in your heart

Loyalty and patience, two undervalued concepts.
Admin
Joined
Jul 16, 2007
Messages
23,480
Where is this quote?
About his idols: «J’ai eu des phases, a-t-il expliqué dans des propos rapportés par RMC Sport. Pour commencer, quand j’étais enfant, c’était Zidane. Si vous êtes un garçon et que vous êtes français, votre idole est Zidane. Après Cristiano, j’ai eu la chance de l’affronter, puis des Brésiliens pour leur façon de jouer.»


The most telling quote, after having visited the club at the age of 14, and being utterly impressed by the club and by Zidane, who then was in charge of the youth, and why he still went to Monaco at the time:

"I dream of going back one day by the big door. I just wanted to prove to them that I was a good player and to feel that they wanted me. There was also the fact of changing country, language, school ... If it had only been football, I might have left, but there was also a change of culture. If I have to go, it will be later. "

 

Anfield rd Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Ad-free Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
11,917
About his idols: «J’ai eu des phases, a-t-il expliqué dans des propos rapportés par RMC Sport. Pour commencer, quand j’étais enfant, c’était Zidane. Si vous êtes un garçon et que vous êtes français, votre idole est Zidane. Après Cristiano, j’ai eu la chance de l’affronter, puis des Brésiliens pour leur façon de jouer.»


The most telling quote, after having visited the club at the age of 14, and being utterly impressed by the club and by Zidane, who then was in charge of the youth, and why he still went to Monaco at the time:

"I dream of going back one day by the big door. I just wanted to prove to them that I was a good player and to feel that they wanted me. There was also the fact of changing country, language, school ... If it had only been football, I might have left, but there was also a change of culture. If I have to go, it will be later. "

Nobody is denying that 17 year old Mbappe said his dream was to one day play for Real Madrid. What people are saying is he has said it will be his next club.
 

Jaytinho

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 30, 2013
Messages
226
About his idols: «J’ai eu des phases, a-t-il expliqué dans des propos rapportés par RMC Sport. Pour commencer, quand j’étais enfant, c’était Zidane. Si vous êtes un garçon et que vous êtes français, votre idole est Zidane. Après Cristiano, j’ai eu la chance de l’affronter, puis des Brésiliens pour leur façon de jouer.»


The most telling quote, after having visited the club at the age of 14, and being utterly impressed by the club and by Zidane, who then was in charge of the youth, and why he still went to Monaco at the time:

"I dream of going back one day by the big door. I just wanted to prove to them that I was a good player and to feel that they wanted me. There was also the fact of changing country, language, school ... If it had only been football, I might have left, but there was also a change of culture. If I have to go, it will be later. "

Its a french thing it seems, Benzema also dreamed of playing for Madrid. I think since witnessing Zidane in the galacticos era, french players aspiring to play for Madrid became a thing. Just like brazilian players after witnessing Romario, Rivaldo and Ronaldinho tearing shit up with Barca. Mbappe seems like he is not as obsessed with Madrid as Benzema was tho
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Ad-free Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
11,917
I put the 2017 Mbappe quotes in the same category as the Aguero quotes;

Aguero wrote in his autobiography Born To Rise: "I’ve always liked Liverpool, maybe because I used to play for Independiente who also played in red. As a kid, I wanted to be Michael Owen and when I saw him score that goal for England against Argentina I thought ‘you little sh**’! Even aged 10, I knew they couldn’t allow him that much space. He was a terrific player at that time.”


For context Aguero once turned down our advances and chose to extend with Atletico Madrid. These aren't fan boys like us. This is their career and they do what's best for their career. Their childhood loyalties fade and they develop new ones. Ask die hard red born blue, Liverpool legend, Carragher.
 

Iluvatar

Allez (x6)
Ad-free Member
Joined
Sep 13, 2015
Messages
8,315
Klopp, November 9, 2019:

"Buying this calibre of player is difficult. I don't see any club at the moment who can buy Kylian Mbappe from PSG. I don't see any club, that is how it is. And we are involved in the clubs that cannot do it. It is as easy as that.

