POST MATCH: Liverpool 4-1 West Brom

Dane

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Fantastic result in what a lot of us thought was a tricky fixture.
The most pleasing thing for me was the second half performance.
I was a bit concerned at 3-1 though, Toure was exposed a few times due to Kelly's positioning higher up the pitch,and Skrtel bailed him out a couple of times

Superb goal from Sturridge to put the game to bed, and with a bit of luck it could have been 6 or 7.

Cissoko is NOT an upgrade on Enrique.
Ok he set up Suarez' second, but was overall cumbersome.
 

canucky008

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So this is what a title race feels like?

Could really get used to it I'll tell you!
Early days I know bit I'm going to enjoy it and the top top top shelf football that was on display!
 

lfc.eddie

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canucky008 said:
So this is what a title race feels like?

Could really get used to it I'll tell you!
Early days I know bit I'm going to enjoy it and the top top top shelf football that was on display!
I guess you have missed 2008/09 season then? Now that is a title race in my book.
 

charleslee89

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Off_The_Heezay said:
You sound like the kind of person who apologises after sex. Lighten up a little, we won.
I'm just not entirely convinced of our defense. Skrtel's bad habits are all coming back,it's only a matter of time that he concedes a penalty...Bar for the manure match, we didn't really keep a clean sheet for all the league games so far which highlights some inherent problem with set-up of the defence.
 

theres always tommorrow

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What a great game to watch. Suarez was on fire - a master class on display. He looks like a man who is happy and focused again.

Sturridge didn't have his best game to start with but the man has got talent. He got into the game and put his mark on it with an exquisite goal. Must be difficult for him though. To be a top striker you need an extra large ego. On days like this when the Suarez magic is dazzling everyone he must feel like an understudy.....or maybe he thinks....I can do that and better! Either way BR needs to keep them both happy and I think he is doing a great job of that. His comments after the game singled Sturridge out. Brendan knows about the ego and confidence thing!

There were other chances. Stevie scuffed a shot from the edge of the box (perfect position for him) Skrtle missed a sitter from 5 metres and Hendo let fly with some impetuous attempts. He did his usual Duracell bunny thing which keeps the opposition on their toes and allows the rest of our guys to pick up the pieces (think I'm beginning to get him).

Cissohko was ok without being great - give him time and he might find his mojo. Back three did their job (just). Lucas was the standout for me though, what a game he had. Maybe he needs more regular breaks, he certainly looked much fresher as a result. BR take note - must find a back up for Lucas. Finally....Glen. He just does his thing and when he's not there we miss him.

This team is shaping up nicely. Well done Brendan....well done indeed. A good time to be a Red.
 

WellRedKev

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NZred said:
Fucking what? Henderson wasn't poor. Gave the ball away a few times but so be it. He was absolutely bloody everywhere which I think helped Lucas top. Notice he didn't give any dumb fouls? Cause more often than not it was him AND Henderson covering.
Henderson have away two cheap free kicks in the first 30mins. And he gave it away plenty and over hit two or three thru balls when in good positions. He was everywhere indeed, didnt do much when was there but.
 

WellRedKev

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Dane said:
Fantastic result in what a lot of us thought was a tricky fixture.
The most pleasing thing for me was the second half performance.
I was a bit concerned at 3-1 though, Toure was exposed a few times due to Kelly's positioning higher up the pitch,and Skrtel bailed him out a couple of times

Superb goal from Sturridge to put the game to bed, and with a bit of luck it could have been 6 or 7.

Cissoko is NOT an upgrade on Enrique.
Ok he set up Suarez' second, but was overall cumbersome.
Have to agree so far Enrique looks to have more about him than Cissokho still early doors tho.
 

Doggie

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WellRedKev said:
Henderson have away two cheap free kicks in the first 30mins. And he gave it away plenty and over hit two or three thru balls when in good positions. He was everywhere indeed, didnt do much when was there but.
Hendo had a fantastic game. Will be hard for Rodgers to choose who to drop if he wants to bring in Coutinho, but he may start as sub next week.

