POST MATCH: Burnley v Liverpool (EPL 5/12/2018 7.45pm)

Man of the Match

  • Alisson

  • Gomez (off 23)

  • Matip

  • Van Dijk

  • Moreno (off 65)

  • Henderson

  • Keita

  • Milner

  • Shaqiri

  • Sturridge

  • Origi (off 65)

  • Alexander-Arnold (on 23)

  • Firmino (on 65)

  • Salah (on 65)


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Arminius

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I think that unfortunately the offside law is now so complex and open to interpretation regarding interference with play and second phase. I don't believe most fans and many officials fully understand it. I just looked at it again and was amazed to see that you can't be offside from a goal kick. How many of you knew that?

The first line of the law states ....It is not an offence to be in an offside position....something most fans forget.
The one that gets most people seems to be the fact that you cannot be offside from a throw-in. But neither that nor the goal-kick one has changed in the past century.
 
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That's Epic man.
At somewhere like Turf Moor, you always have to win a battle before you can win a football match. That’s fine, and Burnley are entitled to use their physicality and aggression, if that’s all they have in the locker.

But to say we should respond in kind ignores the twat in the middle of the pitch who has decided (or the Premier League has decided) his job is not ‘enforce the rules’, it’s ‘level the playing field’.

Atwell was allowing Burnley to make all kinds of cynical, dangerous tackles last night. The tackle on Moreno early on is a definite yellow, and he doesn’t even give a foul (and Moreno then get boo’d for the rest of the Match by the Burnley crowd who are, well, basic). Danny Sturridge gets physically pushed off the pitch and gets nothing.

But if we respond in kind, what happens? The yellow cards come out. We have skilful, technical expensive players, so we’re not allowed to be physical. Burnley are yard dogs, so they are.

We can’t meet Burnley in kind if the Refs, and they have shown this time and time again, are applying different rules to the LFC as they are to the other 19 teams.
FIFY. If we play at home, the refs level the playing field for the opposition. If we play away the refs play home advantage. Bloody f*****s the whole lot.
 

Gone Kloppo

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It's exactly this kind of thing which makes VAR so essential. Didn't we have a legitimate goal ruled out earlier in the season for offside, when replays showed it wasn't? I think we dropped points on that occasion, thank goodness the same didn't happen last night. In a sport of fine margin, game-changing decisions like these can't be left up to human error.
I am just going to say it quietly, but I think VAR will hurt our team a lot as well. Watch closely at how we try to play entire teams offside at free kicks this season. We play it extremely tight and high, and often rely on the linesmen getting a tight call correct. I have counted a number of times this season where the opposition deliberately sat one of their forwards in an offside position to try to draw our defenders back and we got given the offside when the receiver was clearly onside (offside guy was not interfering with play).

This won't be a unique situation to us, but I think we will see plenty of offsides overruled by VAR if it is introduced next season. Can't say I'm looking forward to it.
 
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The one that gets most people seems to be the fact that you cannot be offside from a throw-in. But neither that nor the goal-kick one has changed in the past century.
So if you have a keeper that can kick to the other penalty area, you can put a player next to their keeper every time there is a goal kick :shocked:

I'll send JK a message............
 

Zinedine Biscan

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Tbh after they scored I was certain this was going to be our

I am just going to say it quietly, but I think VAR will hurt our team a lot as well. Watch closely at how we try to play entire teams offside at free kicks this season. We play it extremely tight and high, and often rely on the linesmen getting a tight call correct. I have counted a number of times this season where the opposition deliberately sat one of their forwards in an offside position to try to draw our defenders back and we got given the offside when the receiver was clearly onside (offside guy was not interfering with play).

This won't be a unique situation to us, but I think we will see plenty of offsides overruled by VAR if it is introduced next season. Can't say I'm looking forward to it.
For me it's not about giving us an advantage or otherwise, but the need to make sure all - or as many as is physically possible - decisions are correct. If we concede goals due to the above scenario no doubt we'd adapt our approach accordingly in any case.
 
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Midfield for me is Fabinho, Milner, Keita. It just has to be. Use Ginny to rest Keita, Henderson to rest Milner, but not at the same time. At least 2 of the 3 need to be in our midfield. They would compliment each other near perfect imo.

Great to see Firmino score, Shaqs doing great, Alisson and Virgil are my favorites. Love it.

Pulled out a win from being down and rested some players. Sounds to good to be true... oh yeah Joe... Hoping for a speedy recovery!
 

Caradoc

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In the first half Burnley tried to beat us up without the ball. In the second half we beat them up with the ball. All 3 of our goals were beautifully worked.

And just a word on James Milner. What a servant this man has been to this wonderful football club of ours. Brilliantly taken goal last night and at such a crucial time in the match. Next to Stevie G he’s the person I would most like to see involved in the future management of LFC.
 

Gone Kloppo

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I’ll say it again. Any Liverpool player that responds to thuggery in kind, would be sent off. That’s the way it goes.
But thats a reflection of our lack of drilling in how to execute the dark arts. Milly probably the best at it. He has laid some pretty rough (note: not necessarily dangerous) challenges this year that I've seen been given as yellows to others. He's good at it. He escapes punishment.

Is Hendo the only player of ours to be sent off this season? And both yellows were 175% justified.

I thought the ref was just bad last night. Not biased.
 

Arminius

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Its in the rule book. Drop ball was removed I believe in 1990 or thereabouts.
The reason for the rule goes all the way back to the institution of the corner in 1873 - it was realized fairly quickly that kicking the ball right off the corner flag was impossible, but if the wedge around it was considered legal, it was impossible for the referee to determine if there were three defenders in front of any attacker in the very small area. So it was decided that there was no offside on corners.

