Post Match: Everton 0-0 Liverpool (EPL 3/3/19 4.15pm)

Man of the match

  • Alisson

    Votes: 9 6.6%
  • Alexander-Arnold

    Votes: 1 0.7%
  • Matip

    Votes: 4 2.9%
  • Van Dijk

    Votes: 113 82.5%
  • Robertson

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Fabinho

    Votes: 5 3.6%
  • Henderson

    Votes: 3 2.2%
  • Wijnaldum [off 63’]

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Salah

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Mane [off 84’]

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Origi [off 63’]

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Milner [on 63’]

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Firmino [on 63’]

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Lallana [on 84’]

    Votes: 2 1.5%

  • Total voters
    137
  • Poll closed .

jredp

Let's talk about 6 baby!
Joined
Aug 2, 2017
Messages
248
disappointed is putting it mildly, but we are LFC, and we look up and get going again.
the lads need us to keep supporting them at times like this.
supporters need to show why we were termed as the 12th man
9 games to play, YNWA
 

Red Eyes

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 5, 2018
Messages
241
Exactly , confuses me on why people use Henderson as a scrapegoat for the teams mishaps? Like what actually has the man done wrong for people literally hate him , our captain?
.
He shouldn’t be a scapegoat.

Players are bought, picked and set-up by Klopp, so if they are working to instruction it’s a collective success or failure.

My main gripe with Hendo is his inability to score for the last 60 odd matches. However that’s not isolated to him either, Fabinho only has one in the prem this season, Wini 2. It’s a midfield thing.

Shaq has six the PL this season, only three less than Bobby despite less pitch time. So I’m suprised that when we needed a goal, Shaq didn’t come on as he has always had an ability to contour one up.

Personally (and I embrace the flack that will come my way), I’m a bit pee’d off with Klopp after the last two matches which is very unusual.

Blaming the weather again was a little cheap, and was only marginally less annoying than blaming the grass.

Substitutions in the last two matches have left me scratching my head.

To say ‘well who wants to be top in early March anyway’ sounded childish to me. Given we were seven points ahead of second place a number of weeks ago, I’d like to be still top in early March.

I agree with an earlier post which said Watford was the odd game out recently. We’ve only won four of our last nine PL matches, and two of those were one goal victories against Palace and Brighton. Yes it may be just a blip, yes we have had injuries, yes we are still second and in contention. However we are running out of time to get our momentum back for the run in. At some point soon we need to reap the rewards from warm weather, because at the moment they have had a net negative effect on health and momentum.
 

0livetree

New Member
Joined
Oct 3, 2018
Messages
3
This right here covers my thoughts perfectly!

Hope's post aside, having read quite a few posts on an idea that seems a bit too contageous...I have a few thoughts on the myth of the mathematically accurate (gotta love contradictions) "It's in our hands"... it really is something worth a discussion.
Ok, so here's my opinion on it: While mathematically accurate, I do believe it's irrelevant at this stage of the season. It becomes more and more relevant with fewer games to go, for sure, but with 9 games to go and 27 points to play for, it's really naive to expect both/either of the teams to win their remaining 9 games.

Our best run this season was 9 wins in a row. Plus the 6 that we've had in the beginning of the season as our second best run of wins. And this 9 win run is the blueprint we need to draw from, to replicate it. With key players returning, and with the defence being solid, we need to find the way to the net. We have a good foundation, just a couple of tweaks and performance peaks from individual players could make a huge difference.

City's best run of wins this season was 7 games. 7! They had two more runs of 4, and currently already riding on a 5 wins run. Anything else was 2 wins or a single win. The best thing they mustered all season was 7 wins in a row, so would have to match their best form of this season to even win their next two games. (Hell, even if they beat that, how far would they keep winning for? 9? 10? That would be 4 or 5 more games). They'll almost certainly lose points sooner or later.

They'd have to get close to their impressive 18 win run from last season to win all their remaining games (that would mean getting 14 wins in a row), and firstly, they're not in that kind of a season this time as it seems (based among other things on games lost compared to last season), and secondly, even last season, that run was early on, and not at the stage where there are teams in the bottom of the table fighting for their lives, where we well know that points are harder to earn against inferior opponents.

