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Post-Match discussion: Liverpool vs Everton 0-0

gasband

The Singaporean Liverpool Never Managed To Sign
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Cmon energy and ability are overrated. All we need is a player who stands in one position throughout the match and juggles the ball and confuse the opponents.
 


Johnny T.

Still Grumpy....
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Aug 24, 2003
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4,098
Downing has to go, not Liverpool quality.

And Unfortunatley Lucas was poor (again) yesterday. I wonder if he will prove again to his best, and if that best is good enough for a meaningful push on next season.

Positives: Stevie still has it in spades, Coutinho will need to bite someone or abuse them not to win Player of the Year next season. He is special.
 

Walker9009

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Apr 28, 2013
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Everton fan view here:

Both teams poor, draw was the right result although it is annoying to have that goal chalked off. You may bring up the one at goodison for you but there were two very different points about that one. Suarez shouldn't have been on the field and there actually was a foul on our defender from Coates. Anyway, that point is moot now and so is yesterday's.

See you next season, hopefully the standard is a lot better.
 

craigbellamy

Swinging away, hoping to land one on a motd idiot
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Oct 20, 2009
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2,400
What a dog of a game that was.

No point going over old ground apart from getting rid of Downing as soon as the transfer windows opens.

Again, what a dog of a game.................one of the worst of the season.

Congrats to Kenwright for probably ending the season above us, i'll kick in with the silver polish.....anyone else?
 

gingerbread

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Will be hilarious if the lack of competition in this game will bring us to Europe through FPL....

3 yellow cars, with the last two in the last minutes.
 



EdWood

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ChicagoRed said:
Downing and Henderson both provided a clear reality check they need gone with in the summer.
Wasn't Hendo played out of position again? Like Sturridge, he's normally a totally different proposition when played centrally; putting him out wide does him no favours whatsoever.

This is not a new situation at LFC. Kuyt (he was a striker if anyone can remember that far back) was played out wide because Rafa had no right winger worthy of the name at the club and we rarely saw the best of him again. Lucas, then a CM, was shoe-horned in as a DM despite not having played there before, because Rafa had no proper DM available (to accompany Mascharano) when Xabi left. When Lucas was injured both Kenny and BR tried several different CMs out of position (all performed poorly) because they had no specialist DMs capable of playing first team football. Also Johnno has had to play at LB whenever Enrique's been out because of a lack of cover there. Now that Coutinho has gone central, this leaves us short out wide again, hence Hendo being shunted outside.

The pattern is there for all to see. Our on going problem for about five years now has been a lack of decent cover for any given position. We shouldn't blame individuals who are being asked to do a job that they're not familiar with and performing poorly as a result.

The problems are twofold: This current LFC squad is short in numbers and has insufficient depth in terms of quality. A paltry rumoured £25m transfer budget is frankly taking the p*ss in addressing those fundamental problems.

I absolutely agree with you about Downing though.
 
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Walker9009 said:
Everton fan view here:

Both teams poor, draw was the right result although it is annoying to have that goal chalked off. You may bring up the one at goodison for you but there were two very different points about that one. Suarez shouldn't have been on the field and there actually was a foul on our defender from Coates. Anyway, that point is moot now and so is yesterday's.

See you next season, hopefully the standard is a lot better.
Why should Suarez have been off? Just like Felliani should have been off yesterday for around 3 elbows to the face?
 

EdWood

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liverpool_singh said:
Why should Suarez have been off? Just like Felliani should have been off yesterday for around 3 elbows to the face?
Guys, Suarez is serving a 10 game ban. Hello? :rolleyes:
 

hugo the horrible

Ridiculously optimistic.(even more so now)
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EdWood said:
Wasn't Hendo played out of position again? Like Sturridge, he's normally a totally different proposition when played centrally; putting him out wide does him no favours whatsoever.

This is not a new situation at LFC. Kuyt (he was a striker if anyone can remember that far back) was played out wide because Rafa had no right winger worthy of the name at the club and we rarely saw the best of him again. Lucas, then a CM, was shoe-horned in as a DM, despite not having played there before, because Rafa had no proper DM available (to accompany Mascharano) when Xabi left. When Lucas was injured both Kenny and BR tried several different CMs out of position (all performed poorly) because they had no specialist DMs capable of playing first team football. Also Johnno has had to play at LB whenever Enrique's been out because of a lack of covet there. Now that Coutinho has gone central, this leaves us short out wide again, hence Hendo being shunted outside.

The pattern is there for all to see. Our on going problem for about five years now has been a lack of decent cover for any given position. We shouldn't blame individuals who are being asked to do a job that they're not familiar with and performing poorly as a result.

The problems are twofold: This current LFC squad is short in numbers and has insufficient depth in terms of quality. A paltry rumoured £25m transfer budget is frankly taking the p*ss in addressing those fundamental problems.