The offside rule was three defenders until the 1920's.
 
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He now is compared to Virgil at all times.. Not in his league (or Gomez's either!) As I said watch the video, he stands still, nearly plays them onside, then remains standing still looking at the ball, he could have done multiple things better then.. All basic defending aspects.
He could have mate - but he's a bloody human being playing a sport that's based on doing things instinctively.

It's easy for us to sit here and say what he should and shouldn't do from the comfort of our homes and the comfort of about 50 slow mo replays for us to go "oh well if at that split second he's moved 5 inches this way he's have played them all offside - he's so shit isn't he".

Basic defending aspects - yes - but he's a human who has not played regularly. It's never as easy as just doing it.

If Gomez is now out, and he plays week in week out, he will be solid watch.
 
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The reason for the rule goes all the way back to the institution of the corner in 1873 - it was realized fairly quickly that kicking the ball right off the corner flag was impossible, but if the wedge around it was considered legal, it was impossible for the referee to determine if there were three defenders in front of any attacker in the very small area. So it was decided that there was no offside on corners.

The offside rule was three defenders until the 1920's.
The other aspect that some fans fail to understand is that the two defenders don't have to include the keeper. It isn't the keeper plus 1 although it normally is.

We had a goal disallowed last season and there was an outcry from some because there was a defender on the line (so he couldn't be offside :unhappy:). Our attacker was ahead of the keeper who had come out.
 

Gone Kloppo

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He now is compared to Virgil at all times.. Not in his league (or Gomez's either!) As I said watch the video, he stands still, nearly plays them onside, then remains standing still looking at the ball, he could have done multiple things better then.. All basic defending aspects.
Ahh I thought we might finally get through a post-match thread without players getting singled out again..


I'm a bit too naïve.
 

Caradoc

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The reason for the rule goes all the way back to the institution of the corner in 1873 - it was realized fairly quickly that kicking the ball right off the corner flag was impossible, but if the wedge around it was considered legal, it was impossible for the referee to determine if there were three defenders in front of any attacker in the very small area. So it was decided that there was no offside on corners.

The offside rule was three defenders until the 1920's.

Don’t need to know the reason or the history - just the fact!


Btw ....... be careful you don’t overload that brain of yours ........ ! ;-)





:-)
.
.
.
 

Neukolln

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That turd last night even had a go at Klopp and the temerity of talking about putting a marker on the game after his players flew into challenges without regard for the safety of their opponent, injuring Gomez. Fuck him and everyone else like him, the sooner they and their ideas disappear into oblivion, the better.

Oh and they can take the idiots who are officiating with them. Like Mascot says their role is to enforce the rules, not to level the playing field. The tolerance displayed towards this kind of tactics is incredulous and stupefying.
All of this. And I could not believe Dyche had the balls to say in his post game pc that the "ref was giving them nothing". It was literally one of the first things out of his mouth. Simply outrageous.
 
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I thought the ref was just bad last night. Not biased.
He was bad. Impossible to say if he was bias due to the completely contrasting styles of thuggery. What can be said is Burnley got an advantage from how the referee interpreted the rules (that's very close to bias but it isn't bias). The only way to test it would be for us to play in an equally vile manner as our opponents and I am not for that and it's evident neither is Klopp.
 
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All of this. And I could not believe Dyche had the balls to say in his post game pc that the "ref was giving them nothing". It was literally one of the first things out of his mouth. Simply outrageous.
And that is what all fans of all teams believe. Check out all the forums........;-)
 

liver1

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This was a great performance in the end. Not because we were great but the fact that we werent that great, went a goal down, away from home, in the rain, against an injury inducing team, and turned it around.

In previous seasons we would have crumbled and lost that game thinking its not going to be our day but instead we turned it around.
 



Iluvatar

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Ahh I thought we might finally get through a post-match thread without players getting singled out again..

I'm a bit too naïve.
Come on, no need for such dramatics is there? Far too many can't take a bit of a debate even if the point is negative.

I don't rate Matip, I think our team has massively progressed past his ability. I didn't think he had a good match last night, poor passing, was bullied by their forwards and was very slow to react in the box.. All hallmarks of his time here, so it's not a knee jerk based on last night. For a player who is 1 inch taller than Van Dijk is he is nowhere near as good in the air (he should be).
 

Arminius

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Don’t need to know the reason or the history - just the fact!


Btw ....... be careful you don’t overload that brain of yours ........ ! ;-)
I read a lot of history of the game over the years - it actually helps to understand the rules as they are when you understand the possibilities, often tried, that have been ruled out. Dyche is clearly a pre-1863 football purist who believes that 'hacking is the true football'
 

Caradoc

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I read a lot of history of the game over the years - it actually helps to understand the rules as they are when you understand the possibilities, often tried, that have been ruled out. Dyche is clearly a pre-1863 football purist who believes that 'hacking is the true football'

I think you read a lot full stop ..... ! :well done:
 

Arminius

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The other aspect that some fans fail to understand is that the two defenders don't have to include the keeper. It isn't the keeper plus 1 although it normally is.

We had a goal disallowed last season and there was an outcry from some because there was a defender on the line (so he couldn't be offside :unhappy:). Our attacker was ahead of the keeper who had come out.
That is actually a very difficult thing to teach assistant refs to call (meaning young learners, not say, PL assistants), because it is very easy to get into the trap of simply watching the last defender and assuming the keeper.