Liverpool Coaching Staff

redbj

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#2
from a very broad viewpoint, i thought our medicos did an excellent job in the last few seasons as Jurgen Gambled on a small squad to get us through demanding times.

thats not to say this guy above was the be all and end all and was proficient in his job, but the department he was in certainly performed.

also, the word sacked sounds so harsh in this day and age, doesnt it? i hope its not on an LFC press release.
 

Kopstar

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#3
More than three weeks after the initial post about Pons (above), the club have finally announced his exit "with immediate effect"!

https://www.liverpoolfc.com/news/first-team/309764-ruben-pons-liverpool-fc

Liverpool Football Club wishes to announce that first-team physiotherapist Ruben Pons has left his post with immediate effect.

Ruben would like to express his gratitude to colleagues, supporters and playing staff for making his time at the club a memorable experience.

The club thanks Ruben for his work at Melwood over the last four years and wishes him well for the future.

There is some speculation on twitter about the reason for his departure. I'll leave it there.
 

Sweeting

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#4
If we sacked him for saying no to Fekir then that's highly unprofessional from us.

Seems more likely that he has known he was leaving for a while.
 

Kopstar

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#6
If we sacked him for saying no to Fekir then that's highly unprofessional from us.

Seems more likely that he has known he was leaving for a while.
That would be, yes but that's not what I think happened. Some speculation that he may have breached confidences (re Fekir specifically).
 

OLDIE

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#8
A "physio" will have had no input on the medical.
But will more than likely be aware of the results of the medical.
Especially if the physio had been asked to give an opinion of any special measures, that may be required, in the not to distant future
 

ubermick

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#9
That would be, yes but that's not what I think happened. Some speculation that he may have breached confidences (re Fekir specifically).
So more of a disciplinary thing than anything else?

All this was so much easier when we had Zaf...
 

Kopstar

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#11
So more of a disciplinary thing than anything else?

All this was so much easier when we had Zaf...
Yes, whether it's for the reasons speculated or not I don't know but it does sound like he's been dismissed due to a conduct issue (which could include letting slip the details of confidential medical assessment(s)).
 

Limiescouse

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#12
Yes, whether it's for the reasons speculated or not I don't know but it does sound like he's been dismissed due to a conduct issue (which could include letting slip the details of confidential medical assessment(s)).
It was quite jarring to see it referred to as being "sacked".
 

Kopstar

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#13
It was quite jarring to see it referred to as being "sacked".
Yep, although that was the earlier report not directly from the club. If I was to guess I would say that there was an investigation, followed by a disciplinary which resulted in his dismissal earlier this month that he then subsequently appealed. That appeal process has recently concluded and confirmed the original decision.
 

AussieLad

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#14
Another theory I have just come across is in relation to the C/L final and Karius' concussion. As part of the physio team, he would potentially have been one that could/would have picked up a potential concussion in a player, so could it have been dereliction of duty due to not picking up a potential head injury to a player?
 

Kopstar

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#15
Another theory I have just come across is in relation to the C/L final and Karius' concussion. As part of the physio team, he would potentially have been one that could/would have picked up a potential concussion in a player, so could it have been dereliction of duty due to not picking up a potential head injury to a player?
No mate, Andy Massey (club doctor) was there, it was his responsibility. I also don't think the club have pointed the finger at anyone internally for that.
 

Jimmyscase

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#16
It was quite jarring to see it referred to as being "sacked".
I think we can debate the semantics all day, but he's left the club under a cloud.
His references from previous employers won't be so bad if he chooses to work in football again.
 
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#17
Another theory I have just come across is in relation to the C/L final and Karius' concussion. As part of the physio team, he would potentially have been one that could/would have picked up a potential concussion in a player, so could it have been dereliction of duty due to not picking up a potential head injury to a player?
I would doubt that very much. On field stuff is the refs responsibility for starters. Then he would have had to have seen the incident and be adamant that he saw it (concussion isn't something that you can pick up on from the sidelines well not in this case, Sakho's was a lot more evident). He would have too many 'escape routes for that to hold. It would probably have to be a 'gross fault' and that doesn't fall into that bracket imo.
 

AussieLad

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#18
No mate, Andy Massey (club doctor) was there, it was his responsibility. I also don't think the club have pointed the finger at anyone internally for that.
Valid points, but would it not be one of the physios that first treat a player then pass info onto the the club doctor if it is more than something fairly simple/straight forward to deal with?

Also, I could be wrong here, but I would be surprised if the club did publicly out any staff for something like that as it would potentially have serious repercussions for their future employability
 

Kopstar

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#19
Valid points, but would it not be one of the physios that first treat a player then pass info onto the the club doctor if it is more than something fairly simple/straight forward to deal with?

