Moses Simon (LW/RW) Gent

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gr_sounder

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Comolli also has a record of claiming credit for things. He left Liverpool in April 2012, during Bobby's first full season at Hoffenheim (at age 20). We didn't sign him until over three years later!

I also have my doubts about the rest of what he says. Firmino was played mainly as an attacking-mid and left-winger, and even when he arrived at Liverpool was played either on the wing or as a no10. None of that, to me, screams 'player who was targeted for his similarity to Lewandowski'. Honestly feel like Comolli is drawing on hindsight here and claiming credit for something he likely played no part in.
He didn't appear to be claiming credit for anything. I understand he has a big mouth. However I think you'll find that Firmino was definitely in our 'base de donnés' at the time (2012).
As for the rest well as I said according to Comolli. Take it all as you wish. I am just relaying what he has said. :-)
 

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Klopptinho

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As always google is your friend.... I couldn't find a reference of Payet to Modric.... but I did find this from 2 years ago.
http://www.hitc.com/en-gb/2016/07/0...ootball-compares-dimitri-payets-ability-to-a/

"He should have been doing it at 24. In terms of the quality and purity of his first touch, the only player who I’ve seen like that is Dennis Bergkamp. He strikes the ball as well as Gerrard."
your link is not complete so doesn't point to an article but rather a ' page doesn't exist'

might need an edit .. or it's just me ?
 

UpTheReds

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I don't know where the Comolli discussion started (must have been with someone I have ignored) but obviously, it should be taken as given that Comolli is a joke.

He set the club back several years, and did the same with Spurs, and probably even now some of the skepticism of fans re: analytics is because of him, even after it's been used so successfully by the club since.

Thank goodness FSG had enough other experience and sense to know he was just terrible and kept the same approach.

Comolli strikes me as a con artist that found he could analytics as a schtick to look like he was valuable and get out of scouting and into the board room, because no one else at the time knew any better. I suppose there's hindsight involved in wondering how he could have been hired after his Spurs tenure.

We should leave him to it at Fenerbahce. He doesn't even merit discussion.
 

Zinedine Biscan

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I don't know where the Comolli discussion started (must have been with someone I have ignored) but obviously, it should be taken as given that Comolli is a joke.

He set the club back several years, and did the same with Spurs, and probably even now some of the skepticism of fans re: analytics is because of him, even after it's been used so successfully by the club since.

Thank goodness FSG had enough other experience and sense to know he was just terrible and kept the same approach.

Comolli strikes me as a con artist that found he could analytics as a schtick to look like he was valuable and get out of scouting and into the board room, because no one else at the time knew any better. I suppose there's hindsight involved in wondering how he could have been hired after his Spurs tenure.

We should leave him to it at Fenerbahce. He doesn't even merit discussion.
I actually agree with this, one of the biggest bullshit merchants in football. I can only think he blinded our owners with the depth of his bullshit when they were still naive about the sport and were still in their infancy at the club. Thankfully it didn't take *too* long before he was discovered for what he is and was given the boot.

Another name, like Hodgson and Rodgers, I hope will eventually stop being mentioned in the same breath as our club through the passage of time, but seems we're not there yet.
 

Chewbazza

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Actually looks half decent for a youngster. Its Youtube of course but we can see he has scary pace and runs at people. Could be a hidden gem
Thanks, good video. If there is genuine interest he could be a good buy at the price being touted. One of the big complaints about subbing off Mane or Salah was a lack of pace, but he looks like he has it in abundance and good control with it.
 
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Klopptinho

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Actually looks half decent for a youngster. Its Youtube of course but we can see he has scary pace and runs at people. Could be a hidden gem
a lot of those clips though are him just running with the ball or showing little end product . i was watching a vid yesterday and i thought ' wouldn;t be great if these clips didn't end and actually showed what happened next!" ( common thought no doubt about every youtube clip on players) lol
 

Chewbazza

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a lot of those clips though are him just running with the ball or showing little end product . i was watching a vid yesterday and i thought ' wouldn;t be great if these clips didn't end and actually showed what happened next!" ( common thought no doubt about every youtube clip on players) lol
Some of the clips perhaps, but I think there's enough that show he has a decent cross on him. With better players around him he could really kick on, and we've seen in a short time the Klopp effect on Firmino's scoring output and Ox's improvement throughout the season.
 