"OK, from a sporting point of view, there are not a lot of reasons to not sign him. What a player he is. But it is about the money of course. No chance. Absolutely no chance. Sorry for killing that story."
 

redfanman

TIA Regular
Ad-free Member
Joined
Apr 29, 2008
Messages
14,463
City and many clubs could afford Mbappe but let's be clear, there is no reason to go to them. If its purely money that motivates him he stays at the top European side best placed to pay him the most. He doesn't move anywhere.

The reasons to move are to kick on and establish himself as the best in the world. Something that won't happen in a low profile league like France. Options would be limited to Barca, Real, Bayern, Juventus, us and Manchester United IF they were still doing well. Of those sides I struggle to see Bayern or Juventus coming close to the kinds of fee required. Barca and Real could, in theory, raise those kind of fees but both have more needs than just blowing all their money on one player. And both are also heavily linked with Neymar too, another alternative for them that I doubt Klopp would go near due to attitude.

On Real, yes they will most definitely have room on their wage bill for him but the fee? ZZ is the manager but for how long this time? What if he arrives just as there is a manager change? Real don't do succession planning very well just hiring the next big name manager regardless of playing style.

On fees they just had a massive blowout that they'd been scrimping and saving for during several seasons leading up to it;


Bale was the last time Real really flexed their might financially which was 6 years ago now. By the time they spent the same on Hazard this year he didn't even make the top 5 most expensive deals, Reals reputation that everyone seems convinced means they can sign anyone is built on a time they used to have most of the top ten most expensive deals on their books. That time has gone. Around £40 million for a keeper doesn't show they weren't serious it shows their financial capabilities these days.

The players likely to depart Real this summer aren't ensured to be bringing in a lot of fees for them no matter how much they free up on the wage bill. Real are publicly buttering him up in the time honoured tradition of Real and Barca to maneuvere themselves so he picks them as his next club and then they can sit around as he winds down his contract and eventually PSG have to accept what they offer. It's why PSG are so pissed off. It's what Real did with De Gea but eventually, out of some loyalty or something, he threw a spanner in the works and extended his deal. They were still a faulty fax away from getting that one over the line.
I think you underestimate Real Madrids finances and their willngness to splash out on the biggest attacking players of their generation. They are more likely to do so than spend big on goalkeepers and defensive players - so how much they pay for a keeper isnt really a good argument here for why they wouldnt spend big on Mbappe. Also, i find it a bit rich (pun intended) that one of the arguments people are using to say Liverpool could afford to sign Mbappe is that his contract is running down yet that doesnt somehow apply to Real Madrid? :unsure:

They are the top club in world football for generating revenues at around 900m euros. Their wage to revenue ratio is something like 48%. Their debt is about 1%. The loan they are taking out to finance the rebuilding of their stadium is at 2.5% over 30 years.


The fact they havent been spending as much in recent years as they have a decade ago shouldnt be seen solely as a sign they have no money, only they that they are being more careful with what they do spend - perhaps with the goal of saving enough money to buy Mbappe when PSG are willing to agree to a sale if they dont already have the funds to do so. They also have a number of players they can either sell or include in a deal with PSG to help finance the purchase if they needed to and a clear gap in the squad to buy him for.

PSG are not pissed off at him winding down his contract. One of the commitments made to Mbappe was that he would be allowed to go to Real Madrid afterwards. After what happened with Neymar and Barca, i dont think that Real would want to antagonise PSG either and so waiting, with the odd fluttering of eyes at a player they like and they know likes them isnt going to get them in trouble.

De Gea didnt sign a new contract out of loyalty to united. He got played by Madrid. Rafa wanted him there, the board didnt, so they pretended to put in offers for him and then deliberately missed the transfer deadline.

As for City, for all the criticism of them as a club, there is no denying they do often play an entertaining and successful style of football. They are expected to lose Sane this summer and would want to bring in a new player. If you believe Nike will benefit from bringing him to Liverpool and would do a deal to ensure that happens then perhaps City and Madrid sharing sponsors (emirates) also opens a pathway for a temporary move to the Etihad if Real Madrid cant buy him this season.
 

redfanman

TIA Regular
Ad-free Member
Joined
Apr 29, 2008
Messages
14,463
You are rewriting history again, Coutinho, Klopp, every journalist to ever write a piece on it Coutinho was happy here, signed a long time contract and was due to stay for awhile. Nobody with any knowledge on the subject has ever suggested Coutinho was planning on being off within a couple of years. Even when Barca made their move (100% reaction to the unforeseen triggering of the Neymar clause by PSG) Klopp still had the famous "stay and they'll build statues of you" conversation to try and persuade him to stick to the plan. Not the "oh well we both knew this was coming, just a season or two sooner than expected" conversation.