Also, I could be wrong here, but I would be surprised if the club did publicly out any staff for something like that as it would potentially have serious repercussions for their future employability
You're right, the club wouldn't publicly hang someone out to dry like that but I don't think that anyone's been blamed for how it was handled.
 

Kopstar

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#20

I found the above funny since it came soon after his impassioned defence of Achterberg. Turns out that all Alisson needs to do is "be a goalkeeper". Something tells me that Achterberg has really caused Jurgen to dumb down when it comes to coaching goalkeepers.

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/spo...liverpool-boss-jurgen-klopp-responds-15011670

Jurgen Klopp insists new Liverpool No 1 Alisson Becker is in safe hands with “goalkeeper maniac” John Achterberg.

The Brazilian shot-stopper is preparing to make his debut for the Reds in Sunday's Premier League opener against West Ham at Anfield.

Achterberg is tasked with getting the best out of the £65million signing and Klopp has reaffirmed his faith in the club's long-serving goalkeeping coach.

The former Tranmere keeper has faced criticism from a section of supporters in recent years when the form of Simon Mignolet and Loris Karius has come under the spotlight.

But Klopp believes Liverpool are fortunate to have Achterberg and he remains a highly valued member of his backroom staff ahead of the 2018/19 campaign.

“First of all, John is a goalkeeper maniac. He's working constantly,” Klopp told the ECHO.

“It's so easy. All the people in the pubs think they know and understand football 100%.

“But if you asked them: 'What does a goalkeeper do?' They couldn't say more than 'catch balls'. They have no clue about goalkeeper techniques and all that stuff.

“John is the first in the building and the last to leave. No matter how early I get into Melwood, I get up the stairs and he's already there - sat there with the laptop open watching goalkeepers from the other end of the world.

“He's constantly in there developing, changing training programmes, working with the boys. For me, he's a fantastic goalkeeper coach.

“There's not any reason for criticism. He's also a fantastic lad.”

Achterberg joined the Liverpool Academy staff during Rafa Benitez’s reign in 2009 after 11 years of service to Tranmere and more than 300 appearances.

Kenny Dalglish promoted him to the role of first-team goalkeeping coach in 2011 and he’s retained that position under both Brendan Rodgers and Klopp.

Over the past seven years the Dutchman worked with the likes of Pepe Reina, Alexander Doni, Peter Gulacsi, Brad Jones, Simon Mignolet, Adam Bogdan, Danny Ward and Karius prior to Alisson's arrival.

In 2016 he became one of the first goalkeeping coaches in Europe to acquire the UEFA Pro Licence.

Klopp believes the pressure and expectation of life at Liverpool can make it a tough environment for keepers.

However, he's confident that in Alisson they have signed someone who will flourish and prove to be the long-term answer between the posts.

"I can understand that people are like this - if they haven't been happy with goalkeepers in the last few years that they think John is the reason for it," Klopp added.

"For sure, that's not the case. Liverpool is a difficult goalkeeper place or hopefully it was a difficult goalkeeper place.

"Now we have found a solution that everyone is happy with – a fantastic goalkeeper.

"We are really happy in this moment and now we have to perform."
 

geebo

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#21
I like to think Im old enough to formulate my own opinion, but when I read Klopp`s defence, I have to bow to his greater knowledge of Achterberg. Nice post.
 

Caradoc

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#22
For me, if a player reports a head injury to a match official, said official should bring it to the attention of the referee immediately and a qualified person take a look at the player. The circumstances surrounding the injury should be a separate issue. Now that may or may not already be the case but if it isn’t it should be. A match official is not qualified to make medical decisions so shouldn’t attempt to do so.

Now all of this depends on a number of factors, including the player reporting the injury. Its a complicated area but one which I believe can still be improved upon if the will is there from the governing bodies. I’m sure other sports such as the two rugby codes and American Football could provide valuable advice on the issue.
 

Caradoc

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#23
I like to think Im old enough to formulate my own opinion, but when I read Klopp`s defence, I have to bow to his greater knowledge of Achterberg. Nice post.

This is a man who has defended Mignolet, Moreno, Karius and Lovren during their most horrific brainfarts. If he gave up football tomorrow there might even be a future for him as a defence lawyer. lol

But seriously Klopp is loyal literally to a fault when it comes to his charges and colleagues. Its one area with Klopp where we need to perhaps read between the lines and/or form our own informed and measured opinion based on what our own eyes and brains are telling us.
 

