Post Match: Huddersfield v Liverpool (EPL 20/10/2018 5.30pm)

Man of the Match

  • Alisson

    Votes: 4 3.1%
  • Gomez

    Votes: 46 35.9%
  • Lovren

    Votes: 3 2.3%
  • Van Dijk

    Votes: 15 11.7%
  • Robertson

    Votes: 6 4.7%
  • Milner [off 77’]

    Votes: 1 0.8%
  • Henderson [off 46’]

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Lallana [off 70’]

    Votes: 2 1.6%
  • Shaqiri

    Votes: 30 23.4%
  • Salah [GOAL 23’]

    Votes: 13 10.2%
  • Sturridge

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Wijnaldum [on 46’]

    Votes: 8 6.3%
  • Fabinho [on 70’]

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Milner [on 77’]

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    128

MarcusBerglund

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 12, 2014
Messages
1,392
Likes
2,104
Positives:

Winning is the most important thing for Liverpool at the moment. We are playing at 60% for most of the season and still are level on points with City.

Another positive is the defensive work of the whole team. Somehow we manage to keep clean sheets and looking solid defensively. Something we dreamt for a very long time.

Yesterday we started without - Mane, Gini, Firmino, lost our captain after 45 minutes and our creative midfielders /AOC and Keita/ are injured. And still we won, playing with Milner an Lallana /both of them lacking proper match fitness after injuries/. Salah also just recoverd from injury and probably still not 100% fit.

Chelsea and Manure lost 2 points, while we gained two points on them.

Fabinho's debut - he looked fine, he needs to work more on his passing /his wrong pass lead to Hudderssield's most dangerous attack in the 91st minute when Diakhaby was alone in our penalty area and only VvD's block saved us from conceding/, but I liked his positoning and he looks like a player who has room for more physical improvement.

Klopp knows that we are not playing at our normal level and looking at his face during the game and reading his words in all these interviews, he will try his best to fix things.

The good shape of Sturridge and Shaqiri. Xherdan ran more than 10 km. and Danny looked fresh and running till the final minutes. Long time since Daniel lasted 90 minutes on the pitch and he really looks fit. Lallana and Milner added almost 70 miuntes in their belt and these minutes will be precious for their playing rhythm

Negatives:

In my opinion one of the big negatives is the lack of quality in our passing and decision making at the moment. And these are individual mistakes. Yestarday I saw in 2-3 situations that Firmino preferred passing the ball to Salah instead to Shaqiri inspite of the fact the Swiss international was in a much better position. Several minutes later Shaq chose not to pass to Bobby and our brazilian forward was in a better position.
Too many times our players chose the wrong option, too many times their pass was too short or rather long. I don't know the reason - pressure, lack of confidence or being careless, or lack of concentration, but we saw the same thing tooo m,any times during the last 3-4 weeks.

Injuries are another problem - Milner and Lallana came back after nasty injuries. Hendo was substituted after only 45 minutes because he felt some tightness in his hamstring. Mane and Keita are injured too.

Lack of replacement in midfield. For the last 10 months we lost Emre, Coutinho and AOC / for 15 months/. Emre added 8 goals and more than 15 assists in his last 2 seasons with us Coutinho and AOC were even more important offensively. We signed only two players in Keita and Fabinho and failed to add more offensive power /Fekir's transfer was a bitter blow for Klopp/. And looks like both Naby and the brazilian are still finding their feet in England.

After 9 PL matches our midfielders have contributed with only two goals /a penalty fopr Milneer and one goal for Gini/.

Last season after a great start Mane had a very difficult spell for 3-4 months, but at that time both Booby and Mo were fantastic. This season Firmino started fine, but after tha eye injury his form also dipped. Salah is also struggling and Mane is also struggling after a brilliant start of the campaign.

In my opinion we did not improve the starting eleven enough for my liking. Only one of the new players is undisputed starter - Alisson. We are playing with last seasons team without AOC.
 

