Post Match: Wolves 2-1 Liverpool (FAC 7/1/19 7.45pm)

Man of the Match

  • Mignolet

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Camacho

    Votes: 6 5.0%
  • Fabinho

    Votes: 34 28.1%
  • Lovren [off 7’]

    Votes: 3 2.5%
  • Moreno

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Milner

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Keita

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Jones [off 70’]

    Votes: 2 1.7%
  • Shaqiri

    Votes: 2 1.7%
  • Sturridge [off 70’]

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Origi [GOAL 51’]

    Votes: 4 3.3%
  • Hoever [on 7’]

    Votes: 69 57.0%
  • Firmino [on 70’]

    Votes: 1 0.8%
  • Salah [on 70’]

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    121

Dane

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Our bad luck in January so far has been diabolical, we had 5 CHs and now there is only one left fit VVD and he has been sick apparently. I suggested before Christmas that we needed to buy another CH and I was told there’s is plenty of cover. In midfield we had plenty of cover but Hendo is slightly injured, Gini is OK but knackered, Keita hmm no ready yet, Milly knackered, Lallana injured/Sick?, Fabinho is now likely to be our stand-in CH come Rightback?
So how many first team standard centre halves would you recommend we have on the books?
Bearing in mind that when everyone is fit, they'd have to be happy sitting on the bench.
 

FGred

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The obvious answer would be to hand a CL place to the winner, and to allocate a lot more money to the competition. It would be instantly taken more seriously by everyone. I sincerely hope that this will happen one day.
You’ve hit the nail on the head the prize money compared to the CL and PL is a pittance.
 

FGred

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So how many first team standard centre halves would you recommend we have on the books?
Bearing in mind that when everyone is fit, they'd have to be happy sitting on the bench.
Ideally as many as Shitty they have about a dozen I think?
 

RedYank

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Not to do a Brighton Pre-Match here, but looking at them, they are not a shabby squad either. On their pitch, they may be trouble for us--especially if our group is patch-and-play.

I am the nervous one on every Matchday, so don't mind the musings too much.
 

redalways

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One more note, if Lovren is indeed out for a month, then perhaps last night was a good opportunity for us to have given Hoever his debut. Worth noting that (a) he didn't look that much out of place once he got over the initial nerves, (b) it was away to Wolves, a really tough opponent who played (if I'm not wrong) their regular starting forwards, and (c) Virgil. It would not surprise me too much (although I'm certainly not expecting it as such) if he were to find himself at the very least in the squad for these matches.
 

FGred

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Doing the right thing is right regardless of whether the ultimate outcome is as desired.

As for the game, to me it is more disappointing the performances of the fringe guys than the result per se. I don’t mind losing and going out in a competition I haven’t given a shit about for over a decade. I don’t like losing in a way that suggests our fringe guys have less of a role to play moving forward.

On another note though, their first goal was offside. I am kind of stunned it got not reaction or coverage. The lad who won the ball back then ran down the middle was ahead of the guy on the ball for about 30 yards. And in his run, he clearly purposefully positioned himself to prevent Millner getting over to close down the guy with the ball.
I agree about their first goal Milner was impeded but VAR ruled it ok But guess who was in charge of VAR the same Manchester ref that took charge in the match against Shitty just saying?
 

Limiescouse

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I agree about their first goal Milner was impeded but VAR ruled it ok But guess who was in charge of VAR the same Manchester ref that took charge in the match against Shitty just saying?
On what possible basis could VAR rule it out? Even if he wasnt offside you could make a case of it being an obstruction given that he very clearly tried to block Milner's covering run (see the look over his shoulder and the adjusted angle of his run). But the fact he was in an offside makes it cast iron.
 

Macolfc

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I get the jist of what you are saying. It’s been a while since we won something and the best clubs win stuff, so we need to get back to that and win something soon.

I just want to explore what you are saying with the bold part. If we don’t win something this season, do you think Klopp needs to be sacked? I don’t want to put words in your mouth, so I’m genuinely asking what you think on that. If I’m reading you right, finishing second in the Prem is failure, and presumably so is not winning the CL? Either eventuality (or worse) would perpetuate the cycle of us being also rans.

So my question is, especially in light of the bolded part, what would you do with the manager?

