POST MATCH: Burnley v Liverpool (EPL 5/12/2018 7.45pm)

Man of the Match

  • Alisson

  • Gomez (off 23)

  • Matip

  • Van Dijk

  • Moreno (off 65)

  • Henderson

  • Keita

  • Milner

  • Shaqiri

  • Sturridge

  • Origi (off 65)

  • Alexander-Arnold (on 23)

  • Firmino (on 65)

  • Salah (on 65)


Results are only viewable after voting.

Werder4life

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Doesn't really show what I liked best about Naby's performance yesterday - he has kind of been dropped into the deep end of a variation of English footy he never faced before: wet , physical (brutish at times) and against the odds of a heavily rotated team falling a goal behind. Still managed to impose his unique style of ball winning/protecting by evasive movement/finding angles to release into feet or channels. Quite impressive. Bodes well for upcomming games against less "destructive" teams. Hope he gets a run of games now to reach peak Naby in time for ManC away - because he could be the game changer for that one.
 
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So when we play the likes of Madrid, Barcelona and PSG we can be physical, (there's been plenty of posts on here regarding a midfield with some bite to it) yet when a team does it to us they're a disgrace????
Being physical is one thing. Going for the opponent's ankle is quite another.
 

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Still pissed off how their goal was allowed. Alisson had both hands on the ball when it was kicked out. To make it worse I flicked over to watch the last ten minutes of the Mancs and De Gea was holding the ball in ONE hand when one of the Arsenal strikers headed it out and put it in the net. Ref blew straight away for a free kick. The ref in our game was an utter disgrace. At least six of the Burnley tackles were borderline red cards but f**k all was given.
The first half was very ragged with neither Origi or Sturridge impressing. Thought we looked vulnerable at all of their corners which I suppose is to be expected with some of the cavemen they had. As average as they have been this season bringing Bobby and Mo on made a huge difference to our performance. Great strike from Milner to draw us level.
Gave Keita my MOM for a promising performance. Lets hope he gets a decent run of games now.
 
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He could easily have broken Moreno's leg with that kind of challenge, the fact he didn't get a free kick is quite remarkable, the ref is at fault for that especially as that foul Matip gave away was softer than some penalties at Old Trafford over the years.
I don't mind strong challenges on the acceptable fringes of the game, I think a ref that lets them go for both teams helps the games sometimes, but blowing up for that Matip foul, not spotting the offside on Burnley's goal and letting such a hideous challenge on Moreno go by well that's shoddy officiating, especially that challenge.

Anyhow another of those grounds I hate us going to, I have noticed a lot of those we have got rid off throughout the first half of the season.
 

Caradoc

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Doesn't really show what I liked best about Naby's performance yesterday - he has kind of been dropped into the deep end of a variation of English footy he never faced before: wet , physical (brutish at times) and against the odds of a heavily rotated team falling a goal behind. Still managed to impose his unique style of ball winning/protecting by evasive movement/finding angles to release into feet or channels. Quite impressive. Bodes well for upcomming games against less "destructive" teams. Hope he gets a run of games now to reach peak Naby in time for ManC away - because he could be the game changer for that one.

I’m going to stick my neck out and say that Keita’s performance yesterday was one of the best performances if not the best performance by a Liverpool player this season. All that was missing was a goal but my God the little fella tried hard enough to score one. He was simply sublime yesterday.
 
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Lowton_Red

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Well it was a typical game of two halves. In the first half I though my fears regarding team selection were going to be proven right. Attwell allowed Burnley to get away with everything. He typifies all that is wrong with PL referees. It is not his job to "level the playing field". If Burnley were going to be outclassed so be it. It is his job to enforce the rules fairly and without bias.

He simply isn't up to the job.

The second half was a different matter. The tactical changes made by Klopp paid off and our class showed.

The only disappointment of the half was the burnley goal, which should have been disallowed for offside. Woods (10) is in an offside position when Tarkowski (5) heads the ball (frame # 57), and becomes active when he touches the ball (frame #76). Evidently attwell and his assistance apply the rules arbitrarily to "level the playing field".



