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The Unreliable Rumours Thread

Walshy07

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Klopp basically saying Kent needs to leave to get game time at his age. Don't know if it was only him he was referring to or Wilson as well.

“The time is over, I think, for loans, because of his age. The players need to find a place where they can settle. A loan is not an option.”
Still think both Kent and Wilson go before window closes.
 


legalalien

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I can't imagine selling both Kent and Wilson and not buying a replacement other than a 16 year old. Having watched the post match presser, it seems to me that Jurgen was referring specifically to Kent and not Wilson when he said that the time for loans is over. Given the way he was speaking it looks like Kent will be gone and Wilson will get a chance to stake his claim.

This may be my imagination but when he was talking to the club PR guy about Kent's absence, I got the impression that there was something Jurgen thought it best not to say publicly. Of course it's always best not to reveal any details of a player's personal life, but I did get the impression that "illness" was a euphemism here.
 

Jaytinho

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I would prefer to have Ounas rather than Pepe
Im inclined to agree, I remember this cameo he made for Algeria in the AFCON against Ivory Coast in the QF's. He came on for Mahrez and immediately Algeria looked dangerous in the final 3rd. His ball control is insane
 

legalalien

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Im inclined to agree, I remember this cameo he made for Algeria in the AFCON against Ivory Coast in the QF's. He came on for Mahrez and immediately Algeria looked dangerous in the final 3rd. His ball control is insane
I take it that you and @FGred mean Adam Ounas of Napoli? Do you either of you know why he wasn't involved in the game in Edinburgh?

Not that I'm trying to stir up a rumour here. No, no, no. I wouldn't do that. Anyway, Calciomercato reckon that Sevilla are interested in him.
 

Jaytinho

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I take it that you and @FGred mean Adam Ounas of Napoli? Do you either of you know why he wasn't involved in the game in Edinburgh?

Not that I'm trying to stir up a rumour here. No, no, no. I wouldn't do that. Anyway, Calciomercato reckon that Sevilla are interested in him.
Same one!
 



redfanman

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Guys, I love Klopp, but, are these quotes not annoying? Like, he really does not need to say shit like this I prefer it when we move in silence, this bills talk was unnecessary. And talking about other teams compared to Liverpool? Since when does Klopp do that? Na Jurgen, chill

'We have to pay bills' - Klopp not jealous of 'fantasia land' spending from rivals
I think he was perfectly correct in what he said, and in choosing to say. No matter what the club do, there are fans always demanding we spend big and there are always journalists asking him about it.
 

Jaytinho

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I think he was perfectly correct in what he said, and in choosing to say. No matter what the club do, there are fans always demanding we spend big and there are always journalists asking him about it.
I know these are deflective answers, they just seem unnecessary lol It was cool when he gave vague answers to the press before
 

mattyhurst

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Seriously can't let Wilson go in my view, we'd be one down on last season up top for starters, it's also half the reason we haven't bought so we can bring these lads through isn't it?

Kent in my view isn't good enough, so not too worried but Wilson is a player who could be vital, after all bringing his pace on towards the end of the match could be dangerous, I don't want to hinder Brewster but him and Elliott still have time, Wilson is of this moment, plus he has a more dangerous free kick than our current crop.

If he goes then we must buy, but if he is staying then I am comfortable.
 
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FGred

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I take it that you and @FGred mean Adam Ounas of Napoli? Do you either of you know why he wasn't involved in the game in Edinburgh?

Not that I'm trying to stir up a rumour here. No, no, no. I wouldn't do that. Anyway, Calciomercato reckon that Sevilla are interested in him.
Yes one and the same but what confused me was that they played a Younès is that the same person I wonder?
 



Kopstar

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Seriously can't let Wilson go in my view, we'd be one down on last season up top for starters, it's also half the reason we haven't bought so we can bring these lads through isn't it?

Kent in my view isn't good enough, so not too worried but Wilson is a player who could be vital, after all bringing his pace on towards the end of the match could be dangerous, I don't want to hinder Brewster but him and Elliott still have time, Wilson is of this moment, plus he has a more dangerous free kick than our current crop.

