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POST MATCH Thread: Liverpool 1-2 Man Utd

King Aldo

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Utter Tosh Tosh... I am old enough to remember when we ruled the roost & other teams made those allegations against us. Ref's decisions even out over a season. Refs have to make split second decisions & unlike all the armchair supporters who see it 20 times from different angles & speeds.

Our season starts here & I have faith that given time & a few seasons BR can get us back up there challenging. We have some amazing young talent & for the first time in a long time I am excited by what I am seeing,
So people say ... but nobody has ever shown me any evidence of these things evening out, I might just do a bit of analysis on this myself because I have a strong suspicion of the FA in relation to all things LFC and MUFC at the moment.
 

OhYaBeauty

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What didn't you expect from me? Telling the truth as it is? This guy is a full pro, paid by the FA do do only refereeing. In the three decisions he had to make, he had a perfect position to see events, as one would expect from a pro. Yet, he makes a complete meal out of it. On three occasions, not one.

Alarm bells still not ringing, mate?
I keep thinking that if we keep getting on the end of shite refereeing decisions eventually all the good karma will come back and help us out. But its gradually becoming clear that its not going to happen. The refs just like to fcuk us up the arse and so do the goddamn goalposts.
 

Quagmire81

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It happens way too much every season, not just against united or the other top teams, but against any team.
What about the opening game. Phil Dowd was practicly waiting for any oppotunity to fuck our game up, and he did that within three minutes ,two pens, one right after they missed the first, oh and also a very very harsh red card.
I'm so sick of the refs, they act like they got an agenda against us, thats how it feels at times.
 

BelfastRed89

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It is a myth that these decisions even out over the course of a season perpetuated by pundits and so called "experts" as a way to dismiss the constant decisions that certain teams get in their favour. Of course when we were a Champions League or "top 4" club we may have got a lot more of the decisions against the smaller clubs, though as each year has passed without us being one of the top 4 we have got less and less of these decisions in our favour. As for the big games and 1 team in particular we have been on the wrong end of most of the contentious decisions over the last 15+ years with no sign of it changing as we seen yesterday. I very much doubt it will even out. It's unlikely at the very least we'll go to Old Trafford and see one of their players sent off in a similar fashion with us given a soft penalty while they are denied one.

Someone else made a good point over Suarez, already he has been denied at least two (maybe more) penalties this season and god knows how many free kicks, the same happened last season and it didn't even out so I've no reason to believe it will this season either.
 

Le_hunt

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So if it was shelvey that had stayed down, you would say that evans deserved the red?

As I saw it they both went into the challenge on fair ground to each other, jonjo won it and evans happen to stayed down, touch luck for evans in my book, but surely not in the refs tho, which makes you wonder on what basis he made the call on? on who got hurt the most? I've seem players get injured without the other part got any card at all, so on what basis are the refs calling by.
How many times last season did we see Carroll basicly get an albow to his neck without even a freekick being called. So I ask again on what basis did the ref call on. You could be tempted to say on the jerseys in this case.
anyway let's stick to that picture of Evans' studs up at the same time as Jonjo's. there's no possible argument against that. if Jonjo was sent off for this, Evans shoud've been sent off as well, no possible debate here. David Luis got a YELLOW card for a harsher tackle than this. F****** YELLOW .

They really deserve every bad thing that happens to them
as long as it is on the pitch and on the pitch only, I'm with you on that one.
 

sunburst

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Well this is just fucking great! Halsey has put in a complaint to the police re tweets he's received about the sending off. Mancs chanting "murderers" gets brushed under the carpet, yet come twats who can't keep their gobs shut send him threats, putting us back in the news for all the wrong reasons... FFS!
 

lillypad_33

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I'm still seething mad today over these calls.
I think it was pretty clear at the time that it wasn't a two footed challenge, but to have that compounded with the cheap penalty shot for the win really ticks me off.
It's games like that that make you wonder why you watch the sport in the first place.
You get all jacked up to watch, and in the end, the game is decided by the referee.
 

BelfastRed89

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anyway let's stick to that picture of Evans' studs up at the same time as Jonjo's. there's no possible argument against that. if Jonjo was sent off for this, Evans shoud've been sent off as well, no possible debate here. David Luis got a YELLOW card for a harsher tackle than this. F****** YELLOW .



as long as it is on the pitch and on the pitch only, I'm with you on that one.
When I seen that Luiz tackle on MOTD I went mad!! I fail to see how that can possibly be a yellow and Jonjo's a red, ridiculous. The inconsistency of the PL Referee's in their application of the rules regarding "two footed" challenges is what has annoyed me most after this weekend. Either all two footed challenges are banned or none. The ref does not have enough time in the split second or the benefit of replays to decide how bad each one is so each should get the same punishment. All this despite the fact Shelvey's tackle wasn't even two footed as well.
 

