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Should we cheat (within reason) if that’s what it takes to win the league ?

Should we cheat to win the league ?

  • Yes hack the big fucker down

    Votes: 35 72.9%
  • No, playing by the rules matters more

    Votes: 13 27.1%

  • Total voters
    48

epsomred

Give yourselves the chance to be heros
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937
Cheating implies getting away with it.

If our player got a red card due to bringing a man down one on one, then it's not cheating because he, and the team, got duly punished. End of story.

Every single team that has won the league has had a bit of nastiness to them. Look at Arsenal once they lost Viera etc, they're pathetic.

We're finally on course to lift this cunt after 30 years, I for one won't be sitting here moping about if we aren't 'gentlemanly' at the end of it. We didn't win WWII by fighting fair did we...

Moot point at the end of the day, because it's not like Klopp is a manager who sets his team up to be as cunty as possible, like Mourinho.
I like how you used “cunty” as an adjective. Not seen that before. Made me laugh out loud and spit my tea.
 


Perth Red

Rolling with crocs in Darwin
Joined
Aug 30, 2010
Messages
377
The old adage that "cheats never prosper" has been clearly smashed apart, not just by City but look at the current resident of the White House! It's what you can get away with wins these days, apparently.
I am old school and I never played the game with the thought that cheating was appropriate at any stage. Clearly I am old fashioned (or just old!)
 

Libero

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Joined
Feb 24, 2003
Messages
4,447
At the risk of sounding like a pompous wanker, I think that in football and life in general, how you behave on the journey is maybe more important than the destination.
How someone behaves on the football field is very different to how that same person may behave off the field. There's a fine line to cross once a player enters the pitch, it doesn't always mean that's what they are like off it. I can understand where you are coming from with your point above but believe you can't fully compare the two.
 

Quicksand

Looking for Clues...
Joined
Nov 16, 2016
Messages
817
The old adage that "cheats never prosper" has been clearly smashed apart, not just by City but look at the current resident of the White House! It's what you can get away with wins these days, apparently.
I am old school and I never played the game with the thought that cheating was appropriate at any stage. Clearly I am old fashioned (or just old!)
The debate really shouldn't be about cheating. There is no defending cheating.
But my view is the odd tactical or professional foul, where you accept the consequences isnt cheating. Its part of life, as @Dane said earlier.... akin to the few minutes free parking or the odd driving over the speed limit. You do it knowing the consequences, and its not a major crime.
 

Dane

NEXT!
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6,592
The debate really shouldn't be about cheating. There is no defending cheating.
But my view is the odd tactical or professional foul, where you accept the consequences isnt cheating. Its part of life, as @Dane said earlier.... akin to the few minutes free parking or the odd driving over the speed limit. You do it knowing the consequences, and its not a major crime.
Exactly right.
I'll bet no-one on here pops into their local police station and says, "Excuse me officer, I was travelling at 20 mph over the speed limit on my way home from work, can you take the appropriate action please"

Speeding is a deliberate act of law breaking, similar to a professional foul on the football pitch.

People outraged/ashamed/disappointed at the thought of one of our players taking a yellow for the team, will for sure have driven over the speed limit or conducted some other minor act of dishonesty.

At least be consistent in your lives, you cant frown upon one and perform another.
 
Last edited:



Commando

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Exactly right.
I'll bet no-one on here pops into their local police station and says, "Excuse me officer, I was travelling at 20 mph over the speed limit on my way home from work, can you take the appropriate action please"

Speeding is a deliberate act of law breaking, similar to a professional foul on the football pitch.

People outraged/ashamed/disappointed at the thought of one of our players taking a yellow for the team, will for sure have driven over the speed limit or conducted some other minor act of dishonesty.

At least be consistent. In your lives, you cant frown upon one and perform another.
You nicked that off Jesus. ;)
 

epsomred

Give yourselves the chance to be heros
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Exactly right.
I'll bet no-one on here pops into their local police station and says, "Excuse me officer, I was travelling at 20 mph over the speed limit on my way home from work, can you take the appropriate action please"

Speeding is a deliberate act of law breaking, similar to a professional foul on the football pitch.

People outraged/ashamed/disappointed at the thought of one of our players taking a yellow for the team, will for sure have driven over the speed limit or conducted some other minor act of dishonesty.

At least be consistent in your lives, you cant frown upon one and perform another.
Yes but are you saying that we should also apply that consistency to how we regard Man Cit ? That’s my point.
 

LFCFFC

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Jul 19, 2016
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1,503
Late to the party here, but I'm agreeing with the notion that a foul is simply not cheating. I'd be ethically content if a last ditch Dejan tackle was the reason we lifted the PL.

Now, if we then decided to bankroll the club through shady business dealings with Middle Eastern oil sheikhs who prioritize profit at the cost of an immense amount of human suffering..then I might start to have a few moral dilemmas over cheating.

Not that it's ever happened of course.
 