KillerBeeLFC

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a lot of those clips though are him just running with the ball or showing little end product . i was watching a vid yesterday and i thought ' wouldn;t be great if these clips didn't end and actually showed what happened next!" ( common thought no doubt about every youtube clip on players) lol
It has to do with copyright a lot of the time but I get what you mean. Some player decisions will no doubt be garbage but even the ones that hit their man may just show some random Genk player trying an overhead and kicking himself in the face ha. I try to think "what would Firmino or Salah do with that pass". Also, in this video, he is shown running past people constantly so we know its definitely a trait rather than a one or 2 off compiled into the video to make us think hes something hes not.
 
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Klopptinho

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It has to do with copyright a lot of the time but I get what you mean. Some player decisions will no doubt be garbage but even the ones that hit their man may just show some random Genk player trying an overhead and kicking himself in the face ha. I try to think "what would Firmino or Salah do with that pass". Also, in this video, he is shown running past people constantly so we know its definitely a trait rather than a one or 2 off compiled into the video to make us think hes something hes not.
i'd like to see that ! they should include it lol lol
 

KillerBeeLFC

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People seem willing to argue with me over just about everything. :-)
NO THEY DONT!


but on a serious note, it may be to do with your points of view being so matter of fact when they are just your opinion and you seem a little condescending when someone disagrees with you.

Just a couple of snippets from you in this thread

"No, you just didn't understand it in the first place."

"This isn't a gamble, though. He's not a teenager. If he was, I could halfway see the logic. It's just buying cheap."

"oh ffs...I can see I wasted my time then. You have truly learned nothing. "

"Tell you what, i'll make you a bet. If Simon signs, I'll leave the board. If he doesn't, you leave the board. You in? How much confidence do you really have that he's a fit? "

"I could explain a lot more, but your tone and invective suggests you're not of a mind to learn if I did. "

"There's no accounting for people that don't know what they don't know, but think they know. "

This is just from yesterday evening as I couldnt be arsed going back further ha. Your opinions arent facts mate and people can disagree on a public forum without being told they dont understand your higher plain of logic. This guy is 22 so has plenty of time to learn and develop. If Klopp thinks he can do something with him then Id be inclined to agree with him over you sorry.
 
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Klopptinho

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NO THEY DONT!


but on a serious note, it may be to do with your points of view being so matter of fact when they are just your opinion and you seem a little condescending when someone disagrees with you.

Just a couple of snippets from you in this thread

"No, you just didn't understand it in the first place."

"This isn't a gamble, though. He's not a teenager. If he was, I could halfway see the logic. It's just buying cheap."

"oh ffs...I can see I wasted my time then. You have truly learned nothing. "

"Tell you what, i'll make you a bet. If Simon signs, I'll leave the board. If he doesn't, you leave the board. You in? How much confidence do you really have that he's a fit? "

"I could explain a lot more, but your tone and invective suggests you're not of a mind to learn if I did. "

"There's no accounting for people that don't know what they don't know, but think they know. "

This is just from yesterday evening as I couldnt be arsed going back further ha. Your opinions arent facts mate and people can disagree on a public forum without being told they dont understand your higher plain of logic. This guy is 22 so has plenty of time to learn and develop. If Klopp thinks he can do something with him then Id be inclined to agree with him over you sorry.
this member reminds me of a poster that was here a few weeks ago named 'hound' who had very similar issues with people not agreeing with him .
 

