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Post match: LFC 2-3 Udinese

Hope in your heart

Loyalty and patience, two undervalued concepts...
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(...)

My point-- and others'-- stands: it was no coincidence that we conceded after Henderson was brought off.
Have to agree with this point. It was a bad move from BR to take him off. Allen looked way too exposed after Jordan's withdrawal. While they worked very well as a pair, Allen looked a bit lost when Gerrard was introduced. And let's be honest, Gerrard added nothing to our game compared to Henderson, neither going forward, nor defensively. Compare this to Suarez who had an instant impact.
 

Prolix

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Rodgers hits the nail on the head:

"It was very frustrating," he said. "It was a game where we were much the better side but lost our concentration at the beginning of the second half. I thought we'd moved on from that, to be honest.

"We had total control in the first half and were deservedly in the lead, but we were so loose at the beginning of the second half it was frightening.

"Our concentration was very poor and before we knew it we were 3-1 down. The last 20 minutes was very good but it's too late by then.

"I thought we were lazy. Lazy in our play, loose and sloppy.

"We didn't do what I call the dirty bit: we didn't track runners. If you don't do that, if you don't earn the right...

"Whether we thought the game was too comfortable? At this level it never is."

http://www.liverpool...ng-must-improve
 

Hope in your heart

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Good to see BR calling a spade a spade... let's see how the players react to this on Sunday...
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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The midfield was Henderson as the anchor, Allen as the playmaker and Shelvey as the attacker. Allen was being anonymous and Shelvey's influence was fading as second half wore on.

The change came with Henderson for Gerrard. Allen became anchor and Gerrard became playmaker. But Allen took a god ten minutes to settle. And Gerrard ddn't match the defensive responsibilities of the slightly deeper playmaker role.

Shelvey for Gerrard would of been better so Gerrard could of just been captain fantastic attacking their defense.

Either that or straight swap role for role with Allen.
 

mogggg

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He's pretty much identified what we miss without Lucas in the midfield, that doggish, never give up type defending. I for one think that Lucas has the potential to make a big difference when he gets back, just add a little more assuredness to the defensive end of the park that we've been missing a bit.

I didn't see much of the game aside from the highlights, but I can't wait until we manage to get someone who can be as clinical in front of goal as the likes of di Natale. That'll go a long way towards solving our problem of creating chances with nothing to show for it.
 

cardiffpete

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Well, that's the limit of stats. So much for BR saying that a team dominating possession had a big statistic chance to win a game. That might be true, but then again, only if a team can defend properly, which isn't the case so far. We are downright sieves for the time being, conceding sloppy goals all the time.
78% possession and 94% pass accuracy first half too (against 72% and 88% pass accuracy second half) ...and BR simply sounded incredibly frustrated at final whistle in his post-match interview aka "We became lazy" and "We (simply) can't have to (continue to need to) score three, four or five goals to win a game".

Just why (and how) we are conceeding an average of 2 goals a game simply baffles me
 

craigbellamy

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Bollocks!! Just got back from the Lion King and find out we lost.

Brendan out if we lose on Sunday................
 

DeathOrGlory

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Good to see BR calling a spade a spade... let's see how the players react to this on Sunday...
Yep, that's what I'm going to be interested in. The reaction. So often we've seen us get a good result, get a bit unlucky in another, then get all depressed and sooky and mope around for the next few games. I want to see us go out with the positivity that we had at Norwich.


Jesus, was that Downing trying to "fight for his place"? Looked horrid out there. Never in my worst nightmares earlier this year did I think that Carra would be a starter for many games this season. His lack of nearly attribute that makes a good modern day CB, coupled with the constant switching around of a back line is costing us dearly.
 

ChicagoRed

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Yes. One of them scored. The other committed two 'Rodgerian' sins: misplacing a pass in the centre of the park and then failing to track back after losing it.

If we were going to bring Gerrard on to chase the win, then we should have brought him on for, say, Shelvey or Downing. What we should certainly not have done, if he isn't going to discipline his play, is bring him on for the player who was being a defensive rock in midfield.

My point-- and others'-- stands: it was no coincidence that we conceded after Henderson was brought off.
If we're chasing a goal it makes zero sense to replace Gerrard with Shelvey as its like for like and not adding any firepower. We can second guess the sub for Gerrard all day, but have no problem with him coming on even though he was poor in his cameo. Hopefully he plays better against Stoke. Not gonna lose sleep over it tonight.
 

Lidoris

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The one to blame is Brendan Rodgers – the attitude on the second half was not good. He failed when took off Hendo? – And what happened? - The center has gone for 2 minutes. Now BR can start talks about “progress”…
Good game for Robinson, Henderson, Allen, Shelvey, Downing.
All in all – we were crap AGAIN.
I hope soon Borini will hit the target…and maybe next year he will score a goal ???!!!
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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Said for awhile we have 2 issues and this game highlighted it perfectly:

1: Defence: Needlessly sloppy. Its a side effect of implementing a new system everybody is unsure off and not fully settled in yet. It will start getting better as it gets more settled.

