Post Match: Liverpool 1-1 Leicester (EPL 30/1/19 8pm)

[Gone Kloppo]

Again, more likely to be talked about if the decision/non decision affects the outcome of the game.

Very difficult to say it did. It's not like it was a penalty shout in the 3rd of 4 mins of injury time.

 

[Eintrachtfan]

All in all no good game from us. A draw that feels like a loss.
Here my main reasons:
- the bad pitch played more in the cards of Leicester than in ours
- we had no proven RB, Hendo out of position
- at least one not given pen(Keita), imo Chilwells Arms on Matips shoulders was also a pen
- Maguire must have seen a red card
- VvD not fully fit
- Fabinho couldn’t start the game

 

[Gone Kloppo]

Just. On referees - watching the Italian Cup - Inter v Lazio and var in England can't come quick enough.... But on one condition.

The Italian ref actually just gave a straight red, but watched a replay of it on var and without hesitation changed it to a yellow as it wasnt as dangerous as he initially thought. My problem is that I have very very little faith that stubbornness and pride won't get in the way of English refs overriding their own shit calls. It will work if English refs allow it to.

 

[cynicaloldgit]

My problem is that I have very very little faith that stubbornness and pride won't get in the way of English refs

Red card means red card.

 

[Mascot88]

Baseless arguments.

I expect they haven't dropped any points. And I have been arsed to check. Last season City gained 3 points while we dropped 12 due to bad decisions. I see no evidence of poor decisions costing them points in the games they've lost or drawn this season.
As a matter of interest who do you think was the 'luckiest' team last season? Manchester United. Strange that.
I'll leave it open to anyone who wants to provide evidence of City dropping points because of 'inept' refereeing.

Fair enough. Let’s play this fucking pointless game.

In the Manchester Derby last season, Ashley Young should have been sent off and conceded an pen which the ref refused to give.

Against Wolves, they conceded off a clear handball.

Against us, City felt they should have had two penalties - a handball by Van Dijk, and an arm in the face of Gabriel Jesus. The first of those definitely wasn’t a pen (Fernandinho was penalised for a foul) but Lovren was a bit lucky for the second. We’d have been shouting a for a foul if it was Salah, and claiming the ref was bent.

And if the refs really were biased in their favour, Tierney wouldn’t have disallowed their second goal against Newcastle and given De Bruyne a yellow card.

 

[Scott Jones]

But all the other bad decisions that don't include us were genuine mistakes,obviously.

 

[Show me the Mane]

The ref should have sent off De Bruyne and the Newcastle lad Perez, if they had not been booked already as both were 100% yellows

 

[jaffod]

Fair enough. Let’s play this fucking pointless game.

In the Manchester Derby last season, Ashley Young should have been sent off and conceded an pen which the ref refused to give.

Against Wolves, they conceded off a clear handball.

Against us, City felt they should have had two penalties - a handball by Van Dijk, and an arm in the face of Gabriel Jesus. The first of those definitely wasn’t a pen (Fernandinho was penalised for a foul) but Lovren was a bit lucky for the second. We’d have been shouting a for a foul if it was Salah, and claiming the ref was bent.

And if the refs really were biased in their favour, Tierney wouldn’t have disallowed their second goal against Newcastle and given De Bruyne a yellow card.

Let's get something straight. I'm not claiming the likes of City never get a bad call against them. I'm sure they do. Even United might get one or two over the course of a season.
The difference is they'll get more than their fair share in return. The stats for last season back this up. Both manc clubs gained more points from bad calls than they lost, Utd were in fact the 'luckiest' club in the PL. Not for the first time I'd imagine.
Contrast that to Liverpool. 12 points lost due to bad calls. Think about that for a minute. That's 4 fucking games we have to win just to make up for points taken from us by 'incompetent' referees. How often does that incompetence work in our favour? Last season? I genuinely can't remember anything.
This season wasn't too bad up to New Year apart from Mane's goal at Arsenal but since then we've been shafted at City and again last night. Yet again it's cost us points. The Kompany tackle and the foul on Keita were both clearly visible to the referee. I could be really cynical and suggest the fact we were playing catch-up before new year and then had the chance to run away with it has something to do with it.
We could be a minimum of 10 points ahead of City with fair refereeing. If we don't win it I'll look back on this period in the same way I look back on the disgraceful Mason & Webb shafting that imo cost us the title in 2014.