AussieLad

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#24
I like to think Im old enough to formulate my own opinion, but when I read Klopp`s defence, I have to bow to his greater knowledge of Achterberg. Nice post.
Part of me wants to agree with you, but then you look at how every goalkeeper that has worked under Achterberg at Liverpool has gone backwards in their development under his coaching says a lot as well.
 

Limiescouse

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#25
I found the above funny since it came soon after his impassioned defence of Achterberg. Turns out that all Alisson needs to do is "be a goalkeeper". Something tells me that Achterberg has really caused Jurgen to dumb down when it comes to coaching goalkeepers.
Or, he's responding to the pressure people want to Alisson under given that he was, briefly, a world record transfer.
 



Billy Biskix

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#27
Part of me wants to agree with you, but then you look at how every goalkeeper that has worked under Achterberg at Liverpool has gone backwards in their development under his coaching says a lot as well.
I'm not sure about that. Reina was never the same once Rafa left. I don't think his heart was in it any more. Mignolet is the same keeper now as he was when we bought him so I can't say he's gone backwards, he just hasn't progressed. With him I think it's a mental issue rather than basic technique. Hard to coach having the right mental attitude. Karius is poor recruitment. Just wasn't up to playing at this level under this much scrutiny. He never looked good from the moment he started playing for us. In fact, he did progress, quite significantly, between Jan and May this year right up until the CL final and I don't think anyone can realistically blame the keeper coach for what happened there.

Bottom line for me is that Klopp is not an idiot. If he truly thought that Achterberg was the problem rather than the keepers then he wouldn't be spending £66 million on a new one. He'd just sack Achterberg. Let's see what happens now we've finally stopped skimping on keeper recruitment and got the best one available. If he fails and it's down to the coaching then Achterberg won't last long.
 

lfc.eddie

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#28
I'm not sure about that. Reina was never the same once Rafa left. I don't think his heart was in it any more. (...)

Bottom line for me is that Klopp is not an idiot. If he truly thought that Achterberg was the problem rather than the keepers then he wouldn't be spending £66 million on a new one. He'd just sack Achterberg. Let's see what happens now we've finally stopped skimping on keeper recruitment and got the best one available. If he fails and it's down to the coaching then Achterberg won't last long.
To be fair a lot of people had lost it when Rafa left and Hodgson arrived. Besides Rafa left together with Xavi Valero, a highly rated goalkeeping coach which could also explains the decline of Reina throughout the years, and let's not forget he wasn't that bad during Hodgson's time as I recalled Chelsea match where he had to made saves after saves just to then see Torres scored and won us that match under Hodgson. Achterberg did come in during 2011 season and Reina decline was quite telling at that point.

I don't think Klopp has the habit of sacking coaches unless they are one lazy and disrespectful son of a bitch. Klopp loves keeper coach work ethics, but to say he has to constantly developing and changing programs to me does sound like someone who doesn't have a master plan just yet. Way too many keepers failed under his watch.
 

Claymenza

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#29
I'm not sure about that. Reina was never the same once Rafa left. I don't think his heart was in it any more. Mignolet is the same keeper now as he was when we bought him so I can't say he's gone backwards, he just hasn't progressed. With him I think it's a mental issue rather than basic technique. Hard to coach having the right mental attitude. Karius is poor recruitment. Just wasn't up to playing at this level under this much scrutiny. He never looked good from the moment he started playing for us. In fact, he did progress, quite significantly, between Jan and May this year right up until the CL final and I don't think anyone can realistically blame the keeper coach for what happened there.

Bottom line for me is that Klopp is not an idiot. If he truly thought that Achterberg was the problem rather than the keepers then he wouldn't be spending £66 million on a new one. He'd just sack Achterberg. Let's see what happens now we've finally stopped skimping on keeper recruitment and got the best one available. If he fails and it's down to the coaching then Achterberg won't last long.
Buvak, his disciple of 17 years left himself. We sold ward. Mignolet will likely move to napoli which would be a good move for him.

I'm mystified how achterberg kept his position for almost 10 years now.

We finally have a top goalkeeper, although it will take one whiff of suspect coaching from achterberg before klopp says enough is enough and decides to part ways.

I'm sorry to say but I sense that his UEFA Pro license coaching badge is what is keeping him in the job. Do we have to have a set amount of fully licensed coaches at the club?

I do agree that Klopp tends to back a lot of the maverick characters in the club like lovren and karius until they get better, but only to a certain extent. Skrtel wasn't going to work out. Klopp seems to have turned it around with sturridge whos back in form.

If achterberg is that good, he should be aiming for a higher position elsewhere.