My MOTM was Keita.:well done:

Burnley's MOTM attwell.:unhappy:
 

Iluvatar

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Well it was a typical game of two halves. In the first half I though my fears regarding team selection were going to be proven right. Attwell allowed Burnley to get away with everything. He typifies all that is wrong with PL referees. It is not his job to "level the playing field". If Burnley were going to be outclassed so be it. It is his job to enforce the rules fairly and without bias.

He simply isn't up to the job.

The second half was a different matter. The tactical changes made by Klopp paid off and our class showed.

The only disappointment of the half was the burnley goal, which should have been disallowed for offside. Woods (10) is in an offside position when Tarkowski (5) heads the ball (frame # 57), and becomes active when he touches the ball (frame #76). Evidently attwell and his assistance apply the rules arbitrarily to "level the playing field".



My MOTM was Keita.:well done:

Burnley's MOTM attwell.:unhappy:
You are right but watch Matip in that entire clip. Just looks like a headless chicken. Very disappointed in him last night.
 

Zinedine Biscan

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Well it was a typical game of two halves. In the first half I though my fears regarding team selection were going to be proven right. Attwell allowed Burnley to get away with everything. He typifies all that is wrong with PL referees. It is not his job to "level the playing field". If Burnley were going to be outclassed so be it. It is his job to enforce the rules fairly and without bias.

He simply isn't up to the job.

The second half was a different matter. The tactical changes made by Klopp paid off and our class showed.

The only disappointment of the half was the burnley goal, which should have been disallowed for offside. Woods (10) is in an offside position when Tarkowski (5) heads the ball (frame # 57), and becomes active when he touches the ball (frame #76). Evidently attwell and his assistance apply the rules arbitrarily to "level the playing field".



My MOTM was Keita.:well done:

Burnley's MOTM attwell.:unhappy:
It's exactly this kind of thing which makes VAR so essential. Didn't we have a legitimate goal ruled out earlier in the season for offside, when replays showed it wasn't? I think we dropped points on that occasion, thank goodness the same didn't happen last night. In a sport of fine margin, game-changing decisions like these can't be left up to human error.
 

Commando

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The stream I had on my telly had an English commentator with Iain Dowie as a co-commentator. The commentator says as the second half kicked off that all of our goals at Turf Moor (in the PL era) had come in the second halves of games. "Will that change tonight"? He then says. No you dig because we've already had the first half and we never scored! Then when Burnley scored he pointed out that they'd never lost when Cork had scored for them. Milly equalises and Dowie points out that the same can be said for when Milly scores for us. "Well that has to change tonight then". No it doesn't you div. If the score remains 1-1 nobody loses.
 
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You are right but watch Matip in that entire clip. Just looks like a headless chicken. Very disappointed in him last night.
Headless chicken is way over the top. He misplaced a couple of passes, but generally was solid I thought. Don't forget, he'sa human being and not played regularly for a while. Can't expect them to be machines and just turn up and perform. Even a car needs to be warmed up before it performs at its best, and that's a machine with no emotion, feelings etc.
 

Iluvatar

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It's exactly this kind of thing which makes VAR so essential. Didn't we have a legitimate goal ruled out earlier in the season for offside, when replays showed it wasn't? I think we dropped points on that occasion, thank goodness the same didn't happen last night. In a sport of fine margin, game-changing decisions like these can't be left up to human error.
Strangely the goal actually helped us as we released the shackles and went through the gears after it. But agree joke some of the officiating in this league.
 
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The only disappointment of the half was the burnley goal, which should have been disallowed for offside. Woods (10) is in an offside position when Tarkowski (5) heads the ball (frame # 57), and becomes active when he touches the ball (frame #76). Evidently attwell and his assistance apply the rules arbitrarily to "level the playing field".

Except Referees don't call the offsides...........ever.

It was extremely marginal in any case and decisions like that happen in almost every game and will do so until they use VAR to confirm the validity of every single goal.
 

Lowton_Red

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It's exactly this kind of thing which makes VAR so essential. Didn't we have a legitimate goal ruled out earlier in the season for offside, when replays showed it wasn't? I think we dropped points on that occasion, thank goodness the same didn't happen last night. In a sport of fine margin, game-changing decisions like these can't be left up to human error.
Correct. Sadio's goal against the arse was wrongly dissallowed for offside.
 