2: Attack: Nowhere near clinical enough. As people get better and more settled everybody will contribute more goals but said it before say it again we will not be a prolific team unless we add a couple of clinical players to our attacks. Assaidi, Suso, Downing, Cole, Sterling none of them even at their best will contribute bucket loads of goals. Even if Suarez and Borini have great seasons we will be goal shy as a team.
 

BostonMick

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Out of the 3, Henderson was the least influential and was going to come for Gerrard the moment he began warming up. He kept possession well today, but offers nothing going forward and is half the defensive player of Allen. Concerned with Borini.
Ditto on Borini.
I kick the dog every time I see Downing on the field in a Liverpool shirt.
However, i thought that that chap who dragged him down when Downing clearly had him beat on the right wing in the second half should have been sent off.
 

LFCLV

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If we're chasing a goal it makes zero sense to replace Gerrard with Shelvey as its like for like and not adding any firepower. We can second guess the sub for Gerrard all day, but have no problem with him coming on even though he was poor in his cameo. Hopefully he plays better against Stoke. Not gonna lose sleep over it tonight.
No we do. We bring on fresh player and sub tired player = more firepower. Midfield balance was ruined after the change. No one wanted or was fit enough to track back when needed. Shelvey and Gerrard are not disciplined enough. They both are similar. Should have been Shelvey Gerrard. Not HendoGerrard. Hendo has a trait to run back after he runs forward. Shelvey and Stevie run forward and jog back.
 

No Men in the Box Redux

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Downing and Borini were painfully average. Assaidi tried to create things but found little to no support or movement in front of him.

Our supposed first teamers have less quality than the kids coming up from the reserves.

Defending also quite inadequate to deal with Di Natale's class and Udinese's counterattacks. Allen had his first indifferent game.

Sterling and Suarez are the only reliable forwards that we have that can make things happen. Without them on the field, we are much, much less dangerous.
 

ChicagoRed

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No we do. We bring on fresh player and sub tired player = more firepower. Midfield balance was ruined after the change. No one wanted or was fit enough to track back when needed. Shelvey and Gerrard are not disciplined enough. They both are similar. Should have been Shelvey Gerrard. Not HendoGerrard. Hendo has a trait to run back after he runs forward. Shelvey and Stevie run forward and jog back.
I love how everyone can say for a fact they would not have scored the 3rd3 goal cus Hendo would have tracked back. That may be, but that game was so wide open and end to end with us chasing a goal nobody knows. Coates' own goal changed things
 

LFCLV

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Downing and Borini were painfully average.
Oh please don't. I think they both were fantastic tonight. They created our first goal. Downing with perfect delivery and Fabio with clever movement. They clicked well. Worked their socks off. Fabio would have scored if not the wrong decision from Glen. It is just you searching someone to blame because you feel bad after the loss. It was system that failed.
 

LFCLV

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I love how everyone can say for a fact they would not have scored the 3rd3 goal cus Hendo would have tracked back. That may be, but that game was so wide open and end to end with us chasing a goal nobody knows. Coates' own goal changed things
Yes because game was so open we needed good engine in midfield. Which none of the three could provide. OG changed but 3rd made it too dificult to climb.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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I love how everyone can say for a fact they would not have scored the 3rd3 goal cus Hendo would have tracked back. That may be, but that game was so wide open and end to end with us chasing a goal nobody knows. Coates' own goal changed things
Don't think anybody is saying that, all people are saying is we were a lot more solid before the change than after it. And that loss of solidity was responsible for the build up play that led to their two goals in quick succession straight after the change.
 

LFCLV

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Don't think anybody is saying that, all people are saying is we were a lot more solid before the change than after it. And that loss of solidity was responsible for the build up play that led to their two goals in quick succession straight after the change.
Exactly
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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Oh please don't. I think they both were fantastic tonight. They created our first goal. Downing with perfect delivery and Fabio with clever movement. They clicked well. Worked their socks off. Fabio would have scored if not the wrong decision from Glen. It is just you searching someone to blame because you feel bad after the loss. It was system that failed.
Don't even think it was essentially the system that failed either. We had 70% possession and a ridiculous amount of passes and chances. Think what failed us was football. Its an unpredictable game. With that many chances we should of scored 3 or more easily and with the small number of chances we allowed them they shouldn't of been able to score 3 against us.

However thats football. A friend of mines favourite saying is always right for these circumstances: "Anything can happen when the ball is round!"
 

ChicagoRed

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Don't think anybody is saying that, all people are saying is we were a lot more solid before the change than after it. And that loss of solidity was responsible for the build up play that led to their two goals in quick succession straight after the change.
And we would be alot more solid if we weren't giving up own goals and going a goal down and chasing.
 

Never Say Never

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And we would be alot more solid if we weren't giving up own goals and going a goal down and chasing.
Just because you're chasing the game doesn't mean you can't track your man. It'd be one think if we just poured men forward. It's another thing to watch someone run past you.
 