WellRedKev said:
Have to agree so far Enrique looks to have more about him than Cissokho still early doors tho.
Errm, yeah, considering that was his Anfield debut. Excellent assist for the second goal, but most of his crosses were just lumped into the box Downing style.
 

RichLFC

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Probably our best season performance so far, given we played well for at least 70 of the 90 minutes. And their penalty was a poor decision

Are very reliant on the sas and do feel the manager knew that last summer but wasn't helped much in dealing with that. Though our defensive options when everyone's fit look pretty healthy

Nice platform for a hard game next week. Get something our of that and January we might be taken seriously
 

OOTer

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basil1492 said:
@ OOter, i think the point you're missing is that most of us don't care if it's individual skill or not. We have that individual (more than 1 as it happens) so if he scores then great. As mentioned, Barca don't moan about Messi scoring too many, Christ, a few years ago United won the league from mainly Ronaldos goals and he's held up as an hero of theirs so who cares if it's individual brilliance.
Lol. I get that not many give a shit how we win. That's your/their perigotive. But I think you are missing the piont - I care! Lol

And your argument seemed to be that I was wrong to have that concern. Which I think I've somewhat validated. We score the least of our goals from crosses and the most from individual skills. I'd like to see more from creative passages of play. That is all. Is that really so wrong? Can you not admit you may have been to quick too critisise my point? Because what you did there is how lots of people end a discussion when they are wrong... 'Oh, I don't really care'. And there was me thinking caring was what supporting a club was all about. :-/

To move on. People are talking a lot about keeping clean sheets. Which is a valid point. However, I would point out that in those games we were hanging on for the win a fair bit in the 2nd halves. In the other fixtures, bar Swansea and Newcastle, when we've scored more than one we have been far more comfortable. Although yesterday at 3-1 I was concerned they may get back into it. But I think that's history playing a part.

Also, at the end of the season goal difference may come into play. So IMO winning 3-1 and 4-1 is more valuable than 1-0. Obv 3-0 and 4-0 are prefered. But it seems that with the systems we've employed at achieve those results it's an either/or scenario. Hopefully that can change with Lucas on top form and linos not being egotist and wanting to influence the game for the sake of it (my opinion of the nobjockey yesterday).

Still loving Hendo. And worried that Coutinho for him may cause us more problems in winning the ball back. And without the ball Countinho can't do his magic. Catch-22 almost. But that's a problem for Rodgers. And maybe for the near future we can use him as a proper game changing sub. Something I think we are lacking atm.
 

Mascot88

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OOTer said:
Make of that what you will. But I think it validates my opinion that most of our goals are from individual skill and that we do not score many from crosses.
What I make of it is that you've just defined yourself right. Going through all the goals, deciding for yourself which is down to individual skill, and then declaring yourself correct. You'll never be a scientist mate :)

Even so you're counting four goals scored from crosses to back up your argument that it isn't worth counting chances resulting from crosses. We only scored five team goals according to your definition, so do we discount any chances we create as a team?
 

Mascot88

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Dane said:
Disturbing how the Skrtel skeptics are still beating their drums.
Toure was far less disciplined than Skrtel, and was bailed out more than once by him.
Skrtel was fine, but frequently he got himself in all kinds of tangles with attackers - he was unlucky not to give away two penalties. There was also the one he cleared off the line - good clearance, but he shouldn't have let the attack develop by allowing the ball to loop over his head. He is still very suspect judging the flight of a ball and reading the game.

He's keeping his place on merit but I always feel a fuck up is just around the corner.
 

Mascot88

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OOTer said:
Still loving Hendo. And worried that Coutinho for him may cause us more problems in winning the ball back. And without the ball Countinho can't do his magic. Catch-22 almost. But that's a problem for Rodgers. And maybe for the near future we can use him as a proper game changing sub. Something I think we are lacking.
If we want to accommodate both Hendo and Coutinho, then we have to sacrifice a defender, and revert to a back four. That's true for a 4231, a 433, a 442 or a 41212.
 