Maria

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2006
Messages
12,798
Likes
19,200
I forgot to add, I have given my MOTM to Shaquiri because I thought he was our most dangerous player on the pitch and he gave a great assist to Salah and he was so calm under pressure, his passing was precise and neat and his first touches were controlled and seemed quicker than Salah and had an all round excellent performance. I seriously think that he is not there to sit on the bench, he wants to be a regular starter and he is going to get better and better. I believe he deserves far more credit than he is given.
 
Last edited:

Redsi73

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 26, 2015
Messages
2,580
Likes
3,259
Are we are missing AoC in that midfield? his forward drive and link up play with the front three probably went a little bit unnoticed.

I'm happy for us to grind out wins like that, suppose we have been spoilt somewhat by some of the displays last season, they are still there, just might take a little bit of luck to eek them out this season.

Think Hendo & Milner need some rest time on the bench for a few games, would very much like to see a midfield of Gini, Kieta and Fabinho once fit.
 

FGred

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 10, 2015
Messages
2,577
Likes
4,503
They also kicked our players with impunity and ended the match without a single yellow card.

The only two yellow cards were shown for not being able to pull out of a collision with an opposition player (Lallana) and shooting at goal after the referee’s whistle (Sturridge) - something that players regularly do and go unpunished. Even the commentary team for the stream that I watched thought that those cards were extremely harsh in view of the lack of cards for Huddersfield.

If Huddersfield can’t get something out of a match in those circumstances, playing at home ......... then quite frankly they don’t deserve to!
Totally agree about the refereeing they kicked Lallana repeatedly and Sturridge but Gomez was penalized with a free kick for taking the ball of them, now you contrast that with the shitty game where their CH should have got sent off early on and Sane also should have seen red for kicking a burnley player deliberately, they seem to be lenient towards them lately very strange.
 

Red Ted

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2018
Messages
421
Likes
617
Virgil slightly off form? When we've been keeping clean sheets for fun? You're being ridiculous FilthyBloke.
Yeah, no idea how anyone comes to that conclusion, he was everywhere again yesterday, blocking, intercepting, winning every header, positionally bang on as usual, OK there might be the odd exception here & there (no-one is perfect) but he's not off form, nowhere near it, it would be very noticable if he was.
 

SirBillShankly

Joe and Holly's Dad.
Joined
Jan 8, 2011
Messages
8,648
Likes
7,171
Virgil is just majestic, possibly a bit too confident and casual but he is the real deal. Best all-round defender I've ever seen in a red shirt (since 1981). The only regular defender that stresses me is Lovren. He's a good player in the main but here and there it's as if he's doesn't think straight. His mistake nearly led to Milner giving away a penalty. Virgil is a magnificent centre back, would not swap him for any player on earth and the way Gomez is going he may be as good one day, just needs to become dominant which will come as he matures . Hard to believe he's still a kid. What is he? 21?
 
Last edited:

Danny_

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 15, 2013
Messages
1,434
Likes
707
Virgil is just majestic, possibly a bit too confident and casual but he is the real feal. Best overall defender I've seen in a red shirt ( since 1981). The only regular defender that stresses me is Lovren. He's a good player in the main but here and there it's as if he's doesn't think straight. His mistake nearly led to Milner giving away a penalty. Virgil is a magnificent centre back, would not swap him for any player on earth and the way Gomez is going he may be as good one day, just needs to become dominant which will come as he matures . Hard to believe he's still a kid. What is he? 21?
Agreed. I would prefer not to see Lovren at CB but I trust Klopp and he maybe sees something in TAA performances that worries him. I did as well but I thought he was still our best option at RB. We could try out putting Gomez back into the centre and Fabinho at RB as well. He plays there for Brazil. We don't see the lads in training every day though
 