Iluvatar

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Headless chicken is way over the top. He misplaced a couple of passes, but generally was solid I thought. Don't forget, he'sa human being and not played regularly for a while. Can't expect them to be machines and just turn up and perform. Even a car needs to be warmed up before it performs at its best, and that's a machine with no emotion, feelings etc.
He now is compared to Virgil at all times.. Not in his league (or Gomez's either!) As I said watch the video, he stands still, nearly plays them onside, then remains standing still looking at the ball, he could have done multiple things better then.. All basic defending aspects.
 

Commando

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Headless chicken is way over the top. He misplaced a couple of passes, but generally was solid I thought. Don't forget, he'sa human being and not played regularly for a while. Can't expect them to be machines and just turn up and perform. Even a car needs to be warmed up before it performs at its best, and that's a machine with no emotion, feelings etc.
He now is compared to Virgil at all times.. Not in his league (or Gomez's either!) As I said watch the video, he stands still, nearly plays them onside, then remains standing still looking at the ball, he could have done multiple things better then.. All basic defending aspects.
Headless chickens tend to run about. Statuesque would be a more apt description of him during that phase of play. I'm not slagging him off here. Just saying that there is a drop off in ability between him and Joe. Hope Joe is back soon.
 

Sweeting

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Still pissed off how their goal was allowed. Alisson had both hands on the ball when it was kicked out. To make it worse I flicked over to watch the last ten minutes of the Mancs and De Gea was holding the ball in ONE hand when one of the Arsenal strikers headed it out and put it in the net. Ref blew straight away for a free kick. The ref in our game was an utter disgrace. At least six of the Burnley tackles were borderline red cards but f**k all was given.
The first half was very ragged with neither Origi or Sturridge impressing. Thought we looked vulnerable at all of their corners which I suppose is to be expected with some of the cavemen they had. As average as they have been this season bringing Bobby and Mo on made a huge difference to our performance. Great strike from Milner to draw us level.
Gave Keita my MOM for a promising performance. Lets hope he gets a decent run of games now.
Should have been disallowed before any of that as the first player to go for the ball is clearly offside and interferes with play.
 

DanLFC

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Great 3 points but massively dissapinted for Joe, form of his life for club and country and and some utter stupidity could see him on the sidelines for weeks or more.

Most angry ive been watching a game in a long time. It was as though they wanted to injure as many of our players as possible. Useless Ref did nothing to reign it in either was a disgrace when you see cards handed out like candy in other games. Honestly thought Sean Dyche was a better manager than to resort to thuggery and he still didnt get the 3 points.

Hope they enjoy the Championship, thats where they deserve to be
 
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I call Turf Moor, Mordor! Bunch of Orcs and other such delightful creatures in those parts.

As for the rough stuff, I think three things about that:

1. An outmatched team will resort to that to try to close the gap in quality. It’s unpleasant, but not exactly surprising.

2. At that point the ref needs to get a grip. If the rough stuff is a couple of hard tackles, fine. But if it is dangerous play, that goes beyond the rules, the ref should be able to see that and calm it down with a word, or a card, or more. The ref in this instance had a poor game as he did none of that and there is a legitimate case to say the players were in danger due to him not enforcing the rules.

3. Since neither of the first two options are in our control, we need to be able to physically mix it too. Obviously for a team like Liverpool, just having a yard dog won’t do. They have to be able to play as well. Souness bossed the midfield and would stick his foot in. Opposing teams knew if they wanted to fight he would fight them, no problem - and win. Granted, the game has moved on since those days, but we can update the name.

Steven Gerrard was one of the best players in the world, but he stuck his foot in too. Early in his career he got a couple of unnecessary red cards while he learned that side of the game, but later in his career he was a master. I remember Fellaini roughing our players up, and Stevie went through him and won a header. It all looked legitimate, but Fellaini sat on the floor, dazed, with blood pouring down his face wondering what happened.

To update further, Fernandinho is a newer version of that sort playing in a top team today. Nowhere near Stevie’s level, but he can play, otherwise he wouldn’t get a game in that Man City team. He also knows how to do more than his fair share of fouls and rough treatment, and bafflingly, the refs don’t seem to see it.