Dane

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Mascot88 said:
Skrtel was fine, but frequently he got himself in all kinds of tangles with attackers - he was unlucky not to give away two penalties. There was also the one he cleared off the line - good clearance, but he shouldn't have let the attack develop by allowing the ball to loop over his head. He is still very suspect judging the flight of a ball and reading the game.

He's keeping his place on merit but I always feel a fuck up is just around the corner.
Ha ha, Skrtel is turning into the new Lucas
 

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RichLFC said:
Probably our best season performance so far, given we played well for at least 70 of the 90 minutes. And their penalty was a poor decision
First time all season that I have been as happy with the performance as the result.
 

Zinedine Biscan

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Cracking performance and result, and more pleased than I can say that we kept up a consistently high standard across the whole 90 minutes. That was starting to be a real concern for me, so hopefully we'll start to see more consistency now. If we manage that, I think we'll be at or around the top of the table for a while to come yet.

What can you say about the goals? If it wasn't for Kasami's the other night, I think Luis and Studge would be battling each other for goal of the season. Never seen a header like that from that far out before, and Studge's chip actually had me up on my feet clapping in front of the computer monitor. Perfect, just perfect.

Sure there were a couple of concerns but honestly I couldn't give a crap about those after that match. Great game and I'm very happy right now.
 

gingerbread

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From the 45' to 75' mark, this season we have only scored 12% of our goals, meanswhile conceded 63% of total goal conceded.

Not sure if it's just a coincidence, considered that we mostly always lead by half time and draw back too much to defend (hence more vulnerable). Or it's just something to do with the team speak and attitude coming out from the changing room
 

Dane

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Doggie said:
Errm, yeah, considering that was his Anfield debut..
Errm, no it wasn't.

But your Downing comparison was fairly accurate.
 

OOTer

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Mascot88 said:
What I make of it is that you've just defined yourself right. Going through all the goals, deciding for yourself which is down to individual skill, and then declaring yourself correct. You'll never be a scientist mate :)

Even so you're counting four goals scored from crosses to back up your argument that it isn't worth counting chances resulting from crosses. We only scored five team goals according to your definition, so do we discount any chances we create as a team?
As I mentioned at the beginning of the post 'my opinion'. So I understand the subjective nature of my analysis. Hence why I included a brief description of the goals. Feel free to judge them all by your self. I would welcome you opinion of them based on the three criteria I presented. Skill/team/cross.

Another way to look at is, rather than 'defined myself right', I am right ;-p

It's not about discounting crosses. It's about realising it's not a strength. This means if teams crowd the middle and force us wide we are less likely to score (as has been witnessed, I'm sure you agree we struggle with park-the-bus teams). This means we rely on individuals as our means to break through. I's simply like to be able to break them down with passages of play.

Is it so hard to see that we are not a goals from crosses team and that if we were to rely on them (and even the individual skill goals) we would not be as potent up top.

I'm just repeating myself now. If you don't wanna see my point of view that's fine. But I would welcome your own analysis of our goals if you would.

Maybe you could argue that our system is designed (as BR has said) to get the best out of DS & LS so we of course will sacrifice 'team goals'; as the nature of those two is to score self created chances. And that with Coutinho to return we have the ability to switch reliance if our 'individuals' are unable to make their mark on the game.
 

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Dane said:
Errm, no it wasn't.

But your Downing comparison was fairly accurate.
Blame the commentator - he said it was his starting debut at Anfield. :p
 

Red Armada

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I want to point out just how special the Suarez-Sturridge partnership is. It is a very rare thing nowadays to have an attacking duo of this caliber. If we keep them around long enough and we make the right moves they are going to deliver us not just a CL spot but PL titles. And that's without taking into account Coutinho.

Other than that there isn't much more to be added. Best performance of the season by far, the sole blemish being Johnson's new injury and some defensive blunders, mostly by Skrtel and Toure. Long may it continue.
 