Arminius

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Well this is just fucking great! Halsey has put in a complaint to the police re tweets he's received about the sending off. Mancs chanting "murderers" gets brushed under the carpet, yet come twats who can't keep their gobs shut send him threats, putting us back in the news for all the wrong reasons... FFS!
The 'where is your Munich song now' chant is in some ways the most appalling of the lot. It is disgusting to use Hillsborough in any way in an anti-LFC chant, but can you imagine an LFC crowd 'using' Hillsborough to wind up any other club's supporters? It shows not just a total lack of respect for the occasion, but not even respect for a tragedy in their own history.
 

Mascot88

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I thought Halsey yesterday was absolutely fucking diabolical. Inexcusably so, but I wonder what the perspective of a team like Norwich or Wigan would be when it comes to playing us.

It's my opinion that Referees really struggle to keep up with the pace of the game and they are trying to shortcut this problem by basing their decision making on the balance of probability.

Man Utd are a better team than us, so despite absolutely bossing them off the park, they get every single decision because they are 'the better team'. Johnson probably pushed Valencia, Suarez peobably dived, and Shelvey was probably second to that ball. Man Utd are a better team, so that's the best chance the refs have of getting difficult called right.

That's why I wonder about when we play smaller teams, do they feel we get the run of the team more than them?
 

Arminius

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That's why I wonder about when we play smaller teams, do they feel we get the run of the team more than them?
I think they probably do, but beyond that there has been some fairly credible analysis done on the hypotheis that the big teams get a significant edge in officiating for their home games. There is some evidence that points to the possibility that smaller clubs get less of a benefit and/or big clubs tend to see somewhat more favourable treatment for away games as well, which then dilutes the 'home' benefit that accrues to smaller clubs. So if they feel that way, it is probably because generally, the small teams do face an uphill struggle.
 

Mascot88

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On the chants, I said in the thread that the Utd lad posted that some chanting was inevitable, twats being twats. The real test of whether the clubs can move on is whether the 99% of sensible, normal people can write it off as the actions of imbeciles.

Indignancy fuels it. The lads chanting murderers and the lads making aeroplane noises are doing it to rile opposing fans. The vast majority of United and Liverpool fans who aren't intellectually sub-normal need to simply ignore it. That's the only way it's going to go away.

I mean, for fucks sake. These lads are singing mocking songs about nearly 100 people being crushed to death in agony and terror. And we think we can reason with them? A letter from their own manager, who i think is absolutely sincere on this issue, couldn't shut them up.

Starving them of the reaction is the only thing we can do.
 

jimmydestiny

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Well this is just fucking great! Halsey has put in a complaint to the police re tweets he's received about the sending off. Mancs chanting "murderers" gets brushed under the carpet, yet come twats who can't keep their gobs shut send him threats, putting us back in the news for all the wrong reasons... FFS!
As usual there are bell ends everywhere, but I would question the idea of a ref being on twitter or any social media network as it only gives people an opportunity to do this sort of thing.
 

Bambii

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I held his punditry in low esteem and only watch that programme when I'm bored stiff or drunk; but that well and truly ends me with regards to Lawrenson and MOTD. Gary Neville....yes, Gary fucking Neville, and Skysports replays, gave a more accurate appraisal. If one of the worst reffing performances of the season is getting 10/10, the league and sport is in trouble.



or ferdinand coming through suarez, or evra on sterling, or evans on kelly at the first corner, or close up of evans penalty incident v suarez.
I held his punditry in low esteem and only watch that programme when I'm bored stiff or drunk; but that well and truly ends me with regards to Lawrenson and MOTD. Gary Neville....yes, Gary fucking Neville, and Skysports replays, gave a more accurate appraisal. If one of the worst reffing performances of the season is getting 10/10, the league and sport is in trouble.



or ferdinand coming through suarez, or evra on sterling, or evans on kelly at the first corner, or close up of evans penalty incident v suarez.
Or the Agger penalty decision , shocking bias
 

ChicagoRed

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I am actually a bit puzzled as to what law might have been broken by the texts cited.
In America it could be harassment through electronic device although that would require a pattern of tweets over time. Not sure across the pond.
 

lfc.eddie

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Didn't know a curse online is deemed as abuse, and it's on daily mail - freaking tabloid.
 

alaskared

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Until the FA gets with the times and has a panel with tv replays to judge the big decisions, games will always be won or lost on refs errors. Not even their fault, FA's.
I forgot to give props to Suso on his performance in the second half. 100% pass completion, shot on goal and insturmental in Stevie's goal. Fantastic.
We will be winning soon, even with the injuries.
 

