Loris Karius (GK) Bayer Leverkusen / Besiktas

Status
Not open for further replies.

geebo

Geebo Age unknown !
Joined
Oct 21, 2003
Messages
9,552
Likes
5,197
To quote/paraphrase Yogurt (Mel Brooks) "Merchandising Merchandising Merchandising, where the real money from the sport is made. Mane#10-the T-shirt, Firmino#9-the Coloring Book, Salah#11-the Lunch box, Milner#7 the Breakfast Cereal, Lovren#6 the flame thrower (the kids love that one)."..
Football was the game of the workjing calls. Now its the game of the budding economist and free lance marketing trainee....


I LOVED the warm applause Lorius got when he came on for Allison last night. Was really pleased that the Anfield faithful appreciate him still and what he has been through.
 

Caradoc

Y Goeden Bywyd
Joined
Jul 4, 2007
Messages
8,111
Likes
12,381
Loris has the support of Klopp, the players, the club and the real supporters. He may or more not have been offered some sort of ‘counselling’ which in turn he may or may not have accepted. I think what I’m saying is that everything he needs is in place and he must be aware of that by now. The reception from the crowd yesterday should be a huge motivator and provide reassurance.

I hope he realises after yesterday (if he didn’t already) that none of the vile and viscious social media messages are from real LFC supporters and the messages from ‘supporters’ of other clubs don’t count for diddly squat. They’re from sick, saddo couch potatoes and cowards who hide behind their keyboards and tablets. If their own lives actually counted for anything worthwhile they wouldn’t be so bitter and twisted.

He can see Alisson’s arrival as an absolute negative or an opportunity to learn from a top goalkeeper without being constantly in the spotlight. I sense that Alisson is a pretty decent guy who, as competitive as he no doubt is, will want to help his teammate get back on his feet and get his confidence back.

Loris can recover from this and be the very good goalkeeper he’s meant to be. We’re all behind him - all the people who count - but now it is down to the lad himself. Nobody can help him unless he helps himself. Good luck Loris ....... we’ve got your back.
 

Zoran

Fighting like beavers.
Joined
Mar 8, 2007
Messages
16,526
Likes
10,460
Looking at their roster and situation, they do need a goalkeeper. So that might happen I think.
If he fails again he's got that idiot Babel in the dressing room ready to offer him a career in making crap rap music or whatever.

lol


Seriously, good luck to him wherever he goes, feel sorry for him (what else, it's our fault that we had about 1 and a half quality goalkeeper in the last 20 years or so). I'm sure he will find stability in his career to get over this tough period.
 
Joined
Dec 6, 2007
Messages
2,209
Likes
182
2 years in Besiktas? I think it'd be hard for him to recover from there. He really needs to turn up his game to ever recover on this.
 

Nikola

Mediocre outcome is the probable outcome.
Admin
Joined
May 17, 2007
Messages
17,520
Likes
10,682
So, two seasons in football's most sensitive position, in front one of the most unforgiving crowds? Good luck, Loris, you'll really need it.
 

Caradoc

Y Goeden Bywyd
Joined
Jul 4, 2007
Messages
8,111
Likes
12,381
In a way Turkey might be a good place to go. If it was any of the four major European Leagues, he wouldn’t be quite out of the public glare but in Turkey maybe he might just be left alone to get his confidence and composure back and rebuild his career. Then again if its forgiveness, patience and understanding he’s seeking then Turkey might not be such a good move.

For his career to fall apart in just over 30 minutes of football is as cruel as it is unlucky. For it to happen before the eyes of 100s of millions of TV viewers was devastating. Yet that 30 or so minutes doesn’t suddenly make the lad a bad goalkeeper or even close to being one.

I think the key to all of this is that the lad’s heart doesn’t appear to be into trying to turn his fortunes around at LFC. Anyone with a heart and half a brain should be able to understand and accept that. I truly believe that Lorius can go on to be a very good goalkeeper and as a first step in that process a period playing outside one of the major leagues might be the right move. If this move happens I wish him the very best of luck.

So where could this leave LFC? Well relying on a young goalkeeper as backup simply isn’t an option for me. So that leaves Mignolet who I’m sorry to say barely inspires me with more confidence than one of our youngsters. By the time the January transfer window closes, the club really will have had to identify and recruit quality goalkeeping backup.
 

Zinedine Biscan

Never go full Lovren
Joined
Jul 31, 2009
Messages
20,719
Likes
34,822
Re Pearce's tweet... a potential near-£10m (incl loan fee) deal for a player after the end of the season he had, more than doubling what we paid for him, sounds like another good deal.
 

LFCFFC

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 19, 2016
Messages
906
Likes
2,837
He's not going to avoid the glare anywhere really.

At least in Turkey he won't be able to understand the insults if he makes a mistake.
 
Joined
Jul 21, 2006
Messages
3,300
Likes
2,677
He's more than good enough for them. Decent enough keeper on his day but i wonder how much he'll be able to push on now with Besiktas level coaching and language to overcome.