I totally agree with you about Downing though.
In total agreement with this, particularly with Kuyt, an out and out striker played wide by successive managers, but still gave 100%.
See this repeating itself with Hendo being played wide,he is a solid central player who is out of his depth out wide-as we saw last season.
Ed has dealt with the reasons for this well.
 



Dhoff3

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Ugh, the only positive is that pundits won't be able to say we're a better team without Suarez based on the Newcastle game and that we should sell him. We had no attacking edge, we really missed him. Poor game.
 

Walker9009

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liverpool_singh said:
Why should Suarez have been off? Just like Felliani should have been off yesterday for around 3 elbows to the face?




Both accidental? At least one if not both are a yellow, plus there were plenty of other niggly fouls throughout from him.

Like I said though, the point is moot because nothing happened.
 

Quagmire81

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EdWood said:
Wasn't Hendo played out of position again? Like Sturridge, he's normally a totally different proposition when played centrally; putting him out wide does him no favours whatsoever.

This is not a new situation at LFC. Kuyt (he was a striker if anyone can remember that far back) was played out wide because Rafa had no right winger worthy of the name at the club and we rarely saw the best of him again. Lucas, then a CM, was shoe-horned in as a DM despite not having played there before, because Rafa had no proper DM available (to accompany Mascharano) when Xabi left. When Lucas was injured both Kenny and BR tried several different CMs out of position (all performed poorly) because they had no specialist DMs capable of playing first team football. Also Johnno has had to play at LB whenever Enrique's been out because of a lack of cover there. Now that Coutinho has gone central, this leaves us short out wide again, hence Hendo being shunted outside.

The pattern is there for all to see. Our on going problem for about five years now has been a lack of decent cover for any given position. We shouldn't blame individuals who are being asked to do a job that they're not familiar with and performing poorly as a result.

The problems are twofold: This current LFC squad is short in numbers and has insufficient depth in terms of quality. A paltry rumoured £25m transfer budget is frankly taking the p*ss in addressing those fundamental problems.

I absolutely agree with you about Downing though.
I think you on to something, it all started back with kuyt picked out wide cause of his work enthics rather than his wing-abilities, but his many goals pretty much made up for it. Then we had lucas play as macherano v.2.0 when we needed a creative playmaker to take over for Xabi, that partnership was disasterous, and then masch said goodbye. We still haven't found a worthy replacement for Xabi, so that's two downgrades in the centre we still haven't dealt with. This is the ghost that still haunts us as I see it.

Thing is everytime we got a new manager, We haven't sovled this problem, we just ran with it and even added to the problem.

Rodgers still using henderson our wide is just another examble of us going round in circles, there was no real need to put him out there, He obviously did it to increase coutinho's value to the team but that sure backfired, him swithing Cou back out wide late in the game tells it was a complete failure, guess he never learned the old wisdom if it ain't broke, don't fix it. Coutinho out to the left and Jordan in the center have worked out more than well for us since Cou arrived, so why on earth change that?! and in such a important game as this one.

Can't really blame budget as you do tho, when we evident had more than plenty of money and time to fix it. But we seem to have a poor record of either casting the wrong players or plain use them wrong.
 

TheSweetSilverSong

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gasband said:
Everton is not secured in 6th, in fact, they would have wanted to win because Europa League for 5th placing well within their reach so they would have wanted to win. With this draw, they are still ahead by 5 points but they can throw 6th placing away by losing against Chelsea and drawing against West Ham, so they will need 2 points at least from these 2 games to be secured in 6th, provided we win our last 2 games too. So I must say, Everton, though may be happy with a point would have been motivated to win against us.
Yes, of course it's mathematically possible but quite a blinder bet.. Anyway, point was that what you say is what I thought before the game, so I said I expected a lot of goals in the pre-match thread, as both teams would be motivated to win, but that in the end Everton came to draw and their game approach shows they are happy to count on beating at least west ham and/or us drawing one of two games.
 



EdWood

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I think you on to something, it all started back with kuyt picked out wide cause of his work enthics rather than his wing-abilities, but his many goals pretty much made up for it. Then we had lucas play as macherano v.2.0 when we needed a creative playmaker to take over for Xabi, that partnership was disasterous, and then masch said goodbye. We still haven't found a worthy replacement for Xabi, so that's two downgrades in the centre we still haven't dealt with. This is the ghost that still haunts us as I see it.

Thing is everytime we got a new manager, We haven't sovled this problem, we just ran with it and even added to the problem.

Rodgers still using henderson our wide is just another examble of us going round in circles, there was no real need to put him out there, He obviously did it to increase coutinho's value to the team but that sure backfired, him swithing Cou back out wide late in the game tells it was a complete failure, guess he never learned the old wisdom if it ain't broke, don't fix it. Coutinho out to the left and Jordan in the center have worked out more than well for us since Cou arrived, so why on earth change that?! and in such a important game as this one.