King Aldo

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I notice Halsey complained to GREATER MANCHESTER POLICE

Now I don't live in England but can someone explain why that particular police force? - is it because they handle abuse cases, or is it because Halsey lives in the greater Manchester area or is it because his mate Alex knows all the local cops and they can make sure it gets followed up.

Anyone got any ideas ... by the way I think the idea of abusing him on Twitter is ridiculous, we are hardly likely to inspire him to be fair towards us in subsequent matches doing that are we.
 

Hope in your heart

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That's what you'll get from Twitter: headless individuals saying mindless things. But nevertheless, Halsey is an absolute twat. As a referee, he surely gets abuse after each single match he has refereed. Being on twitter, he can't expect anything else.

Him reporting this to the police (indeed: why the Manchester police?) is just sticking the knife in, and trying to divert public opinion from a truly abject personal 'performance'.
 



RedSeven

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I notice Halsey complained to GREATER MANCHESTER POLICE

Now I don't live in England but can someone explain why that particular police force? - is it because they handle abuse cases, or is it because Halsey lives in the greater Manchester area or is it because his mate Alex knows all the local cops and they can make sure it gets followed up.

Anyone got any ideas ... by the way I think the idea of abusing him on Twitter is ridiculous, we are hardly likely to inspire him to be fair towards us in subsequent matches doing that are we.
If he lives in the greater manchester area then that would likely be the reason he reported the abuse to them.Since the abuse came via twitter,the people responsible could have come from anywhere,even though they would claim to support liverpool.
 

King Aldo

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On the penalties since Suarez thing .... here are some stats

2011-2012 season

Man Utd total penalties awarded ... For = 11 Against = 3
... following Suarez case on New Years eve ... For = 8 (3 in Jan 2012 alone) Against = 0

Liverpool total penalties awarded ... For = 6 Against = 5
... following Suarez case ... For = 2 Against = 4


2012 - 2013 season so far
Man Utd total penalties For = 3 Against = 0
Liverpool For = 0 Against = 3


So just so we are clear, since the Suarez case was announced on New Years Eve 31st Dec 2011 Man Utd have not had a penalty awarded against them but have been awarded 11 penalties.

Liverpool have been awarded 2 penalties in this time and have had 7 penalties awarded against us.
Man Utd top the league with most penalties awarded last season with 11 penalties, we had 6 (only 2 after Jan 1st however)

Source for data is football-lineups.com


Anyone still think this will even out or that by "imagining" an FA / Ref bias against LFC is being fanciful ... anyone still think that this will "even itself out" over the course of this season. I'd be interested in your rationale for that.
 

Arminius

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Anyone still think this will even out or that by "imagining" an FA / Ref bias against LFC is being fanciful ... anyone still think that this will "even itself out" over the course of this season. I'd be interested in your rationale for that.
You need to be careful in how you interpret the data. All things being equal, it should not come to strict equality. The top teams should earn more penalty shots by virtue of time of possession in and around the box.

But the banal assertion that bad calls will even out over the course of the season is intellectually lazy commentary. There is no empirical evidence for that, and there is quite a bit of evidence to the contrary.
 

AnfieldCat

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That's what you'll get from Twitter: headless individuals saying mindless things. But nevertheless, Halsey is an absolute twat. As a referee, he surely gets abuse after each single match he has refereed. Being on twitter, he can't expect anything else.

Him reporting this to the police (indeed: why the Manchester police?) is just sticking the knife in, and trying to divert public opinion from a truly abject personal 'performance'.
I don't condone the abuse at all but why a ref would be on twitter is beyond me, unless in his case hes using it to do charity stuff, if I was a ref I would be NOWHERE near twitter.
 

Quagmire81

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Typical distraction from the main issue, that he without shame won the game for united through his biased referrering.
And the stats that King aldo posted are quite telling.