My personal answer:

I think Klopp is doing a great job. It’s our best ever start in a Prem season - 21 games, and we are in the knockout stages of the CL. Before he came we had a patchy record of even qualifying to play in the CL, and in fact we were out of it more seasons than in it. Since he came in he has elevated everything about the club, and now we are solid and regular CL participants, and we are currently trying to take that last step - a very difficult step, for numerous reasons - to winning either/both the CL and the Prem. He has taken us to three finals, one of them way ahead of schedule, but you take it if it comes; and the one we should have won was the Europa final, but we didn’t.

Anyhow, for me, I think Klopp is rock solid here. We’ve gone from a Europa team/occasional CL team to now being regulars at the top table, we are top of the Prem and in the knockout stages in CL. He’s not just about getting away with anything, in my eyes at least! I think he’s doing a fantastic job and long may it continue. I’m backing him to bring the trophy we all want, and the signs of progress so far are very clear.

Completely agree that Klopp needs to stay, I think there’s a lot of people on here me included that wouldn’t want to leave even if we where trophyless in 2/3 seasons. He’s the perfect fit for the club, but to be honest we do need trophies.

I wouldn’t agree that where regulars at the top of the table though, 8th & two 4ths in the last 3 seasons. BR brought us a second & then the year after we where terrible.

One other thing from me because I’ve gone on about trophies abit to much since last night. If we do win the PL this year as fans are we going to start expecting us to fight on every front? Surely we cant be a club that only challenges for one trophy seriously each season. The big boys challenge everywhere, city get into finals & win as well as winning the league. Madrid win the CL & they win league. Same with the likes of Barcelona, juve etc etc. I understand JKs building, so hopefully that’s his aim with us.
 

FGred

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On what possible basis could VAR rule it out? Even if he wasnt offside you could make a case of it being an obstruction given that he very clearly tried to block Milner's covering run (see the look over his shoulder and the adjusted angle of his run). But the fact he was in an offside makes it cast iron.
Precisely it was a clear obstruction of Milner to stop him getting to the goal scorer but somehow it was OK somehow never mind the offside
 
C

Caradoc

Guest
I think some supporters need to make their minds up ....... what is the priority? One minute its the EPL. The next minute its Old Big Ears. Then its winning a trophy ........ any trophy!

For me its the EPL. The ECL would be an acceptable alternative. I’m sticking with that!
 

RodM

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Don't you just hate it when we have just last two games on the trot and it's days until the next game?

I suppose the other downer is that we then have a couple of blank weekends to come up but they do have a silver lining. The weekend of the 26th gives a nice breather between Palace and Leicester both at home. That could be seen as a mini Winter break. The next weekend is 16th February which falls between Bayern at home and Manchester United away which could be very useful.

Anyway, how long until the pre-match thread for the Brighton game goes up?
 

Quagmire81

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I agree about their first goal Milner was impeded but VAR ruled it ok But guess who was in charge of VAR the same Manchester ref that took charge in the match against Shitty just saying?
In Italy VAR is controlled by Juventus according to the director of Rai2 just saying.

I'm still convinced they fucked us over with that line decision, took way too long before we got to see it, plenty of time to adjust the grafh to fit the call. I dunno look into it lol
 

Red over the water

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I see it differently from many on here. Going deep in cups can be beneficial to developing youth and keeping the fringe players fresh and ready for rotation. If we get knocked out at the first time of asking all the time, where can the likes of Moreno, Origi (or future replacements) hone their match fitness? Consequently, they then perform worse every time they step onto the pitch.

It is also unfair that Klopp pairs all the second stringers together. How do you expect the group to perform as well as the first choice players, if they are not afforded the same quality team mates? Again, I can understand why some of them look disinterested in playing. It almost seems that these players have accepted that this match is as good as gone, and they will still be second choice come end of the day.

However, I would say there are mitigating circumstances this season, namely, facing such tough opponents early in the cups.