 

[hugo the horrible]

Atko's excuse is that he's an appalling referee.

In truth though, I don't think there's even a question that players that are classed as divers by the refs (Kane escapes this tag - that he's English is no coincidence) will get a far tougher time of it. Keita is very unfairly bring punished for some of his flops earlier in the season.

Atko's excuse is that he's an appalling referee.

In truth though, I don't think there's even a question that players that are classed as divers by the refs (Kane escapes this tag - that he's English is no coincidence) will get a far tougher time of it. Keita is very unfairly bring punished for some of his flops earlier in the season.

Atkinson's excuse was that some sod nobbled his seeing eye dog!
He let some blatant stuff go,no excuse at this level!

 

[Alright Now]

We could all really use a top Degsy interview

 

[Quagmire81]

Leicester's park the bus tactic worked, congrats. atleast we didn't lose like City did.

The Ref get a lot of stick but only cause we failed to break down leicester over 90 min, and a bit to cover over that foolish lucas'eshe freekick Robertson commited which ended up handing them the goal. Gini gave him quite an earful for that and rightly so.

My biggest concern was our offensive set up which completely isolated Salah and pretty much make him useless all game, Shaqiri was ineffective all game aswell, he need to get back on the bench by now, we desperately need the impact he offer as a late sub. Dunno why Klopp persits with this set up when it's not really working. I wanna see last seasons set up with Mo out to the right, Mane to the left and Firmino up front, which worked like a charm.

 

[Semmy]

Maguire was VVD's man. VVD fucked up, looked like he was waiting for the whistle to go down the tunnel.

Nope. VvD stepped up like they had been doing all season to play Maguire offside. Matip and/pr one other didn't listen to the call and kept him on and he scored

 

[Mascot88]

Nope. VvD stepped up like they had been doing all season to play Maguire offside. Matip and/pr one other didn't listen to the call and kept him on and he scored

That’s what I saw as well. Although in general I thought Van Dijk had his worst game for us. Probably still ill.

 

[Hope in your heart]

(...). If we don't win it I'll look back on this period in the same way I look back on the disgraceful Mason & Webb shafting that imo cost us the title in 2014.

Really? In 2014, we didn't win it for one single reason: our inability to defend corners and other set pieces, and our general ineptitude in defence,which cost us at least twenty points that season. With the attacking prowess we had, we'd have run away with it, had we only had a semi-decent defence.

Us losing out that year had absolutely nothing to do with the refs, only with ourselves.

 

[Mascot88]

Dunno why Klopp persits with this set up when it's not really working.

Third best total at this stage of a season in history. Imagine where we’d be if Klopp system was working.

 

[Mascot88]

Really? In 2014, we didn't win it for one single reason: our inability to defend free kicks and set pieces, and our general ineptitude in defence,which cost us at least twenty points that season. With the attacking prowess we had, we'd have run away with it, had we only had a semi-decent defence.

Us losing out that year had absolutely nothing to do with the refs. Nothing at all. Only with ourselves.

It was also the the season where we were dubbed ‘penaltypool’ owing to the number of spot kicks we were given. Most of them by Suarez simply blaming the ball at a defenders arm.

 

[Hope in your heart]

It was also the the season where we were dubbed ‘penaltypool’ owing to the number of spot kicks we were given. Most of them by Suarez simply blaming the ball at a defenders arm.

Exactly. We were given a lot of soft penalties that season, but that's not something which enters in the frame of a good conspiracy theory, and thus, it won't be acknowledged...

 

[RodM]

Exactly. We were given a lot of soft penalties that season, but that's not something which enters in the frame of a good conspiracy theory, and thus, it won't be acknowledged...

I think the problem with conspiracy theories is that they don't take account all the available data. We know that referees can make mistakes and we know that there can be inconsistencies. We only tend to notice them when they affect a result against us but in truth they go both ways and largely (but not always entirely) cancel out.