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Thought we played well for most of the game, excluding the first few minutes of the second half. Once again a freak goal cost us with Coates heading in. I agreed with the choice of subs at the time and don't think hindsight should be used now. Bringing on arguably 2 of our best attacking players and removing a defensive one made sense if we wanted to win but it backfired. Since we had 6 or 7 of our usual first team out and played against a decent side this wasn't too unusual a result, the game itself was though, the fact we dominated so well as a second side is great and pretty soon the results will come.

We are only in October of BRs first season with a small squad so give him time. A lot of people, myself included wanted Kenny to get another season as 18 months wasnt enough to get a team playing the way he wanted. Now people aren't calling for BRs head or anything but they seem to be expecting results already. The fact that we are dominating top teams means we are heading the right way so i for one will keep quiet for now. As a game in itself though this was losable from the start and probably the team we can afford to lose the most. Udinese and us are the 2 most likely to go through anyway and i fully expect to beat YB away and at least one other game which will probably put us through.

No bad performers as such today, just bad mistakes, Coates for instance played well except for 1 mistake, Downing played one of his better games for us but still not great. We won't be able to judge this result for a few months and wont be able to judge the team for at least that long.
 

ChicagoRed

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Just because you're chasing the game doesn't mean you can't track your man. It'd be one think if we just poured men forward. It's another thing to watch someone run past you.
If we weren't a goal down I would be shocked if they scored that third the way they did.
 

DEVGRU

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This was always going to be a tough season..a lot of patience needed with this team.

We played well and probably didn't deserve to lose (again) but sometimes, 'that's the way the cookie crumbles.'
 



Anfield rd Dreamer

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And we would be alot more solid if we weren't giving up own goals and going a goal down and chasing.
It's not like Coates got the ball in their half ran back the length of the pitch an slid it past Pepe we were under pressure and it was defending the set piece and he couldn't see the ball through the head of the Udi player in front of him. Goals don't come from nowhere goals come from build up play which can be held up or stopped by a decent holding player in the middle which we were doing fine with except for 1 minute after the restart. Henderson was doing 75% of that job with Allen covering the other 25%. We moved Allen in there who took awhile to take 25% up to 75% and Gerrard just didn't pick up the 25% Allen had been doing at all.
 

Never Say Never

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If we weren't a goal down I would be shocked if they scored that third the way they did.
Again, regardless, that doesn't mean you can't move your legs and follow someone. I don't care if he rugby tackles him like the Udinese defender did to downing, just do something to show a bit of effort.

Tbh, after his brilliant goal, I thought Shelvey added nothing in the second half and was completely anonymous.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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Thought we played well for most of the game, excluding the first few minutes of the second half. Once again a freak goal cost us with Coates heading in. I agreed with the choice of subs at the time and don't think hindsight should be used now. Bringing on arguably 2 of our best attacking players and removing a defensive one made sense if we wanted to win but it backfired. Since we had 6 or 7 of our usual first team out and played against a decent side this wasn't too unusual a result, the game itself was though, the fact we dominated so well as a second side is great and pretty soon the results will come.

We are only in October of BRs first season with a small squad so give him time. A lot of people, myself included wanted Kenny to get another season as 18 months wasnt enough to get a team playing the way he wanted. Now people aren't calling for BRs head or anything but they seem to be expecting results already. The fact that we are dominating top teams means we are heading the right way so i for one will keep quiet for now. As a game in itself though this was losable from the start and probably the team we can afford to lose the most. Udinese and us are the 2 most likely to go through anyway and i fully expect to beat YB away and at least one other game which will probably put us through.

No bad performers as such today, just bad mistakes, Coates for instance played well except for 1 mistake, Downing played one of his better games for us but still not great. We won't be able to judge this result for a few months and wont be able to judge the team for at least that long.
Agree with everything you say including the bolded bit I'm not making the Hendo for Gerrard argument based on hindsight I was saying minutes before on chat that Allen was being anonymous and had pointed out what a good game Henderson was having. Sub choice baffled me and the resulting goals didn't surprise me at all.
 

Colin

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Wouldn't get too panicy about the result. Udinese are a good team and we actually out played them with a purposely understrength side.

I think our defence needs to tighten up, yes, but overall there's a very clear direction and im happy. If losing games like this is part of the process then i can stomach it. I don't just see it as a singular defeat that irritates me. I think perhaps BR's rhetoric has rubbed off on me somewhat - i look to the bigger picture.

Good to see Suarez score yet again. That's a big plus.
 

ChicagoRed

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Again, regardless, that doesn't mean you can't move your legs and follow someone. I don't care if he rugby tackles him like the Udinese defender did to downing, just do something to show a bit of effort.

Tbh, after his brilliant goal, I thought Shelvey added nothing in the second half and was completely anonymous.
Well it sure as hell doesn't help that Carra lets Di Natalie play keepy up with the ball until somebody runs.s towards the box. Figures he couldn't miss hit either.