Looking forward, I think it would be easier to attract good quality rotation options if we can maintain deeper runs in the cups. If we want to attract the likes of Timo Werner and Adrien Rabiot, then we should treat the cups seriously.
I like the point about playing all the second stringers together. I disagree with the end part though. The likes of Werner and Rabiot will be attracted to us by our exploits in the Premier League and Champions League, plus other factors like wages, size of club, manager, profile, fit for career, etc. Our performance in the FA Cup and League Cup will barely register. I feel a bit dirty for saying it like that, but it's honestly what I think. It won't factor into it for the likes of Werner and Rabiot.
 

jaffod

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Don't you just hate it when we have just last two games on the trot and it's days until the next game?

I suppose the other downer is that we then have a couple of blank weekends to come up but they do have a silver lining. The weekend of the 26th gives a nice breather between Palace and Leicester both at home. That could be seen as a mini Winter break. The next weekend is 16th February which falls between Bayern at home and Manchester United away which could be very useful.

Anyway, how long until the pre-match thread for the Brighton game goes up?
Bayern is after the 16th, so we have 10 days leading up to Bayern and then play Utd on the Sunday. The mancs have a blank midweek before we play them, just their fucking luck, it never seems to fall in our favour.
 

Irishanfield

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I agree about their first goal Milner was impeded but VAR ruled it ok But guess who was in charge of VAR the same Manchester ref that took charge in the match against Shitty just saying?
I feel a conspiracy coming on:think:
 

Red over the water

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Completely agree that Klopp needs to stay, I think there’s a lot of people on here me included that wouldn’t want to leave even if we where trophyless in 2/3 seasons. He’s the perfect fit for the club, but to be honest we do need trophies.

I wouldn’t agree that where regulars at the top of the table though, 8th & two 4ths in the last 3 seasons. BR brought us a second & then the year after we where terrible.

One other thing from me because I’ve gone on about trophies abit to much since last night. If we do win the PL this year as fans are we going to start expecting us to fight on every front? Surely we cant be a club that only challenges for one trophy seriously each season. The big boys challenge everywhere, city get into finals & win as well as winning the league. Madrid win the CL & they win league. Same with the likes of Barcelona, juve etc etc. I understand JKs building, so hopefully that’s his aim with us.
8th (while Klopp looked under the 'hood' or bonnet and took us to the Europa final) then 4th and 4th, and I fully expect qualification for the CL the third year on the spin, and I don't think we've done that in years. So that's what I mean by we're now regulars at the top table.

Anyway, it's a small point! I do agree we need to win a trophy soon, and hopefully it will come.
 

Red over the water

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I think some supporters need to make their minds up ....... what is the priority? One minute its the EPL. The next minute its Old Big Ears. Then its winning a trophy ........ any trophy!

For me its the EPL. The ECL would be an acceptable alternative. I’m sticking with that!
1. Premier League
2. Champions League
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3. FA Cup
4. League Cup


Edit:
And the tension is that if we are going to keep on falling short season after season, we shouldn't be turning our noses up at priority 3 and 4. I think for Klopp though he has in mind prizes 1 and 2, and that's what he's trying to do. He wants to win 3 and 4 if possible, but he will rotate heavily, and if we come up against strong opposition early doors, like this season in both cup comps, we may go out early. He won't go full blast for 3 and 4 when he feels like he has a chance for 1 or 2, so the inquest/discussion/debate will continue!
 

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Mascot88

Yours for £1m. Need to make room for Dean Saunders
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1. Premier League
2. Champions League
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3. FA Cup
4. League Cup


Edit:
And the tension is that if we are going to keep on falling short season after season, we shouldn't be turning our noses up at priority 3 and 4. I think for Klopp though he has in mind prizes 1 and 2, and that's what he's trying to do. He wants to win 3 and 4 if possible, but he will rotate heavily, and if we come up against strong opposition early doors, like this season in both cup comps, we may go out early. He won't go full blast for 3 and 4 when he feels like he has a chance for 1 or 2, so the inquest/discussion/debate will continue!
How seriously we take the cups is always going to depend on the draw to some degree.

If we can get some decent teams early on, and get through resting players, then those competitions can suddenly start looking like taking seriously. By when you get Chelsea and Wolves respectively, you have to think ‘fuck it’, roll the dice and not worry if you get knocked out.