If he goes then we must buy, but if he is staying then I am comfortable.
How? Even if we did let Wilson go we didn't have him available last season anyway? The only person up front we've lost from last season is Sturridge but we've 'gained' Brewster so even if we sell Wilson and Kent and ignoring Elliott and AOC, we've got the same numbers up front as we had last year, haven't we?
 

mattyhurst

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How? Even if we did let Wilson go we didn't have him available last season anyway? The only person up front we've lost from last season is Sturridge but we've 'gained' Brewster so even if we sell Wilson and Kent and ignoring Elliott and AOC, we've got the same numbers up front as we had last year, haven't we?
Brewster won't be first team (He has played less than Wilson and I don't buy shop window rubbish), and I am ignoring Elliott, the lads 16 for god sake and Klopp has already suggested he may get a loan spell.

Ox in my view is a central AM, so back to my original point, we are one down from last year which frankly was a bit risky, considering these three haven't had a rest that's even more so this season.
 

redfanman

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Brewster won't be first team (He has played less than Wilson and I don't buy shop window rubbish), and I am ignoring Elliott, the lads 16 for god sake and Klopp has already suggested he may get a loan spell.

Ox in my view is a central AM, so back to my original point, we are one down from last year which frankly was a bit risky, considering these three haven't had a rest that's even more so this season.
Brewster has played less because he is still facing the effects of the first team training schedule and Klopp is being careful with him. He definitely is first team.
 

Richard88

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Brewster won't be first team (He has played less than Wilson and I don't buy shop window rubbish), and I am ignoring Elliott, the lads 16 for god sake and Klopp has already suggested he may get a loan spell.

Ox in my view is a central AM, so back to my original point, we are one down from last year which frankly was a bit risky, considering these three haven't had a rest that's even more so this season.
Where has Klopp suggested that? It doesn't sound at all like something he'd say.

I'd expect Elliott to stay at Melwood and train with the first team this season while playing with the u23's. Maybe getting a game in the league cup similar to Hoever last season.
 



Anfield rd Dreamer

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Last year we had Salah, Mane, Firmino, Origi, Sturridge and Brewster as our attack with Brewster spending most (not all) of the season injured.

So far this season we will seemingly have Salah, Mane, Firmino, Origi and Brewster with no way of predicting how many injuries that group of players will pick up.

Unless we list Elliot as a replacement for Sturridge or keep one of Wilson or Kent we are a man down before injuries. We can't know nobody will get injured next season. Especially Brewster who is only just coming back from an injury.
 

Jaytinho

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Brewster won't be first team (He has played less than Wilson and I don't buy shop window rubbish), and I am ignoring Elliott, the lads 16 for god sake and Klopp has already suggested he may get a loan spell.

Ox in my view is a central AM, so back to my original point, we are one down from last year which frankly was a bit risky, considering these three haven't had a rest that's even more so this season.
Brewster definitely first team. Everything is setup for him to have a break out season
 

Mascot88

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Last year we had Salah, Mane, Firmino, Origi, Sturridge and Brewster as our attack with Brewster spending most (not all) of the season injured.

So far this season we will seemingly have Salah, Mane, Firmino, Origi and Brewster with no way of predicting how many injuries that group of players will pick up.

Unless we list Elliot as a replacement for Sturridge or keep one of Wilson or Kent we are a man down before injuries. We can't know nobody will get injured next season. Especially Brewster who is only just coming back from an injury.
Hang on, this doesn’t make any sense.

Last year we had Firmino, Salah, Mane, Origi and Sturridge. You can’t include Brewster. He was injured and didn’t play a single minute.

This year we have Firmino, Salah, Mane, Origi and Brewster.

Brewster essentially replaces Danny. We can have a conversation about whether that’s a drop in quality or not, but we can’t say it’s a reduction in numbers.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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Hang on, this doesn’t make any sense.

Last year we had Firmino, Salah, Mane, Origi and Sturridge. You can’t include Brewster. He was injured and didn’t play a single minute.

This year we have Firmino, Salah, Mane, Origi and Brewster.

Brewster essentially replaces Danny. We can have a conversation about whether that’s a drop in quality or not, but we can’t say it’s a reduction in numbers.
No he doesn't. Brewster was in the squad last year, he was even on the bench twice and could have been brought on as a substitute. He was one of our players last season just one of our forwards missed nearly the whole season injured. Just like one may this season. Or two may miss half a season each. Or three may miss a seasons worth of football between them or hundred other combinations. We had 6 attackers. We have 5. We are 1 down. We have zero way of predicting we will be as good, better or worse on the injury front just because we know what happened last season.
 