But, it makes more sense to base things on this season (otherwise, why aren't we leaking goals like last season?), so they need to get their best run yet to win their next 3 games, and that with 4 key players missing.
Then they'll need to extend that and reach levels they haven't reached this season yet. We need to reach a level we already have this season.
Not saying they necessarily won't, and not saying we necessarily will, just putting things in perspective here.

Both teams will most probably drop more points from the 27 left. I'd rephrase it in "we'll have to better City's results by 2 points" instead of "it's (not) in our hands". I understand it's "correct", but it's based on assuming we're waiting for City to drop points. We're waiting for no one to do anything. We just look at our own games, try to win every game, and see where it gets us. Let's not get affected by the order of fixtures that much. Pick any two games we'd win from our upcoming fixtures - had they been first and Everton draw next, we'd be happy we're still top, where in reality it wouldn't have mattered, we'd still fare 7 points out of 9. (The only way it would have mattered is psychologically for the players, but that's normal - Champions should be able to react falling from, as much as retain their position)




A fact indeed, but irrelevant as well in my opinion. As per above.



Let's just beat Burnley now. See where it gets us. Then let's just beat the next game. No need to worry too much about what City does.



I can see the DVD Title: "The glorious day in Everton history, when we held Liverpool to a score-less draw at Goodison and pulled them off the top of the table with 27 points to play!"



This was the table in mid December, right before City lost to Chelsea 2-0 and we started taking over.

1​
Manchester City
15​
13​
2​
0​
45:7​
38​
41​
2​
Liverpool FC
15​
12​
3​
0​
30:6​
24​
39​
3​
Tottenham Hotspur
15​
11​
0​
4​
28:16​
12​
33​
4​
Chelsea FC
15​
9​
4​
2​
31:13​
18​
31​

They lost that game, and got themselves in a similar situation we got ourselves into now. (We only drew, while they lost then, but they were 2 points clear, hence the "similar" situation.) I don't remember them "bottling it" back then, only remember hearing whether we could handle being top. They kept fighting and got now 5 wins in a row.
That we "Should have had 7 points advantage" is too hypothetical. By the same logic, City should have kept on tight without losing 3 out of 4 games in their next few fixtures after Christmas. Having "our fate in our hands to win the title" may have been mathematically correct, but is really a myth to believe at that stage of the season, as demonstrated above. Nothing to do with waiting for others to drop points either. Just keep approaching every game to win it, and see where it takes us. Having retained top of the table from December onwards would be irrelevant.




Aren't they now? They'll get a run of 14 wins? When have they done that this season? Even last season (in which they were way better than this season), they haven't done this at this stage of the League, only earlier on. If they pull such a thing off, then credit to them. But it's quite unlikely, don't you think? Let's win the next few games, each game at a time, get a good winning run, see where we are with 5 or 4 games to go. Surely we can still compete, can't we? with 27 points to play for?



Believe man! - we can keep fighting. We're in a fantastic position. There's 27 points to play for. 1 point difference is not winning the league at this point - neither for them, or for us. We're pretty much running from scratch right now, us and City. Just have to do better than City. We've already achieved that before in this extraordinary season. Just have to tap on all strengths possible and go finish strong!



Let's. Why are we bottling it, and it's not the same for City when they lost those games back to back? Why if City draws next game and we win, we won't hear that City is bottling it? Why is it different for us?
Why are we not still in it right now as much as City was in it a game ago? Why do we think that with 30 points to play it was really "in our hands", and that now with 27 points to play "it's in their hands?". When did this season have any of these two teams get 27 points out of 27? Or 30 out of 30? Really interested in what's the rationale behind the "bottling it" idea.

Perfectly said! YNWA
 

Red Eyes

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 5, 2018
Messages
241
Depressing reading this thread, but not surprising.
The usual vultures are out, smugly peddling their "I told you so" shit.
.
and on the flip side there are the usual ostrich’s with their head in the sand pretending they are happy when they aren’t.

There is nothing wrong with posting positive or negative comments on here, it is a forum. Most people do both at times, I include myself in that category.