Wolves are the worst opponents to get, because they are absolutely safe in the league, yet have little else to play for. I thought we’d get knocked out as soon as we drew them.
 

redbj

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Shameful. Real fans have travelled to the Midlands on a Monday night in January,
at not inconsiderable expense and some inconvenience. They deserved better.
The FA Cup and the history and traditions of Liverpool Football Club deserve better.
I hit like on this as I agree with your point regarding paying fans.......however....as a caveat.......I don’t think the away support were under any false pretence that LFC would put out our strongest 11.

I didn’t see the game, so if you are not talking about team selection, but additude, then your point is solid.
 

Mascot88

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I hit like on this as I agree with your point regarding paying fans.......however....as a caveat.......I don’t think the away support were under any false pretence that LFC would put out our strongest 11.

I didn’t see the game, so if you are not talking about team selection, but additude, then your point is solid.
I they want us to play the best eleven and risk our league campaign, purely because they chose to go, then they aren’t real fans.

As it is, I think you’re right that no-one was in any doubt Klopp would be resting loads.
 

liver1

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I think some supporters need to make their minds up ....... what is the priority? One minute its the EPL. The next minute its Old Big Ears. Then its winning a trophy ........ any trophy!

For me its the EPL. The ECL would be an acceptable alternative. I’m sticking with that!
Only the Premier League matters for me.

I would gladly sack off the CL right now if you could guarantee it would be worth an extra 3-4 points in the league.

We are top of the league by 4 points. We havent won the league for 29 years. This is the best chance weve ever had. We will always have chances to win the FA Cup or CL in other years (weve reached the champions league final 3 times in our last 9 attempts, and have got nothing to prove in terms of European credentials).

If we somehow win the league this year it will send the club to another level once again. Even manu fans know this and have said its their worst nightmare as it will put the genie out of the bottle.
 

Red Eyes

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Every time the camera flicked onto those three unhappy looking reds in the crowd last night, I felt so sorry for them.

Nobody can argue against the logic that many posters had before last night match, as it was mirrored by Klopps team sheet i.e

- the EPL is our over-riding priority
- give the reserves a run out
- rest all our big guns
- hope we don’t draw, and
- bow out of the FA cup, as it’s our third priority.

However........

What incentive is there for any fan to go to watch Liverpool play away in either the FA cup or Carabou cup when we are competitative in the league?

It’s true that all top clubs rotate, but last night was one of the most extreme cases I’ve ever seen. I would have been furious if I’d paid up for tickets, travelled to Wolves with my boy who had school the next day, stood in the cold, and watched 11 men trying to pass the ball to what looked like complete strangers.

There was no Liverpool DNA in that performance, it was absolutely embarrassing as per 90% of the scrolling comments on here during the game.

On the plus side Fabinho looked good as CB and we will need him with Lovren / Gomez out, and VVD suspended for Bayern. Yes we do have a good 16 year old, and credit to him. However he is a player for the 2020 / 2021 season probably.

The negatives were pretty much everyone else. How people can post on here saying that they have absolutely no concern about Keita I will never know. He is an expensive question mark at the moment. As for the majority of the rest that played last night, how many are good enough for Liverpool....add into that Llana and untrustable Lovren (injury liability) who didn’t play.

Last night we told Man City that we are so so vulnerable if injuries begin to mount up.

We’ve got a strong side available for Brighton, but we have also lost some momentum. At the margin there is tiny bit more pressure on the boys to perform now. Maybe that’s a good thing, but whichever way you slice it last night was fucking awful
 

Commando

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Every time the camera flicked onto those three unhappy looking reds in the crowd last night, I felt so sorry for them.

Nobody can argue against the logic that many posters had before last night match, as it was mirrored by Klopps team sheet i.e

- the EPL is our over-riding priority
- give the reserves a run out
- rest all our big guns
- hope we don’t draw, and
- bow out of the FA cup, as it’s our third priority.

However........

What incentive is there for any fan to go to watch Liverpool play away in either the FA cup or Carabou cup when we are competitative in the league?

It’s true that all top clubs rotate, but last night was one of the most extreme cases I’ve ever seen. I would have been furious if I’d paid up for tickets, travelled to Wolves with my boy who had school the next day, stood in the cold, and watched 11 men trying to pass the ball to what looked like complete strangers.

There was no Liverpool DNA in that performance, it was absolutely embarrassing as per 90% of the scrolling comments on here during the game.