Good luck. Nobody would wish Kiev on anyone, it was a tough break.
 

shachart

"You're supposed to help people that need a bit."
Joined
Oct 26, 2009
Messages
1,892
Likes
1,523
Some demons you can't get rid off. He could never find his confidence again playing for us. It would have always been there.
Happy for him he gets a chance to reset his career.
 

Maria

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2006
Messages
12,799
Likes
19,207
I don't know much about the Turkish league, but there are real gems of players out there. Karius needs playing time, but I thought a year would be good and then evaluate afterwards. I hope he does well out there and comes back to LFC or maybe another club and flourish.

I am sad to see him leave LFC like this, the amount of abuse he got by our own fans was horrendous and disgraceful.
 

halandala

Active Member
Joined
Jun 19, 2017
Messages
79
Likes
248
I am not sad for him at all, because for him will be better: much more matches to play, maybe to "discover" himself as confidence after all this things at Liverpool.
And i am happy for us...maybe Alisson is the GK that we'are looking for!
 

Paul C

New Member
Joined
Oct 20, 2016
Messages
3
Likes
4
A loan move away from England is needed..the number two GK position will need resolving...SM will be desperate to move...was surprised to see Ward let go.
 

lfc.eddie

"¿Plata... O Plomo?"
Joined
Sep 18, 2006
Messages
49,984
Likes
37,106
Karius is cheaper than Ward.... wow. £10m in total if his stint with the Turkish club deemed successful.
 

Red over the water

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 13, 2018
Messages
704
Likes
1,224
Good luck to Karius. He was growing into a decent keeper for us and 10 clean sheets in 19 games last season gave us something to build on as we looked ahead to this campaign. The final changed everything.

Unfortunately the hangover continued with some iffy preseason form, and when we had a chance to sign Alisson, who is obviously better, we made our move. It meant the situation was ripe to exploit if someone wanted to take the gamble on Karius, as his value was depressed.

Ideally he’d have stayed as the number two, but the fella needs to play and rebuild. We were never going to get what he was truly worth in this inflated market, but with that said, if it goes through we’ve made a profit and moved him on, and both parties have a clean sheet. It wasn’t exactly a nice warm fuzzy outcome for everyone, but it was decisive, and I like that about the club at the moment. No messing.

Mignolet is more than good enough to be a back up, but if by next summer (or January?) he lines up a deal to move on, we will have to bring in another, as Grabara and Kelleher aren’t ready yet.
 

Ahmed Hussain

Sad guy with no life :(
Joined
Jul 10, 2017
Messages
782
Likes
1,259
I dunno about this really. I know he needs to find confidence but flogging him to Turkey shows there's not alot of faith in him. Would rather Mignolet leave and Karius stays as the back up. Then again apparently no one was interested in signing Mignolet permanently so one had to go.
 

hugo the horrible

Ridiculously optimistic.(even more so now)
Joined
Oct 24, 2010
Messages
3,431
Likes
1,992
Two minds about this,Karius needs playing time for sure,and will get it in Turkey.
Still would have had him rather than Migs as #2,but that's the way it goes.
Probably couldn't sell Migs,so he sits out a bit,although we have a busy season.
I still believe Karius is the better keeper so this gives him a chance to get his act together,which I'm pleased about!
 

legalalien

Watcher of the skies
Joined
Oct 23, 2010
Messages
8,106
Likes
8,253
There's a little more detail in this Guardian piece.
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2018/aug/20/loris-karius-besiktas-liverpool-alisson

Talks have advanced in recent days between Liverpool and Besiktas, who will pay a £2.25m loan fee, had inquired about Simon Mignolet before switching their attentions to the Belgium international’s clubmate.
Karius is with the Liverpool squad for the Premier League game at Crystal Palace on Monday and his transfer should go through after the match. The former Mainz keeper is still considering Besiktas’s offer but will be allowed to go on a two-season loan with an option to buy after the first year.
The deal would become a permanent £7.25m transfer should Besiktas qualify for Europe and Karius play a sufficient number of matches. Liverpool would also receive 20% of any future fee from the Turkish club, who made only a loan offer for Mignolet and not the permanent terms that his employers wanted. Karius is expected to sign a one-year extension to his Liverpool contract before finalising the loan so as to protect his valuation should he return to Anfield.


I agree with @Red over the water, he was growing into a decent keeper in the second half of last season and was clearly better than Mignolet. But then Kiev happened and after that there was no way he could ever be our no.1 again. I dreaded to think how he would react as our goalie the next he would be in a high pressure game, especially in the CL. No, he's damaged goods and it's best for him and us if he moves on.

As an aside, a quick look at Beiktas' wiki page reveals something I didn't know. There's an LFC connection between the two clubs. Former Liverpool player Gordon Milne was their manager between 1987 and 1993. The wiki page refers to it as the "Gordon Milne era".
 

lfc.eddie

"¿Plata... O Plomo?"
Joined
Sep 18, 2006
Messages
49,984
Likes
37,106
I dunno about this really. I know he needs to find confidence but flogging him to Turkey shows there's not alot of faith in him.
Two minds about this,Karius needs playing time for sure,and will get it in Turkey.
Still would have had him rather than Migs as #2,but that's the way it goes.
First - "touchwood"... and here's what I am about to say.