Also don't forget the season before we struck the deal for Keita we had just made the CL final, were a Salah injury away from winning that final and would have done a lot better in the league than 4th if we hadn't needed to rest players for the CL. Our last 6 games of the season we picked up 9 points and dropped 9 points. We finished 6 points behind 2nd place United.
I think you are rewriting history here. I'm sure if you go back to the relevant threads you will see frequent discussions about Coutinho being expected to leave the following summer and only re-signing when he did because Barca promised to come back for him the following year.

Klopp's reaction once coutinho had re-signed was precisely because we had already made plans for the season with Coutinho here.
 

redfanman

TIA Regular
Ad-free Member
Joined
Apr 29, 2008
Messages
14,463
If it's only about money he doesn't leave PSG. He literally has admitted to picking us when he plays computer games and talking about how amazing we are within the last few months! He has also seemingly followed our recent games live judging by likes, comments and stuff on social media these last couple of seasons.
It may not be only about money but that doesnt mean money cant be a significant reason still. His wishing to leave could simply be he doesnt like Tuchel and/or other people at the club. He may not find the French league challenging enough or his team mates good enough to give him confidence they can compete for the CL. We are not the only side that could be in for him that would address those issues for him though either.

As for his social media activity, shortly after his stuff on trent he followed up with similar things on man utd players (Rashford?) so i dont think anyone should get too excited and read anything into that.
 

Mascot88

Yours for £1m. Need to make room for Dean Saunders
Admin
Joined
May 24, 2007
Messages
22,389
I think you are rewriting history here. I'm sure if you go back to the relevant threads you will see frequent discussions about Coutinho being expected to leave the following summer and only re-signing when he did because Barca promised to come back for him the following year.

Klopp's reaction once coutinho had re-signed was precisely because we had already made plans for the season with Coutinho here.
I always understood that the Neymar sale pushed Barca towards accelerating their Coutinho plans rather than initiating them. He was always on their radar.

In fact if you think about the way we pinned down Naby, it felt like a club who thought they were going to lose a big player the following summer, not that one.
 

redfanman

TIA Regular
Ad-free Member
Joined
Apr 29, 2008
Messages
14,463
I always understood that the Neymar sale pushed Barca towards accelerating their Coutinho plans rather than initiating them. He was always on their radar.

In fact if you think about the way we pinned down Naby, it felt like a club who thought they were going to lose a big player the following summer, not that one.
I think we are saying the same thing. Coutinho signed the new contract once Barca had confirmed to him that they would be coming for him the following year and in turn he gave his assurances to Klopp he would stay.

The Neymar thing blew up after the contract had been signed. There was definitely a suggestion made during the summer that our pursuit of Naby was so aggressive in order to get him straight away and then let Coutinho leave immediately. The failure to land Naby immediately leaving us to dig our heels in on Coutinho. I dont know how true that was.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Ad-free Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
11,917
So I'm confused were we only adding Salah to a settled front 3 because of prior knowledge of a Barca move for Coutinho that may one day happen or were we adding Keita to a settled midfield because of current knowledge of Barca intentions to sign Coutinho? Because they were both club record deals at the time they were agreed without being moves that addressed obvious needs.
 

Limiescouse

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 26, 2014
Messages
14,994
No that's you incorrectly interpreting what I'm saying into your understanding of squad depth. You seem to believe there is a planned starting 11 and the other players are depth. I don't. Not for a club that averages 60+ games a season. If you are looking at an area like CM with three starting roles your 4th or 5th option (especially in an injury hit area of the squad) is as important as your 1st, 2nd and 3rd.

This is not the 70s or 80s were you have 11 players, 2 or 3 that play when injuries hit and a super sub. I don't agree that a player bought in to a position has to be only a squad option. I didn't see Salah coming in to join Coutinho, Mane and Firmino as a move to either bring in a squad option or demote one of those three to be a squad option. I wouldn't see the same now.