On the plus side Fabinho looked good as CB and we will need him with Lovren / Gomez out, and VVD suspended for Bayern. Yes we do have a good 16 year old, and credit to him. However he is a player for the 2020 / 2021 season probably.

The negatives were pretty much everyone else. How people can post on here saying that they have absolutely no concern about Keita I will never know. He is an expensive question mark at the moment. As for the majority of the rest that played last night, how many are good enough for Liverpool....add into that Llana and untrustable Lovren (injury liability) who didn’t play.

Last night we told Man City that we are so so vulnerable if injuries begin to mount up.

We’ve got a strong side available for Brighton, but we have also lost some momentum. At the margin there is tiny bit more pressure on the boys to perform now. Maybe that’s a good thing, but whichever way you slice it last night was fucking awful
If injuries mount up for us then there's nothing Man City can do about it. We don't play them again in the league this season. They're not going to try any less or any harder in their own games depending on who we have injured at any specific time.
 



Limiescouse

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I they want us to play the best eleven and risk our league campaign, purely because they chose to go, then they aren’t real fans.

As it is, I think you’re right that no-one was in any doubt Klopp would be resting loads.
I know a lad who went. He is over the moon that he can tell his kids that he saw Whomever's (Dutch kid) debut.
 

Red Eyes

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If injuries mount up for us then there's nothing Man City can do about it. We don't play them again in the league this season. They're not going to try any less or any harder in their own games depending on who we have injured at any specific time.
True......but if you think your opponent might blink soon, it’s easier to hold your own stare a bit longer than you would normally. All fine margins admittedly
 

steveee

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Depth? Once Lovren went off the only fit centre back we had was Virgil who was being rested. That’s 3 out of our 4 senior centre backs out injured. That’s not down to a lack of depth.

I agree with the rest of your post though! :well done:






SLAP ......... DOWN .......... !
yeah.. people going on about us not having squad depth after this game is ridiculous. there is only team in the league that has more squad depth than we do. one... we have in form players like Shaq and Fab who are on our bench at times a lot this season already. the team Klopp put out there yesterday was not about a lack of squad depth... he chose not to care for that match as much as he does the others obviously. He could of played VVD as VVD said he clearly doesn't need any rest but he chose to not risk him. but yeah we have 2 cbs in matip and Gomez coming back anytime now. We also will have ox coming back at some point before seasons end. we will continue to have a problem where we have good in form players who are sitting on our bench the rest of this season which speaks to how much squad depth we really have...

At the end of the day, yesterday we started with mignolet, lovren, Fabinho, Moreno, Milner, keita, Shaqiri, sturridge and origi. That’s a strong 9 players. The question I would ask is why so many of them were poor
well that's obvious why they were so poor.. how many times has that exact team ever played together? probably never even once in training even. You can't just expect to make that many changes in a side and expect to get good results no matter how good the players are.. football doesn't work like that. You could create a team of all stars around the world who never played together.. and they will get beat most every time when facing any good or solid team that has played a lot together under one coaches tactics and formations


that's why it's funny to see all these people complaining about our lack of squad depth after this game now.... when reality is our squad depth is very strong and the strongest it's ever been in the last decade and also stronger than every team in the league except for one
 
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Commando

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I know a lad who went. He is over the moon that he can tell his kids that he saw Whomever's (Dutch kid) debut.
I went to the game. I've got no problems with the team selected. I said earlier that i was disappointed with the team selected and would have liked a tad stronger starting eleven. as I've said in countless pre match threads. Jurgen sees these players daily and knows what they're capable of. he had faith in the boys to prevail. it just wasn't to be unfortunately.
 

Rambler

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Only the Premier League matters for me.

I would gladly sack off the CL right now if you could guarantee it would be worth an extra 3-4 points in the league.

We are top of the league by 4 points. We havent won the league for 29 years. This is the best chance weve ever had. We will always have chances to win the FA Cup or CL in other years (weve reached the champions league final 3 times in our last 9 attempts, and have got nothing to prove in terms of European credentials).

If we somehow win the league this year it will send the club to another level once again. Even manu fans know this and have said its their worst nightmare as it will put the genie out of the bottle.
Was that you on Radio Merseyside last night saying we should play the kids against Bayern?