SirBillShankly

Joe and Holly's Dad.
Joined
Jan 8, 2011
Messages
8,648
Likes
7,171
Agreed. I would prefer not to see Lovren at CB but I trust Klopp and he maybe sees something in TAA performances that worries him. I did as well but I thought he was still our best option at RB. We could try out putting Gomez back into the centre and Fabinho at RB as well. He plays there for Brazil. We don't see the lads in training every day though

I don't mind Lovren, I just feel more relaxed when Joe plays alongside the big man.Fabinho at RB? I don't think we'll be seeing that.Hes been brought for the midfield, I don't see him playing RB for us any time soon. I would prefer Gomez, Trent or Clyney there. Clyney seems to be out of favour though doesn't he? I would have preferred him in the team and Gomez continuing in the centre. However, Jurgen sees him in training so we have to trust the boss.
 

ILLOK

In the Danger Zone.
Joined
Feb 10, 2009
Messages
14,730
Likes
25,645
I don't mind Lovren, I just feel more relaxed when Joe plays alongside the big man.Fabinho at RB? I don't think we'll be seeing that.Hes been brought for the midfield, I don't see him playing RB for us any time soon. I would prefer Gomez, Trent or Clyney there. Clyney seems to be out of favour though doesn't he? I would have preferred him in the team and Gomez continuing in the centre. However, Jurgen sees him in training so we have to trust the boss.
Clyne isn't good enough, the drop off between him and Gomez is massive. Playing Clyne against a side who would predominantly resort to long balls would have been poor management.
 

SirBillShankly

Joe and Holly's Dad.
Joined
Jan 8, 2011
Messages
8,648
Likes
7,171
Clyne isn't good enough, the drop off between him and Gomez is massive. Playing Clyne against a side who would predominantly resort to long balls would have been poor management.
Gomez is the better player nowadays but I'm not convinced the drop off is massive but Clyney is still a great defender imo.
 

big noyd

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 20, 2016
Messages
1,342
Likes
1,665
lovren is always going to have a dicey moment or two, you just hope to get by with them. overall he's been pretty good, imo, but i do prefer gomez next to VVD. trent's been a bit out of form (again, imo) so i hope this is mostly about trying to get his head right

team sheet for the last two does suggest that clyne is in the same boat as moreno at this point. would be nice if that extremely both-footed colombian kid we signed developed into someone who could capably provide width at either fullback
 

SirBillShankly

Joe and Holly's Dad.
Joined
Jan 8, 2011
Messages
8,648
Likes
7,171
What would you prefer?

Clyney........Gomez......Virgil...... Robertson

Or...

Gomez......Lovren.........Virgil........ Robertson


I would go with keeping Gomez in the centre and Clyney at RB. (Let's leave Trent out of this for argument's sake)
 

Limiescouse

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 26, 2014
Messages
11,733
Likes
15,586
Klopp is preaching ugly footy right now. As I said before we must show patience and let the season unfold.
I think as a group there is a reluctance to acknowledge that we are very clearly playing a different brand of football this season than the one we have become accustomed to. At its most basic level we are not pressing as high up when we dont have the ball and are keeping more players behind the ball when we do, and that completely changes the balance of a game. I am not entirely sure why Klopp is doing this. Maybe he's decided we need to be more judicious in how we expend our energy throughout the season, especially a post-world cup season. It was notable in the first game of the season that after taking a 2-0 lead we basically just sat on it, with the 3rd and 4th coming almost by accident. Maybe it was a proactive response to the more defensive way he assumed teams would try and play against this season. Maybe he's decided it's the path to taking the next step? I don't know, although it is something we have seen from him periodically (most notably the run in of the 16-17 season).