There seems to be a type who think they are better or more loyal fans if they only praise the shirt.......or to put it another way, “smugly peddle their ‘Ive got rose tinted glasses on’ shit”

If you don’t like it, why don’t you start a thread titled “Liverpool wank fest, positive comments only”
 

Dane

NEXT!
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
6,511
.
and on the flip side there are the usual ostrich’s with their head in the sand pretending they are happy when they aren’t.

There is nothing wrong with posting positive or negative comments on here, it is a forum. Most people do both at times, I include myself in that category.

There seems to be a type who think they are better or more loyal fans if they only praise the shirt.......or to put it another way, “smugly peddle their ‘Ive got rose tinted glasses on’ shit”

If you don’t like it, why don’t you start a thread titled “Liverpool wank fest, positive comments only”
Where did I say I was happy, or better & more loyal?

If you haven't seen what I was talking about, then it must be your head that's in the sand.
 
Joined
Nov 4, 2012
Messages
74
Klopp knows what he is doing. He was trying to get at least a point, he didnt want to gamble subbing Shakira or Keita on, and taking the Risk of losing the Game.

He must think that City will drop points when pressure mounts on them, as they will try to win the EPL and the CL.

That, IMO, is the only way we get the title now, City being unable to win in all fronts and being forced to focus in the CL. If they are eliminated before semis, it's over for us.
 

LFC4EVR

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 26, 2006
Messages
291
I think it's unfortunate Salah is on for 50 and be all time leader above Shearer and co. Had that not been a milestone he's desperately trying to achieve he'd be way more focused and on form, until that occurs his head is gone.
 

Dane

NEXT!
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
6,511
Watching the post match comments from Souness and Moyes.

Souness nailed it for me, saying something like, Liverpools midfield is a dream for their defence, but a nightmare for their attack.
We do lack someone who can produce a moment of brilliance in tight games to create something for the strikers.

As for Moyes, I can see why he's unemployed.
 

Dane

NEXT!
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
6,511
Win our next 3 games and we go into April with City playing catch up again.
They will have a game in hand, but it's at Old Trafford.
Better to have points in the bag than games in hand in my book.
 

Chung

TIA Moderator
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Messages
2,811
There's not a lot to be said which hasn't already been about last night, other than I'm glad it's a public holiday here and I didn't have to go into work knackered list to tosser supporters of other teams in the office.

The lack of creativity in midfield has been obvious for a long time now, yet we're still relying on the front 3 to pull something out of the hat. The starting midfield 3 were set up for us not to lose, not set up for us to win. I'm sure someone will correct me on this, but barely double figures of assists or goals from Gini, Fabinho and H (I can't even type his name, too early!). So from one of my earlier posts, looks like we are waiting for the Ox to come back and provide us with that little bit extra in the middle.
Happy to see Gini and Fabinho as starters next season but we'll need someone of quality to replace our carthorse.

I know it was late and I could have been seeing things, but the camera was on Klopp in injury time whilst he was bellowing at our captain to get people going, camera pans to said carthorse and low and behold he was doing as he was told. Really??!! You NEED to be told to do something like that, in your position?
In stark contrast to that, watch the numerous occasions as our defender does that throughout the match, communicating, cajoling, bollocking..... I'm just lost for words, but you really do have to question a person, no matter who it is, that needs someone else to instruct them to do something that's basically in their job description!

Yes, lots of permutations yet, but this reminds me of 2008/09 when lots of silly draws against lower teams cost us.

Call me a doom mongerer but we're no longer in control of our own destiny and I've wasted an air fare to go over and walk round the museum again. On the plus side, my connection is from Schiphol :-)
 

TheSweetSilverSong

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2013
Messages
915
Thanks for putting this together. Do you do match previews by any chance?
Match Previews? Well I never done a pre-match thread if that's what you mean, and we'd need someone with a good record, just for forum chi if nothing else.