Off the top of my head, on the minus side we should have had a penalty against Leicester and there was a goal against Arsenal that was wrongly ruled offside. Those both resulted in 2 dropped points but that was because we didn't score any more. There were other incidents where we were hard done by but it didn't make any difference. On the plus side, I can think of that goal against Burnley that was actually offside but still given (although I don't think that made a difference) and there were a couple of penalties that we were given to us that, on another day, I have seen waived on.

I think the biggest factor against Leicester was actually the weather. The snow was causing the ball to slow down excessively and that is a big disadvantage to our forwards who rely on pace to get past defenders and a godsend to those same defenders who were relying on slowing us down. That's just bum luck and it happens. We have also had good fortune the other way - not least of all the 2 free points against Everton with that outrageous goal at the end (FWIW, I'm still laughing about that.)

We are still in a far better position than we were last weekend. That extra point lead is significant and the number of remaining games are starting to dwindle.

Next up is West Ham. Currently, no snow is forecast for London on Monday and our own fitness situation should be improving. Time to put this one to bed and "keep buggering on".

 

[Lowton_Red]

Nope. VvD stepped up like they had been doing all season to play Maguire offside. Matip and/pr one other didn't listen to the call and kept him on and he scored

That’s what I saw as well. Although in general I thought Van Dijk had his worst game for us. Probably still ill.

Wrong call.

Matip did not play maguire onside. He was more advanced than VVD. If anything VVD should have been a tad more advanced.

It was Gini and Robbo playing maguire onside:

 

[Flobs]

Nope. VvD stepped up like they had been doing all season to play Maguire offside. Matip and/pr one other didn't listen to the call and kept him on and he scored

Matip did not play Maguire onside. Watch carefully.
Matip did miss his intended intervention. Once Matip starts moving back toward the goal VVD must follow suit imo. Matip saw the danger and reacted, VVD didn't take the cue.
At least your not blaming Henderson.

 

[Flobs]

Wrong call.

Matip did not play maguire onside. He was more advanced than VVD. If anything VVD should have been a tad more advanced.

It was Gini and Robbo playing maguire onside:

Wijnaldum is always slow at pushing out.

 

[Flobs]

Wrong call.

Matip did not play maguire onside. He was more advanced than VVD. If anything VVD should have been a tad more advanced.

It was Gini and Robbo playing maguire onside:

Matip reacted well just missed his intervention but VVD should have been covering him.

 

[KillerBeeLFC]

Wrong call.

Matip did not play maguire onside. He was more advanced than VVD. If anything VVD should have been a tad more advanced.

It was Gini and Robbo playing maguire onside:

Didnt realise he was getting blamed, hes the only fucker for us who actially tried to do something ha

 

[melbournered]

Maybe Klopp just made a bad fucking decision.

Those of you in the hear no evil, see no evil, speak no evil brigade ought to accept that the man makes mistakes.

As I said after the Champions League Final, it's Klopp that got us there, but Klopp that fucks the finals up with poor decisions.

His substitutions, in particular, rarely change things for the better.

Mate, you need to put your resume in. Klopp will appreciate your in game advice.

 

[melbournered]

Haha ignorance is bliss. And I mean that in the nicest possible way.

VAR is a total shit show that England has been largely immune from to date, bar a few FA Cup games.

As an Aussie living in the states, I've been living with it in the A League and the MLS for a few years now. VAR doesnt remove the human element from the game at all. All decisions continue to be down to ones interpretation of the law, but there is just an added level of scrutiny. No week goes past where there isn't at least 1 game involved in VAR controversy. It works ok when the desicion is not too ambiguous, like many of those instances during the world cup.

From a fans perspective, it also takes away the flow of the match and makes celebritating a goal a little watered down and delayed whilst you wait for the decision to be made.

The shit show that is VAR in the A League has been a disgrace. VAR as was applied at the World Cup was terrific. The system can work well and be as seamless as possible, if correctly used. As in any work place, an employer needs to give the necessary training that is required for an employee to fulfill their responsibilities. FIFA prepared well, Football Federation Australia did not.