Regardless of the reason, the different approach means the players' performances are going to look different, and it does no one any good to try and judge them on the same standards. Our forwards are finding themselves more isolated and having to beat a greater number of defenders to create chances than they were last season, and so I think the idea that we've just got to wait until it "clicks" is wrong. It is not going to click into place like it did last year unless the handbrake is released.
 

big noyd

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 20, 2016
Messages
1,342
Likes
1,665
Maybe he's decided it's the path to taking the next step?
as someone who was part of the overwhelming consensus that klopp was the ideal hire and has found only more reason to implicitly trust him since he's taken over, this is my interpretation

we've built a strong enough squad now that we're just about nailed on for top 4, now we're after something bigger
 

Limiescouse

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 26, 2014
Messages
11,733
Likes
15,586
That's because it was behind him, he couldn't do anything else. I thought he defended that situation well and it was a big mistake from VVD.




We drew 0-0 with City last week and it was VVD who nearly gifted them a goal. I don't understand this nitpicking with Lovren, he's been playing well for a year now.
It's an example of how so much of the criticism is stuff that is already baked into the cake. VVD misreads the ball and fucks up. Lovren fails to clean up for him, because he had only a fraction of a second to try and readjust, and we then put the missed opportunity in the bucket of Lovren fuck ups. Then to really pile on, we over state the quality of the chance, and describe something that required either luck or incredible technique to pull off as a great chance.
 

Arminius

FSG PR plant
Moderator
Joined
Aug 13, 2008
Messages
20,060
Likes
22,207
What would you prefer?

Clyney........Gomez......Virgil...... Robertson

Or...

Gomez......Lovren.........Virgil........ Robertson


I would go with keeping Gomez in the centre and Clyney at RB. (Let's leave Trent out of this for argument's sake)
Your second option is better defensively against most threats, and Gomez provides far more attacking threat
 

sharkula

New Member
Joined
Oct 5, 2018
Messages
4
Likes
1
I think there are 2 concerns for Liverpool fans now
1. Following last years record breaking goal feast and a very good pre season, the free flowing game and scoring for fun is no where to be seen. For the first few games fans were patiently waiting but now it is becoming obvious that it may not be happening soon
2, seeing man city swashbuckling matches esp yesterday’s 5-0 drubbing of burney adds to our anxieties and perhaps envy. We were able to do the same last year but why not now

I see 2 main issues
1. Last season Salah was scoring goals for fun everytime he got the ball u just felt that he was going to score. This season it’s either he was going to shoot wide or lose the ball. Yesterday’s goal was In a way Lucky as the ball was just inches from going wide. He is either a one season wonder or really off form now
2. We are missing that attacking midfielder who can drive and run at defenders and create an opening for the strikers. Many mentioned ox and Emre and Coutinho, this year there is no midfielder seemingly capable of doing that
 

Danny_

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 15, 2013
Messages
1,434
Likes
707
I don't mind Lovren, I just feel more relaxed when Joe plays alongside the big man.Fabinho at RB? I don't think we'll be seeing that.Hes been brought for the midfield, I don't see him playing RB for us any time soon. I would prefer Gomez, Trent or Clyney there. Clyney seems to be out of favour though doesn't he? I would have preferred him in the team and Gomez continuing in the centre. However, Jurgen sees him in training so we have to trust the boss.
We don't know how good he is anymore. A long term injury like that can be devastating to a player. Remember what it did to Martin Kelly who was supposed to be our RB for the next 10 years when he first broke into the team?
 

SirBillShankly

Joe and Holly's Dad.
Joined
Jan 8, 2011
Messages
8,648
Likes
7,171
We don't know how good he is anymore. A long term injury like that can be devastating to a player. Remember what it did to Martin Kelly who was supposed to be our RB for the next 10 years when he first broke into the team?