Can't really blame budget as you do tho, when we evident had more than plenty of money and time to fix it. But we seem to have a poor record of either casting the wrong players or plain use them wrong.
I blame the budget that we are supposed to be having this summer in relation to the number of positions that need reinforcing; it simply is nowhere near enough. We should be adding quality to the squad. Let's say that the cost of one quality player these days (for the sake of argument) is around £25m. That would wipe out all the budget in one go! You see my point?

Past f*ck ups in the transfer market, sadly too many to mention, should not detract from the fact that FSG haven't invested, and seemingly don't intend to invest, enough cash for us to sign the quality players that would go a long way to making us competitive again, as opposed to merely making up the numbers. They administer band aids when major surgery is required.

They shouldn't be able to hide behind FFP either because citeh, the chavs and the manure will no doubt be driving container lorries through it. The owners of those clubs have the will and the desire to make their teams trophy winners on a regular basis by the only method which almost certainly guarantees success - consistent heavy investment. £25m a season just isn't going to do it.

It is possible to have a realistic charge at the top four on a limited budget of course, but lots of chips have to fall into place for that to happen; a tactically astute manager has to be on board, a great scouting system, and exactly the right players (who are motivated up to the nth degree) for the tactics that you use, for example.

This should be in the owners thread. Apologies.
 

Walker9009

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TheSweetSilverSong said:
Yes, of course it's mathematically possible but quite a blinder bet.. Anyway, point was that what you say is what I thought before the game, so I said I expected a lot of goals in the pre-match thread, as both teams would be motivated to win, but that in the end Everton came to draw and their game approach shows they are happy to count on beating at least west ham and/or us drawing one of two games.
Everton didn't play to draw.

I've seen Moyes teams play to draw before and yesterday wasn't one of them.

Teams don't have to go all out attack to try to win and along with that it wasn't our day. Mirallas, Fellaini and Pienaar didn't turn up like they can at all.
 

schmee

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Walker9009 said:




Both accidental? At least one if not both are a yellow, plus there were plenty of other niggly fouls throughout from him.

Like I said though, the point is moot because nothing happened.
Coming from a team full of dirty bastards you've some cheek to point out any "missed" fouls/cards against your team.

We should have won 3-2 at yours just as your goal should have stood and you should have won 1-0 yesterday.
 

TheSweetSilverSong

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Walker9009 said:
Everton didn't play to draw.

I've seen Moyes teams play to draw before and yesterday wasn't one of them.

Teams don't have to go all out attack to try to win and along with that it wasn't our day. Mirallas, Fellaini and Pienaar didn't turn up like they can at all.
If you say so...

For the record, it wasn't our day either..
 

ChicagoRed

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EdWood said:
Wasn't Hendo played out of position again? Like Sturridge, he's normally a totally different proposition when played centrally; putting him out wide does him no favours whatsoever.

This is not a new situation at LFC. Kuyt (he was a striker if anyone can remember that far back) was played out wide because Rafa had no right winger worthy of the name at the club and we rarely saw the best of him again. Lucas, then a CM, was shoe-horned in as a DM despite not having played there before, because Rafa had no proper DM available (to accompany Mascharano) when Xabi left. When Lucas was injured both Kenny and BR tried several different CMs out of position (all performed poorly) because they had no specialist DMs capable of playing first team football. Also Johnno has had to play at LB whenever Enrique's been out because of a lack of cover there. Now that Coutinho has gone central, this leaves us short out wide again, hence Hendo being shunted outside.

The pattern is there for all to see. Our on going problem for about five years now has been a lack of decent cover for any given position. We shouldn't blame individuals who are being asked to do a job that they're not familiar with and performing poorly as a result.

The problems are twofold: This current LFC squad is short in numbers and has insufficient depth in terms of quality. A paltry rumoured £25m transfer budget is frankly taking the p*ss in addressing those fundamental problems.

I absolutely agree with you about Downing though.
We all know that if Sterling were fit and not burned out he would be playing on the left with Couthinho as 10 and Sturridge up top with Suarez gone. That would make Henderson be where he belongs, which is the bench. Furthermore, if Allen were fit as well that would make him lucky to ever get off it. However, those players aren't so I don't give a player playing out position card blanche to look like a championship player while playing with a red shirt on. And especially not when said player makes more wages and costed more to bring in than the likes of Coutinho and alot of others.
 



Walker9009

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TheSweetSilverSong said:
If you say so...

For the record, it wasn't our day either..
I know like, neither team played well and a draw was the right result. But had to point out we weren't playing for a draw yesterday and our fans weren't happy with it either.
 
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Walker9009 said:
Both accidental? At least one if not both are a yellow, plus there were plenty of other niggly fouls throughout from him.

Like I said though, the point is moot because nothing happened.
One of them certainly could have been given as a yellow card but so could the elbows by Felliani on our players. On the whole though I think the decisions evened themselves out over the 2 games.