 

[epsomred]

I think the problem with conspiracy theories is that they don't take account all the available data. We know that referees can make mistakes and we know that there can be inconsistencies. We only tend to notice them when they affect a result against us but in truth they go both ways and largely (but not always entirely) cancel out.

Off the top of my head, on the minus side we should have had a penalty against Leicester and there was a goal against Arsenal that was wrongly ruled offside. Those both resulted in 2 dropped points but that was because we didn't score any more. There were other incidents where we were hard done by but it didn't make any difference. On the plus side, I can think of that goal against Burnley that was actually offside but still given (although I don't think that made a difference) and there were a couple of penalties that we were given to us that, on another day, I have seen waived on.

I think the biggest factor against Leicester was actually the weather. The snow was causing the ball to slow down excessively and that is a big disadvantage to our forwards who rely on pace to get past defenders and a godsend to those same defenders who were relying on slowing us down. That's just bum luck and it happens. We have also had good fortune the other way - not least of all the 2 free points against Everton with that outrageous goal at the end (FWIW, I'm still laughing about that.)

We are still in a far better position than we were last weekend. That extra point lead is significant and the number of remaining games are starting to dwindle.

Next up is West Ham. Currently, no snow is forecast for London on Monday and our own fitness situation should be improving. Time to put this one to bed and "keep buggering on".

I think the best thing to do with conspiracy theorists is to leave them well alone. A bit like sleeping dogs or land mines. Never in the whole of human history has one come to his or her senses and said “fuck yes your right, now I see the evidence I realise I’ve been wrong about that my entire life”

 

[Quagmire81]

Third best total at this stage of a season in history. Imagine where we’d be if Klopp system was working.

atleast 7 point ahead of City I guess...

But when did I speak on the overal system not working?! it's obviously working. Silly to suggest otherwise which I didn't do, all I did was suggest why I think Salah isn't playing to the level he did last season and IMO it's because he ain't used the same way. Do you agree or disagree with that or are you only interesting in throwing me on a bonfire with overassumptions on what my point really was.

 

[ILLOK]

atleast 7 point ahead of City I guess...

But when did I speak on the overal system not working?! it's obviously working. Silly to suggest otherwise which I didn't do, all I did was suggest why I think Salah isn't playing to the level he did last season and IMO it's because he ain't used the same way. Do you agree or disagree with that or are you only interesting in throwing me on a bonfire with overassumptions on what my point really was.

Salah has been outrageously good recently, it was only the last game in which he wasn't.

 

[Limiescouse]

Peter Walton on tv originally said this wasnt a pen because Keita scuffed his shot. WTF has scuffing a shot got to do with it being a pen!? As I said, even in real time you can see the Leicester player knocks his standing foot and unbalances the lad as he's about to shoot. Of course he's going to 'scuff' the shot if he's been knocked off balanced. The defender did even get anywhere near the ball.

Walton is a fucking idiot. Every week when he does that bit on ESPN he gets something horrendously wrong. I mentioned the other week his smug idiocy over that goal in the Everton match where there was confusion over who touched it last before it fell to the scorer behind the last man (so in a seemingly offside position). He smugly explained why everyone else is getting wrong and how it shouldnt have stood. In his view the Everton player could not have been deemed to have intentionally played the ball, therefore the touch did not play the goal scorer onside and therefore the goal should have been ruled out. He was wrong in his interpretation of whether it was a deliberate attempt to play the ball (like handball, if the ball has traveled that far and it still hits you, then it is "deliberate"), but it was not even a relevant consideration. He seemingly forgot that the only touch by the scoring side (Cardiff?) was the actual corner kick. You cannot be offside direct from a corner, so if no other Cardiff player touches the ball before it falls to the scorer then he was never even in an offside position.

He is evidence of the reality that allowing refs the freedom to publicly explain their decisions after the game will not make the situation any better, because all it will do is lay bare how shit their decision making process actually is.

 

[sms1986]

I think the best thing to do with conspiracy theorists is to leave them well alone. A bit like sleeping dogs or land mines. Never in the whole of human history has one come to his or her senses and said “fuck yes your right, now I see the evidence I realise I’ve been wrong about that my entire life”

Some of them can be funny to observe, though, like the flat Earth people.