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Mascot88 said:
If we want to accommodate both Hendo and Coutinho, then we have to sacrifice a defender, and revert to a back four. That's true for a 4231, a 433, a 442 or a 41212.
True. But then presumably we would have Lucas and Gerrard deep again with Hendo and Coutinho changing the AM and LW roles. And, unless Suarez or DS will play wide right we'll be lop sided.

Thats my take on it. As I can't see the 41221/4141 being as secure with only 2 CB behind Lucas and no dedicated deeper CM to help Lucas close down the spaces.

IMO it would be going back to the seemingly less potent system that gave us our 1-0s at the start of the season. With 2 deeper mids.
 

rab

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OOTer said:
As I mentioned at the beginning of the post 'my opinion'. So I understand the subjective nature of my analysis. Hence why I included a brief description of the goals. Feel free to judge them all by your self. I would welcome you opinion of them based on the three criteria I presented. Skill/team/cross.

It's not about discounting crosses. It's about realising it's not a strength. This means if teams crowd the middle and force us wide we are less likely to score (as has been witnessed, I'm sure you agree we struggle with park-the-bus teams). This means we rely on individuals as our means to break through. I's simply like to be able to break them down with passages of play.

Is it so hard to see that we are not a goals from crosses team and that if we were to rely on them (and even the individual skill goals) we would not be as potent up top.

I'm just repeating myself now. If you don't wanna see my point of view that's fine. But I would welcome your own analysis of our goals if you would.

Maybe you could argue that our system is designed (as BR has said) to get the best out of DS & LS so we of course will sacrifice 'team goals'; as the nature of those two is to score self created chances. And that with Coutinho to return we have the ability to switch reliance if our 'individuals' are unable to make their mark on the game.
It's all how down to how you classify the goals though. Take that Sturridge one against Sunderland for example. The shooting chance is created for him by the team keeping possession of the ball high up the field and working it round the box until it gets to Sturridge with space to shoot. Surely there's a huge influence on that goal coming from the team play leading up to thee shooting chance for Sturridge?

Looking back at all the goals from all the Premiership games yesterday I fail to see one goal coming from a clear cut nailed on chance that didn't involve some individual skill or come from a cross.

Ars v Cpl - Penalty and Giroud scores from a cross.
Ast v Eve - Lukaku and Osman score from passes out wide to them on the edge of the box. Cross or individual skill perhaps both.
Liv v WBA - Suarez brilliance, Suarez from a cross, Suarez cross and Sturridge individual skill.
Utd v Sto - All three of Utd's were from crosses as was one of Stokes. The other from individual skill at the freekick.
Ston v Ful - Both Southampton goals came from crosses.

So how often are any team really breaking down anyone else without some element of individual skill or a ball being played in from out wide?
 

Dane

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Look, do we need the detailed dissection and all the should have tried 4-1-2-3 nonsense?

We played well for most of the game and followed the simple Paisley instructions.
When we weren't sure what to do with the ball, we stuck it in the net.
 

Bleeding Red

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Lucky enough to get to Anfield yesterday, for what was definitely our best performance of the season. Last time I went to a game, we lost 2-1 to Wigan, so an altogether much better day. We lapsed for about 10 minutes in the second half, but it's certainly an improvement on the whole second half no show. I said to my brother at half time that Sturridge was actually the only player in the first half who looked off the pace for us, and I still told him that he would score. And make no mistake, it was an important, not to mention sublime, goal from him, as West Brom were in the ascendancy at the time, and a second goal would have had the whole stadium in panic mode. He completely killed it though.

Only downside to my day was hearing that the scum were losing at half time again, and that the scored 2 late goals. Can't get too upset though, all we can do is win our games. And whatever you say about performances, in a season where everyone looks like taking points off eachother, 29 points out of 36 at this stage is a good return.
 

rab

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Dane said:
Look, do we need the detailed dissection and all the should have tried 4-1-2-3 nonsense?