Strictly Armchair

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this member reminds me of a poster that was here a few weeks ago named 'hound' who had very similar issues with people not agreeing with him .
And one before that

And one before that

And one before that


And one before that

With regards to the fact that most of us hadn't heard of him beforehand, that's not a concern. There have been many players down the years who had many supporters saying, "Who?" The likes of Clemence, Heighway, Keegan, Case, Neal, Hansen, Whelan, Rush, Nicol and Rob Jones weren't even household names in their own household when they joined us but went on to give us years of sterling service. If this lad is deemed worthy of splashing the cash by Klopp then I'm good with that given the fewer number of signings we have been making since Klopp took charge. However, I'll go along with the theory that it does have a whiff of smokescreen about it. If Shaqiri joins then it'll probably be the last time this lad gets a mention round these parts.
 

RedSeven

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And one before that

And one before that

And one before that

And one before that

With regards to the fact that most of us hadn't heard of him beforehand, that's not a concern. There have been many players down the years who had many supporters saying, "Who?" The likes of Clemence, Heighway, Keegan, Case, Neal, Hansen, Whelan, Rush, Nicol and Rob Jones weren't even household names in their own household when they joined us but went on to give us years of sterling service. If this lad is deemed worthy of splashing the cash by Klopp then I'm good with that given the fewer number of signings we have been making since Klopp took charge. However, I'll go along with the theory that it does have a whiff of smokescreen about it. If Shaqiri joins then it'll probably be the last time this lad gets a mention round these parts.
Definitely looks like we are looking to sign another attacking player.Anyones guess as to weather it's this lad,Shaqiri or Malcom.
 

UpTheReds

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NO THEY DONT!


but on a serious note, it may be to do with your points of view being so matter of fact when they are just your opinion and you seem a little condescending when someone disagrees with you.

Just a couple of snippets from you in this thread

"No, you just didn't understand it in the first place."

"This isn't a gamble, though. He's not a teenager. If he was, I could halfway see the logic. It's just buying cheap."

"oh ffs...I can see I wasted my time then. You have truly learned nothing. "

"Tell you what, i'll make you a bet. If Simon signs, I'll leave the board. If he doesn't, you leave the board. You in? How much confidence do you really have that he's a fit? "

"I could explain a lot more, but your tone and invective suggests you're not of a mind to learn if I did. "

"There's no accounting for people that don't know what they don't know, but think they know. "

This is just from yesterday evening as I couldnt be arsed going back further ha. Your opinions arent facts mate and people can disagree on a public forum without being told they dont understand your higher plain of logic. This guy is 22 so has plenty of time to learn and develop. If Klopp thinks he can do something with him then Id be inclined to agree with him over you sorry.
You're leaving out a lot of me attempting to explain things and being accused of this, cursed at about that, and just met with blind resistance at other times.

But lesson learned, I'll not be as concerned with trying to explain my assessment next time.
 

UpTheReds

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Wow, just wow.
Also stats are only part of the data not the end all and be all.

LFC most probably won't sign Simon. But that will be determined on a number of factors, not just his stats.
If you can't get past the first turn, you're probably not going to win the race.
 

UpTheReds

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I actually agree with this, one of the biggest bullshit merchants in football. I can only think he blinded our owners with the depth of his bullshit when they were still naive about the sport and were still in their infancy at the club. Thankfully it didn't take *too* long before he was discovered for what he is and was given the boot.

Another name, like Hodgson and Rodgers, I hope will eventually stop being mentioned in the same breath as our club through the passage of time, but seems we're not there yet.
I think FSG knew that data had a place and a value in football bc of its exposure to baseball, but they didn't really have anyone that knew football well enough to understand Comolli was full of it. To be fair, I'm not sure how many other clubs did either at that time. Arsenal had bought StatDNA by that time (I think) but i'm not sure they've really ever gotten their value out of that. I don't think Wenger ever listened to them despite him being a numbers guy, and signing Lichtsteiner doesn't suggest much has changed, that or I vastly overrate StatDNA's capabilities.