Scott Jones

Blunt
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Mar 8, 2016
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15,577
If only the cheating on the pitch was all citeh got away with then it'd be similar to utd getting away with it and getting the odd jammy penalty it'd be irritating but not disturbing,the cheating of FFP off the field is very disturbing and the punishment is a fucking joke,the governing bodies are as guilty as citeh,wankers.
 

epsomred

Give yourselves the chance to be heros
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Seems to be 4 schools of thought then;

1. Winning the league by committing a professional foul in the last minute would be unethical and massively taint the achievement. Lfc don’t behave that way and this is to be cherished. That’s the view of a minority of us.

2. Fouling in the heat of the match moment is part of the game and the available sanctions are adequate. If in the example in the OP Lovren got sent off and we won the league all good. Those of us who adhere to 1 are naive or have not actually played the game.

3. What city do to stop breakaways goes above and beyond 2 becuase it’s coached and systematic. However it’s the fault of the refs for not clamping down on them and if we did the same that would be ok, do what is needed to win etc.

4. City are a bunch of cheating wankers generally and this is just another manifestation. Not ok and no comparison to 2 or 3

Not sure that logically 4 makes any sense but I can see 2 and 3. That said I would rather we won it on merit rather than resorting to fouls.

This will all be academic of course when we suffer our normal mid season collapse and unexpectedly lose 4 games in a row to piss away the lead and are desperately playing catch up in April only to fall a couple of points short . Hopefully not this year though but you read it here first if we do.
 

Quicksand

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Why does everything have to be compartmentalised?
And wounded? (see end of Option 2)
 

CymruRed

TIA Youth Team
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Seems to be 4 schools of thought then;

1. Winning the league by committing a professional foul in the last minute would be unethical and massively taint the achievement. Lfc don’t behave that way and this is to be cherished. That’s the view of a minority of us.

2. Fouling in the heat of the match moment is part of the game and the available sanctions are adequate. If in the example in the OP Lovren got sent off and we won the league all good. Those of us who adhere to 1 are naive or have not actually played the game.

3. What city do to stop breakaways goes above and beyond 2 becuase it’s coached and systematic. However it’s the fault of the refs for not clamping down on them and if we did the same that would be ok, do what is needed to win etc.

4. City are a bunch of cheating wankers generally and this is just another manifestation. Not ok and no comparison to 2 or 3

Not sure that logically 4 makes any sense but I can see 2 and 3. That said I would rather we won it on merit rather than resorting to fouls.

This will all be academic of course when we suffer our normal mid season collapse and unexpectedly lose 4 games in a row to piss away the lead and are desperately playing catch up in April only to fall a couple of points short . Hopefully not this year though but you read it here first if we do.

In general,it's not in our team's DNA to go out and cheat,if the example of the OP did happen,it would be one of a very few (if any) occasions you would see us doing it throughout the season.

When you now have Man City players coming out saying they are being trained to do it and do it in every game,if you're of the opinion that,that kind of behaviour is cheating,by doing it once (which wins us the title) would you seriously consider us cheats/cunts like them on that one off occasion,when they've been doing it solidly for atleast the past 2 years to win their last 2 titles?
 



JibJab

Mo Mane Mo' Problems
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May 24, 2016
Messages
817
I don't consider that first situation to be cheating. I mean, Fabinho has taken all sorts of strategic fouls and yellows throughout his tenure to stop a counter. I think that's smart.

Even extending it to a red - ala Suarez in the World Cup - is fine with me. The only line I draw is to purposefully injure an opposing player. Otherwise, the rules mandate certain consequences for certain actions. If the rewards outweigh the consequences, then it makes sense to choose the reward.
 

JustHitMyHead

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There is nothing unethical about making a professional foul. It's a strategy and part of the game and no one is trying to get away with or hood-wink anyone.

I think the key difference between cheating and what I consider strategy is that there is no deception and there is no malicious intent.

Unless you think deciding to return the DVD late (I know I'm showing my age) and paying the late penalty is unethical too. Or perhaps you might think, hoofing the ball up the pitch to waste time at the end is cheating too?
 

Incognito

The Normal One
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Jan 6, 2011
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2,698
You don’t get a yellow card for hoofing the ball away, as it is not against the rules.

Fouling, by definition, is.
But by that logic you shouldn't tackle as you may end up fouling. Neither tackling to stop an attack nor hoofing the ball up is regarded as cheating. The debate is ethics and tainting our PL win in that hypothetical scenario. If one off last ditch professional foul taints a PL victory, so does hoofing the ball as you are wasting time which is not fair.
 



rockafella

Registered before you did
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Feb 1, 2004
Messages
841
Oppo fans will always think we cheat anyway.

I'd rather have everyone moaning about Mane's theatrical fall against Leicester whilst we're celebrating yet another win, then everyone laughing at us for drawing (yes - the day Liverpool finally draw a game there will be celebrations across the country and infinite "bottled it" comments across Twitter).

Do City have any real repercussions from the financial doping/human rights issues? No. Everyone just complains about them whilst they're busy celebrating trophy wins.
 

redalways

TIA Regular
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Feb 1, 2008
Messages
2,316
I don't understand the things about fouling anyway. The rules are written as they are, and taking advantage of them, knowing the result, is hardly as bad as deliberately twisting and bending them out of shape. Even with City I'm a little reluctant to condemn them, because they are indeed playing by the same rules as everyone else, it's just that said rules and sanctions are insufficient. It might suck as a football fan, but they're literally just playing the game...