We played well for most of the game and followed the simple Paisley instructions.
When we weren't sure what to do with the ball, we stuck it in the net.
So a game is only worth dissecting when we don't win?
 

OOTer

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rab said:
It's all how down to how you classify the goals though. Take that Sturridge one against Sunderland for example. The shooting chance is created for him by the team keeping possession of the ball high up the field and working it round the box until it gets to Sturridge with space to shoot. Surely there's a huge influence on that goal coming from the team play leading up to thee shooting chance for Sturridge?

Looking back at all the goals from all the Premiership games yesterday I fail to see one goal coming from a clear cut nailed on chance that didn't involve some individual skill or come from a cross.

Ars v Cpl - Penalty and Giroud scores from a cross.
Ast v Eve - Lukaku and Osman score from passes out wide to them on the edge of the box. Cross or individual skill perhaps both.
Liv v WBA - Suarez brilliance, Suarez from a cross, Suarez cross and Sturridge individual skill.
Utd v Sto - All three of Utd's were from crosses as was one of Stokes. The other from individual skill at the freekick.
Ston v Ful - Both Southampton goals came from crosses.

So how often are any team really breaking down anyone else without some element of individual skill or a ball being played in from out wide?
Not sure if you got the right DS goal/game. Here is my Sunderland analysis:

Lfc 3-1 Sunderland : 1st) DS scores from SG corner. CROSS. 2nd) Suarez tap in from DS assist. DS cuts in from right side and plays ball across goal from inside penalty box. Not a cross for me, but some may disagree. TEAM GOAL. 3rd) Counter attack, Suarez plays ball high to left to DS who receives just inside box, cuts to byline and cuts back for Suarez to tap in. TEAM GOAL

But I do see your point that the ball needs to get to that player in the 1st place in any individual goal. So mostly (unless Shelvey is playing for the oppo) that is the case. All I would say is that without that player's individual skill we could pass the ball around the box endlessly to no avail. A la the park-the-bus scenario.

Again, you are right. In the majority of goals across the prem and in most weeks it's not that common to see team goals/chances. But thats not to say we can't strive to be more than we are. Surely that's the winning mentality.

Thanks for engaging with me on this. Football is a game of opinions. And no one's is ever 100% correct. Even mine ;)
 

rab

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OOTer said:
Not sure if you got the right DS goal/game. Here is my Sunderland analysis:

Lfc 3-1 Sunderland : 1st) DS scores from SG corner. CROSS. 2nd) Suarez tap in from DS assist. DS cuts in from right side and plays ball across goal from inside penalty box. Not a cross for me, but some may disagree. TEAM GOAL. 3rd) Counter attack, Suarez plays ball high to left to DS who receives just inside box, cuts to byline and cuts back for Suarez to tap in. TEAM GOAL

But I do see your point that the ball needs to get to that player in the 1st place in any individual goal. So mostly (unless Shelvey is playing for the oppo) that is the case. All I would say is that without that player's individual skill we could pass the ball around the box endlessly to no avail. A la the park-the-bus scenario.

Again, you are right. In the majority of goals across the prem and in most weeks it's not that common to see team goals/chances. But thats not to say we can't strive to be more than we are. Surely that's the winning mentality.

Thanks for engaging with me on this. Football is a game of opinions. And no one's is ever 100% correct. Even mine ;)
Sorry that's my bad, I meant the Stoke game not Sunderland game. :wacko:

Never a problem when things are going well to be wanting more but I don't feel it should be at the expense of disregarding or trivialising what has come before it. In essence pretty much every goal is a team goal. Rarely does someone score without the contribution from others in the team be that in a simple pass, a hoof down field or a clever decoy run that could be hugely significant but wouldn't even get an assist stat.

I do think the return of Coutinho could well see the number of clearer cut chances increase. How Rodgers fits him into the side without sacrificing the stronger showing from midfield yesterday and the constant danger of the front two is a lovely problem to have.