The faith on City dropping points? Because that's the only way we could win the title now and it's now down to luck.
Eddie, I really value your posts a lot. And I know you're uncomfortable with the status of chasing instead of leading the race. The "in our hands" or not kind of guy. But really do you think that City not doing 14 wins in a row will be luck? If so, why haven't they done it this season yet? Or the similar period of last season?
I think that statistically, they're bound to drop some points. And so are we. The question is, do we have it in us to drop 2 less than them? As someone else put it, can we muster another winning run, like one of the two we've had this season? (one was 9 games, the other 6, either of the two would be really solid).
Can we do it? I think that defensively we have a very good foundation, allowing us to win if we score once in a lot of games. If we can find the way to break defences like earlier in the season, why not? It's not based on anything that we haven't done yet, so it's certainly possible. The only issue is whether we'll be able to replicate it. Players are returning, and other players key to boosting our attack are finding form (if only they'll be used). We need one player in midfield that can make the difference, be it a returning Ox, an up-in-form Keita (was really expecting Klopp to use him after those 2-3 games where he was better every game, then got ill, and no idea about last night), or another good spell by Shaq? And we'll definitely need the front 3 to find their best. And finish better. Let's just hope we'll be able to turn it around. It's still, though not solely (never was if you ask me) to a large degree up to us. But it won't be if we don't start a winning run.
 

Walshy07

In Klopp we trust
Joined
Jun 11, 2018
Messages
1,288
I didn’t get the subs at all .
We needed something different which is why I was surprised Shaq didn’t come on.
Isn’t that what he has been bought for ? For games when we need something different? Lallana has done nothing for 3 years so that was a real odd one.
Milner and Bobby came on and just picked up where Origi and Gini left off.
But it’s our reliance on the front 3 that could cost us.
6 goals from midfield all season is an awful return.
 

Elessar

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Aug 22, 2016
Messages
3,332
I don't expect Henderson to be a new Gerrard but if we want to win the PL/CL then that is more or less what the player in his position must be.

100% the times we won the league/CL/EC we had one of the best central midfielder in the world. Henderson is a very good player but that isn't enough. Milner is a very good player but that isn't enough. We need better players than them.

If you look at our 08/09 central midfield then the strongest one we have today isn't even close to be as good as them, not even close. If we want to win the PL not only one season then we need a central midfield as good as the 08/09 one.

We need a new Xabi and a new Gerrard. Our goal must be to have the best keeper, the best defense, the best midfield and best attack in the world.

Right now we have a world class keeper, a world class defense, a very good central midfield and a world class attack. Three out of four isn't enough. It must be four out of four.
 
Joined
Nov 4, 2012
Messages
74
Regarding Klopp substitutions, well, they weren't what most of us were expecting, but what happens if Keita loses the ball while trying to drible some evertonian and they score in the counter?? Or if Shaquiri doesn't track his runner and we receive a goal at consequence?? Klopp was watching at the bigger picture there, he took a gamble by not taking a gamble...
 

Dane

NEXT!
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
6,511
We've scored more goals from set pieces than anyone else in the league.
Yet someone earlier on in the thread claimed we are shit at scoring from set pieces.

I get that people are frustrated after a result like yesterday, but FFS dont spout utter shite just because you're upset.
 

hugo the horrible

Ridiculously optimistic.(even more so now)
Joined
Oct 24, 2010
Messages
3,576
It certainly seems that Lallana comingon means the ideas cupboard is bare,which brings me to what has been puzzling me for a while, has Shaqiri run over the Klopp Kat?
They did apparently have a moment or two a while ago,but we certainly have larger fish to fry than that.
At this rate Shaqiri.will be transfer listed come the summer and given he started so well it would be a shame.
Anyway, 9 must wins while someone needs to stop Citeh.
 

Red Eyes

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Joined
Nov 5, 2018
Messages
241
Regarding Klopp substitutions, well, they weren't what most of us were expecting, but what happens if Keita loses the ball while trying to drible some evertonian and they score in the counter?? Or if Shaquiri doesn't track his runner and we receive a goal at consequence?? Klopp was watching at the bigger picture there, he took a gamble by not taking a gamble...

.
I get your logic re: Shaq, but it begs the question why he was bought in the first place.

He’s not a regular starter, which is fine as our first 11 is a step up from where he had been previously.