My hope is Fabinho will become that for us. He can play, and his passing isn’t just backwards or square. He passes crisply, and forward too, and in his last game or two there were signs that he’s getting to grips with the Prem. Before very long we should be seeing Fabinho and Keita feature in the side more often than not, and the midfield level will go up a notch or two.

Besides being able to play, Fabinho sticks his foot in and doesn’t get bullied. At first glance I think he needs to learn to be a bit more sly, as he looks like he will accumulate a lot of cards when he plays more regularly. Be that as it may, he will help the team with the rough stuff, and all of a sudden, when I look at some of the players we have in the spine, it is starting to, well, grow a spine!
 



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Mascot88

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I call Turf Moor, Mordor! Bunch of Orcs and other such delightful creatures in those parts.

As for the rough stuff, I think three things about that:

1. An outmatched team will resort to that to try to close the gap in quality. It’s unpleasant, but not exactly surprising.

2. At that point the ref needs to get a grip. If the rough stuff is a couple of hard tackles, fine. But if it is dangerous play, that goes beyond the rules, the ref should be able to see that and calm it down with a word, or a card, or more. The ref in this instance had a poor game as he did none of that and there is a legitimate case to say the players were in danger due to him not enforcing the rules.

3. Since neither of the first two options are in our control, we need to be able to physically mix it too. Obviously for a team like Liverpool just having a yard dog won’t do. They have to be able to play as well. Souness bossed the midfield and would stick his foot in. Opposing teams knew if they wanted to fight he would fight them, no problem - and win. Granted, the game has moved on since those days, but we can update the name.

Steven Gerrard was one of the best players in the world, but he stuck his foot in too. Early in his career he got a couple of unnecessary red cards while he learned that side of the game, but later in his career he was a master. I remember Fellaini roughing our players up, and Stevie went through him and won a header. It all looked legitimate, but Fellaini sat on the floor, dazed, with blood pouring down his face wondering what happened.

To update further, Fernandinho is a newer version of that sort playing in a top team today. He can play, otherwise he wouldn’t get a game, but he also knows how to do more than his fair share of fouls and rough treatment, and bafflingly, the refs don’t seem to see it.

My hope is Fabinho will becomes that for us. He can play, and his passing isn’t just backwards or square. He passes crisply, and forwards too, and in his last game or two there were signs that he’s getting to grips with the Prem. Before very long we should be seeing Fabinho and Keita feature in he side more often than not, and the midfield level will go up a notch or two.

Besides being able to play, Fabinho sticks his foot in and doesn’t get bullied. At first glance I think he needs to learn to be a bit more sly, as he looks like he will accumulate a lot of cards when he plays more regularly. Be that as it may, he will help the team with the rough stuff, and all of a sudden the spine is starting to, well, grow a spine!
I’ll say it again. Any Liverpool player that responds to thuggery in kind, would be sent off. That’s the way it goes.
 

Arminius

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I’ll say it again. Any Liverpool player that responds to thuggery in kind, would be sent off. That’s the way it goes.
The trick on those scissor tackles like Mee's is not to respond in kind, it is to jump straight up and then down again planting your studs on someone's groin. Defenders stay on their feet a little better after they see one of those.
 
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I’ll say it again. Any Liverpool player that responds to thuggery in kind, would be sent off. That’s the way it goes.
I understand your point, as it does seem that the refs apply the rules unevenly. So in that case, we have to be less obvious with it.

In the example I gave between Stevie and Fellaini, our man put their man in his place, put a marker down that no one roughs up our players, and he stayed on the pitch.

Edit
Stevie did it to others too and didn’t get punished. From memory I remember a crunching tackle on Jack Wiltshire that put the then Arsenal man on the floor. Prior to that Wilshere had engaged in rough play and Stevie upped the ante and sorted it out.
 
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I think that unfortunately the offside law is now so complex and open to interpretation regarding interference with play and second phase. I don't believe most fans and many officials fully understand it. I just looked at it again and was amazed to see that you can't be offside from a goal kick. How many of you knew that?

The first line of the law states ....It is not an offence to be in an offside position....something most fans forget.