Honestly if there was one PL club I'd love to take a (relatively) high level position at and see how far you can stretch the data game, it's Huddersfield. I started a writeup last summer with who they should target, but they started buying people too quickly for me to finish it haha. They didn't really do a great job, IMO, and were lucky to stay up. Best move they made was the most obvious one: keeping Mooy. Bournemouth would be a fun one too, bit more money, manager that wants to build a side that will play football. And looks like no one there that knows much on the data side, despite ownership that should be keen to be data-savvy. Wasted so much money.
 
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Chewbazza

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Definitely looks like we are looking to sign another attacking player.Anyones guess as to weather it's this lad,Shaqiri or Malcom.
All things considered I'm leaning towards Simon out of those three, but still holding out (faint) hope that we're going to sign Pulisic or Bailey
 

redbj

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Some of the clips perhaps, but I think there's enough that show he has a decent cross on him. With better players around him he could really kick on, and we've seen in a short time the Klopp effect on Firmino's scoring output and Ox's improvement throughout the season.
whilst i understand the point, this sentiment always amazes me as it seems to ignore the obvious.

(with better players around him, imagine what Firmino is capable of?)
 

HKReds

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whilst i understand the point, this sentiment always amazes me as it seems to ignore the obvious.

(with better players around him, imagine what Firmino is capable of?)
Ya, stupid coach Tite refusing to play him and choosing Gabriel Jesus instead.
 
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NO THEY DONT!

"No, you just didn't understand it in the first place."

"oh ffs...I can see I wasted my time then. You have truly learned nothing. "

"I could explain a lot more, but your tone and invective suggests you're not of a mind to learn if I did. "

"There's no accounting for people that don't know what they don't know, but think they know. "
He is probably educating people. You peasants don't understand his brilliance. He is the BR of TIA.
Note - Apologies guys - just couldn't resist.
 

Neukolln

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Genuine question when it comes to signing Moses Simon...is he that much of an upgrade or improvement over giving Harry Wilson that same opportunity? Or would it be a case of having both and not an either/or?
 



legalalien

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Genuine question when it comes to signing Moses Simon...is he that much of an upgrade or improvement over giving Harry Wilson that same opportunity? Or would it be a case of having both and not an either/or?
I wouldn't be so sure that Harry Wilson is staying. I just came across this in the Guardian's transfer rumours from Tuesday of last week:
Liverpool’s young midfielder Marko Grujic could meanwhile be heading to one of Enrico Chiesa’s old clubs (there are quite a few) in the shape of Lazio, who would like to play him alongside his hotly-tipped occasional Serbia team-mate Sergej Milinkovic-Savic, while Liverpool’s young striker Harry Wilson is wanted by Fulham and Huddersfield, both of whom would pay up to £7m for his services.
 

RobLFC

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I'd expect Grujic to go if there is a reasonable offer, but I would be amazed if Wilson goes after his performances on loan last year, unless there was an offer far above £7m (maybe £20m or so might do it).
 
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I wouldn't be so sure that Harry Wilson is staying. I just came across this in the Guardian's transfer rumours from Tuesday of last week:
Liverpool’s young midfielder Marko Grujic could meanwhile be heading to one of Enrico Chiesa’s old clubs (there are quite a few) in the shape of Lazio, who would like to play him alongside his hotly-tipped occasional Serbia team-mate Sergej Milinkovic-Savic, while Liverpool’s young striker Harry Wilson is wanted by Fulham and Huddersfield, both of whom would pay up to £7m for his services.
We sold Ibe for 15m. I think we would most probably loan both Grujic and Wilson. May be to PL clubs where they can get atleast 1000-2000 minutes of action. Kent on the other hand - looks like will be sold along with DS, Origi and even Ings.
 
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legalalien

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We sold One for 15m. I think we would most probably loan both Grujic and Wilson. May be to PL clubs where they can get atleast 1000-2000 minutes of action. Kent on the other hand - looks like will be sold along with DS, Origi and even Ings.
I see that on the keyboard, I and B are next to O and N. Looks like the World Cup spirit is having its effect on you too.:-):well done:
 
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