GermanRed

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Brewster will score more than Sturridges 4 goals and 2 assists

Moreno: 4 starts last season - that's nothing. Won't be difficult for Larouci to be an more important player for us.

Clyne wasn't here last season - won't be here this season. No loss. Hoever will be our clear second choice RB by the end of the year.

Ox missed the whole season -> new signing.

Lallana, Lovren, Matip, Gomez, Keita, Shaqiri, Origi, Fabinho - all of them missed more or less half of last season for different reasons. That's unused potential in quality and quantity.

We have van den Berg, Larouci, Hoever, Elliott, Wilson as a bonus.
 



Richard88

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No he doesn't. Brewster was in the squad last year, he was even on the bench twice and could have been brought on as a substitute. He was one of our players last season just one of our forwards missed nearly the whole season injured. Just like one may this season. Or two may miss half a season each. Or three may miss a seasons worth of football between them or hundred other combinations. We had 6 attackers. We have 5. We are 1 down. We have zero way of predicting we will be as good, better or worse on the injury front just because we know what happened last season.
One has to consider the situation in terms on on-pitch minutes.

Sturridge 18/19:
  • PL: 18 GP.... 496mins.... 2 goals + 1 assist
  • CL: 7 GP...... 162mins.... 1 goal + 1 assist
  • FA: 1 GP...... 70mins
  • LC: 1 GP...... 90mins...... 1 goal
  • TOTAL: 27 GP.... 818mins...... 4 goals + 2 assists
That's an average of 30.3 mins per appearance, with a goal or assist every 136 mins.

Now, consider that Origi and Brewster:

Origi 18/19:
  • PL: 12 GP..... 366mins........ 3 goals + 1 assist
  • CL: 8 GP...... 217mins......... 3 goals
  • FA: 1 GP...... 90mins........... 1 goal
  • TOTAL: 21 GP... 673mins.... 7 goals + 1 assist
That's an average 32 mins per appearance, and a goal or assist every 84.1 mins.

Brewster 18/19:
  • 0 mins in all first-team games.
  • On the bench in matchday 34 against Palace (H); and against Barcelona (H) and Spurs in the CL.
Looking at those statistics, I think it's fairly clear that Sturridge's 818mins are easily replaceable between Origi and Brewster. Origi's scoring rate last season was also better than Sturridge's.

Granted, we will have at least 3 more fixtures this season due to the Uefa Super Cup and Club World Cup, and likely more if we go further in the cups. But Origi and Brewster should feature far more than their combined 673mins last season.

So all-in-all, purely in terms of on-pitch minutes and statistics it's clear that the options up front aren't worse than last year.
 

Kopstar

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No he doesn't. Brewster was in the squad last year, he was even on the bench twice and could have been brought on as a substitute. He was one of our players last season just one of our forwards missed nearly the whole season injured. Just like one may this season. Or two may miss half a season each. Or three may miss a seasons worth of football between them or hundred other combinations. We had 6 attackers. We have 5. We are 1 down. We have zero way of predicting we will be as good, better or worse on the injury front just because we know what happened last season.
Sorry, but that's just ridiculous. He was on the bench for the very last two champions league games. You know, the 2nd leg against Barcelona where we didn't have Firmino or Salah where we can name 7 substitutes. He then made the bench for the final where we can name 12 substitutes. He was very much being eased back and had only played 2 games for the Under 23s in April. It's ridiculous to count him as part of our first team forward options for last year.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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Posters talking about the amount of injuries we had last season but not spotting the irony of saying we will be stronger next season because they are ignoring the chances of injuries to those players or other players who weren't injured last year. I really hope things land our way with luck on the injury front but by not bringing in senior players we are not maximising our chances of a successful season. Last season if Robertson got a six month lay off Moreno would have come in majority of games with Milner, Gomez and academy kids as alternatives or rotation options. We didn't need that so Moreno didn't play much. We haven't gained anything at left back but have lost Moreno. We might be fine again and Robertson may not have a period out again but if he does we are less equipped to deal with it than we were last year. We are weaker. It might not matter. But a lot are being really fucking horrible to anyone with the audacity to say that at the moment on here. It's like unless you're 100% positive about everything at all times your opinions aren't welcome on here at the moment.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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One has to consider the situation in terms on on-pitch minutes.