I don't get the notion of unsure of him leaving or Mignolet deputising is no good and all that. Alisson is clear as sky our first choice, unless we are about to do what Barcelona did 3 seasons ago where we rotate keepers between league and Europe, I just don't understand why it is so hard for everyone to let him leave. I don't mind and neither do I care now which of those two stays, they are both going to play second fiddle and chances are less than a dozen appearance for the club this season. So what is the difference? FA and League Cup prelim stage, that's all they are going to see this season. We already have Alisson and he is a nailed on starter for us.

So why the 2 minds? I don't get it, really. Unless he is an outfield player where he will be used far more frequently on substitution late in the game or rotate due to fatigue, Karius is not going to see any playing time other than for reserves.
 

hugo the horrible

Ridiculously optimistic.(even more so now)
Joined
Oct 24, 2010
Messages
3,431
Likes
1,992
First - "touchwood"... and here's what I am about to say.

I don't get the notion of unsure of him leaving or Mignolet deputising is no good and all that. Alisson is clear as sky our first choice, unless we are about to do what Barcelona did 3 seasons ago where we rotate keepers between league and Europe, I just don't understand why it is so hard for everyone to let him leave. I don't mind and neither do I care now which of those two stays, they are both going to play second fiddle and chances are less than a dozen appearance for the club this season. So what is the difference? FA and League Cup prelim stage, that's all they are going to see this season. We already have Alisson and he is a nailed on starter for us.

So why the 2 minds? I don't get it, really. Unless he is an outfield player where he will be used far more frequently on substitution late in the game or rotate due to fatigue, Karius is not going to see any playing time other than for reserves.
We have a busy season,particularly if we stay in all comps for a while,the second keeper will have to get a few starts,Alisson surely can’t be expected to start every game,and this is without injuries etc.
The two minds comes in for me as I prefer Karius over Migs,so part of me wants him here as backup.
But certainly the lad’s best interests,and likely ours will be best served by him getting regular playing time.
Agree one had to go,no doubt about that,certainly would not want to see the kids thrown in the deep end just yet.
 



lfc.eddie

"¿Plata... O Plomo?"
Joined
Sep 18, 2006
Messages
49,984
Likes
37,106
We have a busy season,particularly if we stay in all comps for a while,the second keeper will have to get a few starts,Alisson surely can’t be expected to start every game,and this is without injuries etc.
Like I said, apart from FA and League cup preliminary rounds, I just don't see the reason of rotating the keeper. If the keeper is not injured he is expected to start every single time. Reina and Dudek when injury free started in every single match for us in the league and champs league. There is no difference in being a keeper then and being a keeper now. He doesn't have to run up and down the pitch in a faster pace, he doesn't have to jump from side to side every couple of minutes to save 3 shots of 3 balls at one go. Rules stay the same for keeper and Alisson's biggest task is concentration.

Unlike Hennessy yesterday, he had probably 5 or 6 catches with 2-3 diving blocks, compared to his counterpart who had to get to 1v1 with our players a couple of times, parried shots from our players and having to fight for position for corners a lot more. So why is Alisson not be expected to start every game? Fatigue in standing around the 18 yard box for 2/3rd of the match at least.
 

hugo the horrible

Ridiculously optimistic.(even more so now)
Joined
Oct 24, 2010
Messages
3,431
Likes
1,992
Like I said, apart from FA and League cup preliminary rounds, I just don't see the reason of rotating the keeper. If the keeper is not injured he is expected to start every single time. Reina and Dudek when injury free started in every single match for us in the league and champs league. There is no difference in being a keeper then and being a keeper now. He doesn't have to run up and down the pitch in a faster pace, he doesn't have to jump from side to side every couple of minutes to save 3 shots of 3 balls at one go. Rules stay the same for keeper and Alisson's biggest task is concentration.

Unlike Hennessy yesterday, he had probably 5 or 6 catches with 2-3 diving blocks, compared to his counterpart who had to get to 1v1 with our players a couple of times, parried shots from our players and having to fight for position for corners a lot more. So why is Alisson not be expected to start every game? Fatigue in standing around the 18 yard box for 2/3rd of the match at least.
Eddie you excluded games I didn’t,they are all games,I’m not talking rotation,of course you play your #1 in PL and CL games,all the other games come in tending to make say 3 games in 7 days.
The #2 will get some work.
 

Noo Noo

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 10, 2014
Messages
2,103
Likes
1,779
Seems like the terms of a decent deal for all parties I think.

Reasonable loan fee leading to a reasonable transfer fee. He could be worth significantly more if he sorts himself out (too blunt sorry).

Just wondering however is the terms of the sell on open to abuse or any naughty tactics? Probably not given the relatively small transfer fee. If he does well his value should outstrip that fee.

I assume salary is paid by Besiktas????
 

Mascot88

Yours for £1m. Need to make room for Dean Saunders
Admin
Joined
May 24, 2007
Messages
18,413
Likes
30,658
The problem I have with using Mignolet as back up is that it necessitates a completely different style of play. While Karius might be a step below Alisson, we can at least still play out from the back with a sweeper keeper.

Fingers crossed Alisson stays fit all season.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.