Maybe his injury is preventing him from returning to his best? Read quite a bit of stuff about him leaving in January. Leicester heavily linked. His departure is starting to feel inevitable now isn't it?
 

jaffod

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 8, 2015
Messages
1,803
Likes
2,439
I think there are 2 concerns for Liverpool fans now
1. Following last years record breaking goal feast and a very good pre season, the free flowing game and scoring for fun is no where to be seen. For the first few games fans were patiently waiting but now it is becoming obvious that it may not be happening soon
2, seeing man city swashbuckling matches esp yesterday’s 5-0 drubbing of burney adds to our anxieties and perhaps envy. We were able to do the same last year but why not now
Teams aren't over-committing to the same extent, which means our opportunity to hit them on the counter is diminished. It seemed most games last season there'd be 3 or 4 occasions where we had the front 3 and Coutinho/AOC running at 2 or 3 defenders and more often than not it would result in a goal. It's barely happened this season and when it has we've made the wrong choices or played a poor final ball. Yesterday we had a couple of chances to kill Huddersfield off but the final ball was terrible.
Throw in the fact our front 3 seem to be carrying knocks/ off-form/ knackered and there's no real link between midfield and attack and it explains the lack of goals. I think we all thought we'd go into the season with Fabinho holding, Keita box-to-box and the likes of Shakiri, Lallana and Gini looking to supply the bullets, none of which has really happened.
Any comparisons with City are pretty pointless imo, they play with one man up top but they have D Silva, B Silva, Sane, Mahrez, Sterling and De Bruyne to supply the ammunition, they pick any 4 of those 6 each game and it's something no other side in Europe can match.
As others have mentioned the loss of AOC has been overlooked by most people. Hopefully Lallana can get back to something like his old self and maybe give Shakiri more minutes, we had a glimpse of what he can offer yesterday.
 



Irishanfield

Internet Terrorist
Joined
May 5, 2017
Messages
3,617
Likes
6,611
But there were so many times when we were one pass away from creating a clear cut chance and the final ball let us down. That isn't a lack of creativity. It's poor execution. Most of the time, the culprit was Salah but the thing is that he also creates these situations for us with his pace. So, if we leave him out, we don't get into those situations in the first place. A bit of a conundrum for Klopp.
Err ya missing that one pass is lacking creativity
 

Billy Biskix

TIA Youth Team
Joined
Jul 23, 2011
Messages
2,313
Likes
9,257
I think as a group there is a reluctance to acknowledge that we are very clearly playing a different brand of football this season than the one we have become accustomed to. At its most basic level we are not pressing as high up when we dont have the ball and are keeping more players behind the ball when we do, and that completely changes the balance of a game. I am not entirely sure why Klopp is doing this. Maybe he's decided we need to be more judicious in how we expend our energy throughout the season, especially a post-world cup season. It was notable in the first game of the season that after taking a 2-0 lead we basically just sat on it, with the 3rd and 4th coming almost by accident. Maybe it was a proactive response to the more defensive way he assumed teams would try and play against this season. Maybe he's decided it's the path to taking the next step? I don't know, although it is something we have seen from him periodically (most notably the run in of the 16-17 season).

Regardless of the reason, the different approach means the players' performances are going to look different, and it does no one any good to try and judge them on the same standards. Our forwards are finding themselves more isolated and having to beat a greater number of defenders to create chances than they were last season, and so I think the idea that we've just got to wait until it "clicks" is wrong. It is not going to click into place like it did last year unless the handbrake is released.
Generally, we have been pressing far less for some time now with the emphasis being on filling spaces, making us difficult to play through.

I think there are various reasons for it. First, as you say, it's just a more sustainable way to play. We have moved a long way from the Klopp blueprint of 15/16 when he first arrived. Secondly maybe he has wisely assumed that we won't score as many this season. He didn't get all of the players he targeted in the summer, notably Fekir, and it's unreasonable to think Salah is going to have another 40 plus season. We simply have to concede less. Game management seems to be the top priority so far this season. The biggest clue to this was in the Southampton game when he took off Shaqiri at half time when we were 3-0 up.

Personally I think that the movement of Salah, Mane and Firmino is so instinctively good it will 'click' up front at some stage but the way we are set up now gives us a chance of winning even when it doesn't. This has to be progress as far as I'm concerned.