Sturridge 18/19:
  • PL: 18 GP.... 496mins.... 2 goals + 1 assist
  • CL: 7 GP...... 162mins.... 1 goal + 1 assist
  • FA: 1 GP...... 70mins
  • LC: 1 GP...... 90mins...... 1 goal
  • TOTAL: 27 GP.... 818mins...... 4 goals + 2 assists
That's an average of 30.3 mins per appearance, with a goal or assist every 136 mins.

Now, consider that Origi and Brewster:

Origi 18/19:
  • PL: 12 GP..... 366mins........ 3 goals + 1 assist
  • CL: 8 GP...... 217mins......... 3 goals
  • FA: 1 GP...... 90mins........... 1 goal
  • TOTAL: 21 GP... 673mins.... 7 goals + 1 assist
That's an average 32 mins per appearance, and a goal or assist every 84.1 mins.

Brewster 18/19:
  • 0 mins in all first-team games.
  • On the bench in matchday 34 against Palace (H); and against Barcelona (H) and Spurs in the CL.
Looking at those statistics, I think it's fairly clear that Sturridge's 818mins are easily replaceable between Origi and Brewster. Origi's scoring rate last season was also better than Sturridge's.

Granted, we will have at least 3 more fixtures this season due to the Uefa Super Cup and Club World Cup, and likely more if we go further in the cups. But Origi and Brewster should feature far more than their combined 673mins last season.

So all-in-all, purely in terms of on-pitch minutes and statistics it's clear that the options up front aren't worse than last year.
@Kopstar

I was only responding to the claims we aren't a man down. We are. We can't predict that Brewster or someone else won't be as injured next season as Brewster was this season. He was a Liverpool player then he is a Liverpool player now.

Do I think we need another CF option? No actually I don't I think we need a left forward option. We needed one last season which is why Keita got shifted out there a lot and why some of Origis game time was out there. But at CF I think Firmino, Mane, Salah, Origi and Brewster is enough depth. I don't think it's enough depth for the front 3 though (even if you add Shaqiri too).
 

Kopstar

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Posters talking about the amount of injuries we had last season but not spotting the irony of saying we will be stronger next season because they are ignoring the chances of injuries to those players or other players who weren't injured last year. I really hope things land our way with luck on the injury front but by not bringing in senior players we are not maximising our chances of a successful season. Last season if Robertson got a six month lay off Moreno would have come in majority of games with Milner, Gomez and academy kids as alternatives or rotation options. We didn't need that so Moreno didn't play much. We haven't gained anything at left back but have lost Moreno. We might be fine again and Robertson may not have a period out again but if he does we are less equipped to deal with it than we were last year. We are weaker. It might not matter. But a lot are being really fucking horrible to anyone with the audacity to say that at the moment on here. It's like unless you're 100% positive about everything at all times your opinions aren't welcome on here at the moment.
Except that you're ignoring the players Klopp is looking to utilise this season that he either wasn't looking to utilise last season or were not available to him (for reasons of loan or injury).

Brewster was not a first team option in 17/18. He was a kid playing in the U18s and U23s. He then got injured just at the point Klopp was hoping to get him more involved in the first team set up - he has never played in a competitive game for the first team.

This season Klopp intends to use him for competitive first team fixtures. That is not something that he either intended to or could do prior to this season bar naming him on the bench for two of our last three fixtures last season (the latter only because we could name 12 substitutes).
 



Richard88

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Posters talking about the amount of injuries we had last season but not spotting the irony of saying we will be stronger next season because they are ignoring the chances of injuries to those players or other players who weren't injured last year. I really hope things land our way with luck on the injury front but by not bringing in senior players we are not maximising our chances of a successful season. Last season if Robertson got a six month lay off Moreno would have come in majority of games with Milner, Gomez and academy kids as alternatives or rotation options. We didn't need that so Moreno didn't play much. We haven't gained anything at left back but have lost Moreno. We might be fine again and Robertson may not have a period out again but if he does we are less equipped to deal with it than we were last year. We are weaker. It might not matter. But a lot are being really fucking horrible to anyone with the audacity to say that at the moment on here. It's like unless you're 100% positive about everything at all times your opinions aren't welcome on here at the moment.
I agree that options are a bit worse than last season at LB given that Moreno has left. It would seem that Klopp is satisfied with using Milner as backup LB this season, but I'd really like to see the club sign either an experienced LB (like Klavan) to plug that gap, or to bring in a young understudy for Robertson in the 18-21 range (similar to the Hoever/Gomez/Van den Berg signings for RB and CB). Perhaps Klopp sees Larouci as that young understudy for the long term though, hard to tell.