So far we have been incredibly lucky with Salah and Mane missing very few games due to injury. Its not the players as they have had injuries in the past and it's not our fitness team as they can't do anything about impact injuries and haven't been able to stop other players getting injured. It's pure luck.

Even when they have had injuries we have been lucky with the timing due to the amount of our games that fit into their time injured. Mane with his latest injury missing the least number of games possible due to FA cup, a period of one game a week and the break. Salah going off in the Champions League final was fully recovered by the time we started playing again. Either of those injuries could have seen them miss 5-10 league games if they happened at different times.

Salah and Mane could pick up big injuries at any time missing 10+ league games. They will both miss lots of games next season guaranteed because of AFCON. At the same time. They both also play far too much as it is, can't really be afforded to be rested in most CL and Premier League games as we can't risk not playing them. Salah just spent two months playing through pain and bad form with an ankle injury and hardly getting any rest.

Something has to give, if it's not a player to ease the burden on them two coming in soon then it'll probably be them. Either one or both of their bodies starts breaking down into lots of niggly injuries, or one or both of them decide they've done what they can here and it's time to move somewhere else where it is less hard.
You have become increasingly frustrated over the past 6 months at what you believe is unfair treatment on here regarding the way people interact with your posts. You often claim that people are not representing your point accurate;y. This post may be a good explanation for why you think that. It is ostensibly a counter to Mascott's thoughts on Naby, yet you tell him he's wrong and then spend the entirety of the post channeling Cardiff Pete and talking about rotation of the forwards. By the end (middle?) I had no idea what your point was.
 

i_still_miss_fowler

Open Your Eyes Morty!
Moderator
Joined
Jun 23, 2005
Messages
7,300
To be fair both sides of the argument are made on speculative stances.

None of us know what happened with regards to Coutinho. It's daft to get worked up about it. For example playing devils advocate Anfield road dreamer could quote the latest Melissa Reddy article where she describes the shock in Hong Kong.


Equally it could be argued at the same time Liverpool had been contingency planning with Naby (ie both be shocked and have a plan just in case)

To be honest it's not much different to the interest in Mane and Salah. There has been speculation about both going to one of Madrid, Barca or PSG. The argument is somewhat redundant as if either do decide to leave (which is just as feasible as Coutinho at similar time point) Mbappe becomes more realistic probability.

The thing is we talk about things being black and white when life is shades of grey. If there is a 30% chance or greater of one of our front three leaving in the summer my guess is the club plans for that eventuality (this was not always the case).

That's not the same thing as wanting to sell Mane or Salah to fund Mbappe but preparing for the worst and having a plan.
 
Last edited:

Anfield rd Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Ad-free Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
11,917
Interes..... err article I personally found interesting;


Seems strange that Mbappe is almost coming across as very much in Neymar's shadow and Neymar being the popular guy at the centre of the team with Mbappe off doing his own thing. I might be reading too much into it.
 

SirBillShankly

Joe and Holly's Dad
Joined
Jan 8, 2011
Messages
10,617
Yep, ARD,Mbappe doesn't come across as a flash bastard. Seems a proper bloke. Not a tart who will happily drop £1200 on a pair of wellies or dye his hair pink. He seems very humble and close to his roots. Ideal Klopp player.

Reckon we will have to wait until the Summer of 2021 before he joins us though. Can easily see him replacing one of our current lot then.
 

Iluvatar

Allez (x6)
Ad-free Member
Joined
Sep 13, 2015
Messages
8,315
I don't even understand what people are arguing about tbh
Well I for one we are now in a place we are arguing about Mbappe joining us or not and the fact its a realistic arguement (for the most part). Rather than will we get Carroll on deadline day, or the joy (fools hope) at signing Jovanovic on a free.. /shudder..
 

Cologne-Liverpool

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 7, 2015
Messages
4,069
Well I for one we are now in a place we are arguing about Mbappe joining us or not and the fact its a realistic arguement (for the most part). Rather than will we get Carroll on deadline day, or the joy (fools hope) at signing Jovanovic on a free.. /shudder..
Ok, cool - see post above yours. You won't see me protesting if it's mbappening.