I (rightly or wrongly) assumed that he would be useful as an impact player, a maverick to change a game or do something special. When he comes on in that situation, perhaps a re-jig is needed on the pitch i.e. someone comes deeper so that he doesn’t have to track a runner.
 

Monument Mark

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Jan 1, 2019
Messages
47
The worst thing is we've lost control in the title race. Even at one point more than City we had control. But we've lost it and there's nothing we can do about that.
People may look to City dropping points (e.g. the Manchester derby) but quite frankly they should be looking at our team and our inability to score. We're much more likely to drop points than City.
We're likely to finish 2nd which is a two place improvement on last season. We're still progressing but, like after the Champions League final, I hope Jurgen will get angry and secure some new signings. We need a world class striker because this season has shown that our front three, however good they can be, are not consistent enough and need support. Virgil has made a huge impact at the back and we now need someone to come in to do the same upfront.
We still have players e.g. Moreno and Lallana who are not going to help us win the league and we need to get rid of those types of players so that every day the club's standards get higher and higher.
 

Elessar

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Joined
Aug 22, 2016
Messages
3,332
.
I get your logic re: Shaq, but it begs the question why he was bought in the first place.

He’s not a regular starter, which is fine as our first 11 is a step up from where he had been previously.

I (rightly or wrongly) assumed that he would be useful as an impact player, a maverick to change a game or do something special. When he comes on in that situation, perhaps a re-jig is needed on the pitch i.e. someone comes deeper so that he doesn’t have to track a runner.
IMO we signed Shaq because Klopp didn't get his main target in that position, Pulisic. AOC is clearly the player Klopp will use in that position when he is fit again and that means that the player we signed must be prepared to be the backup player to AOC. So no very expensive signing in that position.
 



Hope in your heart

Loyalty and patience, two undervalued concepts...
Admin
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Messages
22,386
also which games were we BRILLIANT in may I ask,certainly not today,or Leicester,or West ham,or man u,palace game was all over the place,0-1 away to Brighton maybe hmmm?actually we been pretty poor all this year,lets hope we turn it around.
errr... Watford at home, just five days ago? :eh?:
 

santana

Active Member
Joined
Nov 4, 2018
Messages
142
take it easy all
the match was an interesting game i love it and everton is fast strong team and you beat them at home in 96 min by .. luck !
yes i was hope to see another formation 4231 and selection but sometimes you lose games like mancity so it is not the end of the world !
be happy and brave and we will win for sure .
 

Irishanfield

Internet Terrorist
Joined
May 5, 2017
Messages
4,635
Match Previews? Well I never done a pre-match thread if that's what you mean, and we'd need someone with a good record, just for forum chi if nothing else.


Eddie, I really value your posts a lot. And I know you're uncomfortable with the status of chasing instead of leading the race. The "in our hands" or not kind of guy. But really do you think that City not doing 14 wins in a row will be luck? If so, why haven't they done it this season yet? Or the similar period of last season?
I think that statistically, they're bound to drop some points. And so are we. The question is, do we have it in us to drop 2 less than them? As someone else put it, can we muster another winning run, like one of the two we've had this season? (one was 9 games, the other 6, either of the two would be really solid).
Can we do it? I think that defensively we have a very good foundation, allowing us to win if we score once in a lot of games. If we can find the way to break defences like earlier in the season, why not? It's not based on anything that we haven't done yet, so it's certainly possible. The only issue is whether we'll be able to replicate it. Players are returning, and other players key to boosting our attack are finding form (if only they'll be used). We need one player in midfield that can make the difference, be it a returning Ox, an up-in-form Keita (was really expecting Klopp to use him after those 2-3 games where he was better every game, then got ill, and no idea about last night), or another good spell by Shaq? And we'll definitely need the front 3 to find their best. And finish better. Let's just hope we'll be able to turn it around. It's still, though not solely (never was if you ask me) to a large degree up to us. But it won't be if we don't start a winning run.
So we're capable of going on a winning run but City will slip up? On current form we are the more likely to slip up again.
Indeed all is not lost but we really have shot ourselves in the foot with how poor we have been attack wise. Not feeling very confident going into the munich game now either