Btw, regarding my post above I didn't mean to criticise your opinion, but rather I was merely refuting the idea that we are shorter than last season purely in terms of numbers up front. One could argue that we could use another top forward option as there's an apparent drop-off from the front 3. That said, given Origi's scoring rate last season (a goal or assist every 84 mins), along with Brewster's potential, as well as Wilson if he sticks around, I think it's reasonable to go into the season without adding anyone. Had Origi not had the end of season he had then I think we'd certainly have needed an extra forward though. You won't find me complaining if we did sign another forward though, especially a LW as I think we do need to add some depth on the left at some stage.
 

Richard88

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@Kopstar

I was only responding to the claims we aren't a man down. We are. We can't predict that Brewster or someone else won't be as injured next season as Brewster was this season. He was a Liverpool player then he is a Liverpool player now.

Do I think we need another CF option? No actually I don't I think we need a left forward option. We needed one last season which is why Keita got shifted out there a lot and why some of Origis game time was out there. But at CF I think Firmino, Mane, Salah, Origi and Brewster is enough depth. I don't think it's enough depth for the front 3 though (even if you add Shaqiri too).
Sturridge played 818 mins. Origi played 673mins. That's a total of 1491 mins for Origi and Brewster to make up between them this season. Even if one of them got injured, that amount of minutes would still be manageable for one of them to take on.

Note that I'm speaking purely in terms of minutes here. I'm well aware that Brewster has yet to prove himself in the first team, but if Klopp is satisfied with him as an real first team option then there's good reason for that.

As I outlined in my earlier detailed post, I also agree with you that we do need to sign someone to offer another option as a natural LW option - though not necessarily in this window (but ideally by the end of the summer 2020 window). Currently we only really have Mané as a natural LW (assuming Woodburn and Kent are moved on), so that's clearly an area that needs to be shored up going forward.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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Except that you're ignoring the players Klopp is looking to utilise this season that he either wasn't looking to utilise last season or were not available to him (for reasons of loan or injury).

Brewster was not a first team option in 17/18. He was a kid playing in the U18s and U23s. He then got injured just at the point Klopp was hoping to get him more involved in the first team set up - he has never played in a competitive game for the first team.

This season Klopp intends to use him for competitive first team fixtures. That is not something that he either intended to or could do prior to this season bar naming him on the bench for two of our last three fixtures last season (the latter only because we could name 12 substitutes).
You and others are ignoring the fact we can't know, at this stage, who will not be available to Klopp next season. We might well have Brewster "added" but Origi could get injured during the first few games and miss the rest of the season therefore we've had Origi "subtracted"! I don't understand the logic. It's like we are being told you can't list player A due to injury as he was unavailable when we are discussing past depth but you need to list all players as 100% available for next season when discussing future depth. Its almost certainly not going to happen. We had six players in the forward positions last season and lost just over one players combined availability to injury spread out over those 6 players. We now have 5. We can't know we will have better availability on the injury front.
 

Richard88

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You and others are ignoring the fact we can't know, at this stage, who will not be available to Klopp next season. We might well have Brewster "added" but Origi could get injured during the first few games and miss the rest of the season therefore we've had Origi "subtracted"! I don't understand the logic. It's like we are being told you can't list player A due to injury as he was unavailable when we are discussing past depth but you need to list all players as 100% available for next season when discussing future depth. Its almost certainly not going to happen. We had six players in the forward positions last season and lost just over one players combined availability to injury spread out over those 6 players. We now have 5. We can't know we will have better availability on the injury front.
Teams don't operate under the assumption that a player is going to break their leg. Yes, injuries happen, but as stated above even if Origi were to get injured as your example, that's still only 1491 mins left for Brewster/Ox/Keita/Shaqiri/Wilson to take on. Not a problem at all.
 

Incognito

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The depth seems less if we consider we will only play 4-3-3 and we need options for all 3 upfront. However, if I remember correctly we played 4-2-3-1 with Salah upfront in majority of games in initial half of the season. In that case we do have Ox, Keita, Shaqiri, Lallana other than the usual players to play in that '3'. Origi & Brewster will be down the pecking order, if we are not sticking to 4-3-3 and having a fit squad.

Also for the 2 in mid, we would still have Milly, Hendo, Fab and Gini to choose from. With a change in formation, our depth actually doesn't look bad. Once we have the full squad fit, it'll look good IMO.