The Unreliable Rumours Thread

redfanman

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I think if he could stay fit he would be a real asset but agree there comes a point when is lack of availability puts a big question mark over his head.
Has he been unlucky with injuries or is he very injury prone or is his body simply unable to handle the demands of playing for Klopp.
I feeling is he still has a future here but it might well depend on how the next few months go. He needs to get and sustain a decent period of fitness because if he does I think he has the ability to make a contribution between now and the end of the season.
I think Shaq will be sold this summer.
I think Klopps comments about Shaqiri are worth paying attention to. Unlike fans he doesn't see injuries as insurmountable or guarenteed to happen. They are just one more thing to work on
 

ILLOK

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I think Klopps comments about Shaqiri are worth paying attention to. Unlike fans he doesn't see injuries as insurmountable or guarenteed to happen. They are just one more thing to work on
Absolutely, he'll work with players who he thinks are worth it.

I don't think he ignores injuries altogether though. If Shaqiri was as fit as Salah he might have a future here. If he was as good as Salah but injured this often he'd definitely have a future here. The injuries plus the borderline suitability has probably made Klopp's mind up.
 

wibseyred

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I think if he could stay fit he would be a real asset but agree there comes a point when is lack of availability puts a big question mark over his head.
Has he been unlucky with injuries or is he very injury prone or is his body simply unable to handle the demands of playing for Klopp.
I feeling is he still has a future here but it might well depend on how the next few months go. He needs to get and sustain a decent period of fitness because if he does I think he has the ability to make a contribution between now and the end of the season.
I think Shaq will be sold this summer.
The concern is the frequency of injuries and the length of time he misses with them too so far this season hes missed 75 days last season was 89 last season at RB 71. For someone still young it's not the best record.
 

nobluff

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The concern is the frequency of injuries and the length of time he misses with them too so far this season hes missed 75 days last season was 89 last season at RB 71. For someone still young it's not the best record.
Like a "growing pain" type of thing. We had same thing with Gerrard and Henderson when they were younger. They grew out of it. Dont think they were injured this much thou.

Checked records. Henderson, lfc, injured approx 6.5 games a year.
Gerrard, not so much.
 
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Limiescouse

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Like a "growing pain" type of thing. We had same thing with Gerrard and Henderson when they were younger. They grew out of it. Dont think they were injured this much thou.

Checked records. Henderson, lfc, injured approx 6.5 games a year.
Gerrard, not so much.
Gerrard definitely had a ton of problems with his hips and supporting musculature in his teens and early 20s. It reached a point that the club just accepted he couldnt play in 2 games a week, which is one of the reasons Gary Mac's arrival was so important. It's therefore possible that Gerrard's numbers are lower than they should be because many of the games he missed out on in the early 00s are not technically marked down as because of injury.
 

Neukolln

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I am not at all a fan of Danny Rose and his surly demeanor but the report on Sky yesterday that SIX PL teams have contacted Spurs about him had me wondering if we were one of them. With Millie currently being treated in the physio room and Robbo having a bit of a wobble in his form it would be nice to have experienced depth at LB. Rose strikes me as a player that could/would benefit from strong leadership and positive club culture.
 

Mattthecypriot

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I'm confident this is going to end well.
And when we lose mané, salah, keita
If you've been an accident at work, you may be eligible for compensation......
For the first time in a long time marquis signings want liverpool, rather than the other way round, why would we not secure a lagacy on the back of this, plus, mané and salah will be missing for AFCON mid season for the seasons to come now its moved back to january.
 

Not Worthy

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And when we lose mané, salah, keita

For the first time in a long time marquis signings want liverpool, rather than the other way round, why would we not secure a lagacy on the back of this, plus, mané and salah will be missing for AFCON mid season for the seasons to come now its moved back to january.
Because we are not talking FM. And some professionals , employed to manage these situations, may feel that replacing the world's best front 3 with an entirely new front 3 to accommodate a 6 week tournament is not the most considered response.........
 

Mattthecypriot

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Because we are not talking FM. And some professionals , employed to manage these situations, may feel that replacing the world's best front 3 with an entirely new front 3 to accommodate a 6 week tournament is not the most considered response.........
The fact that we are consistently linked with these 3 players appears to demonstrate such consideration, or is this the press talking FM....... YOUR THOUGHTS?
 

mattyhurst

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I am not at all a fan of Danny Rose and his surly demeanor but the report on Sky yesterday that SIX PL teams have contacted Spurs about him had me wondering if we were one of them. With Millie currently being treated in the physio room and Robbo having a bit of a wobble in his form it would be nice to have experienced depth at LB. Rose strikes me as a player that could/would benefit from strong leadership and positive club culture.
I would say Robertson’s drop in form is down to the fact he has played so much.
 

nobluff

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Just checked.
Gerrard definitely had a ton of problems with his hips and supporting musculature in his teens and early 20s. It reached a point that the club just accepted he couldnt play in 2 games a week, which is one of the reasons Gary Mac's arrival was so important. It's therefore possible that Gerrard's numbers are lower than they should be because many of the games he missed out on in the early 00s are not technically marked down as because of injury.
That’s what I remember about Gerrard for sure, I just couldn’t find stats to backup my suspicions, which made me think I was making shit up.
 

wibseyred

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Like a "growing pain" type of thing. We had same thing with Gerrard and Henderson when they were younger. They grew out of it. Dont think they were injured this much thou.

Checked records. Henderson, lfc, injured approx 6.5 games a year.
Gerrard, not so much.
I dont think it is that at all. The 4 seasons leading up to his last at Leipzig he missed 50 days injured plus 35 with malaria which accounted for 10 games. He last season he missed 6 games at Leipzig and hes currently up to 22 missed games for us in less than 2 seasons.
 

Mascot88

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The fact that we are consistently linked with these 3 players appears to demonstrate such consideration, or is this the press talking FM....... YOUR THOUGHTS?
He’s told you his thoughts.

Mine are that selling all three of the best attacking trio in world football - the one that’s enabled us to knock home 92 points from 94 - is such epic stupidity it beggars belief.

Especially as trust and team building are so critically important to Klopp’s way of working. Are the entire midfield thinking they are going to be binned off next? What does that do for team spirit and collectivity?

Like he said, it’s the kind of thing you do on footy manager, not real life.
 
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If Wijnaldum hasn't signed a new contract by this summer (by which time he'll only have 12 months left on his contract) then I think Klopp will want to bring someone in at CM this summer, in order for that new (young) midfielder to have 6-12 months to be eased in and learn the tactics before Wijnaldum (and probably even Milner) moves on in 2021.

Aouar and Havertz are the glamorous names in CM, but I have a sneaky feeling that Emiliano Buendia will be the CM of choice. He ticks all the boxes for a Klopp No.8 given that he's versatile (RW or AM); two-footed; forward-thinking; excellent at chance creation; extremely tenacious off the ball; and at the perfect age (23).

Signing Buendia would also go with Klopps's habit of making opportunistic signings from relegated clubs each summer, following the likes of Wijnaldum from Newcastle in 2016 (£25m); Robertson from Hull 2017 (£8m), Shaqiri from Stoke 2018 (£13m); and Elliott from Fulham 2019 (compensation TBD). Given the likely relegation of Norwich Buendia likely would't cost an extortionate amount either.

For what it's worth I also think the links to LB Jamal Lewis hold some water too, as he'd be a fine player to have as backup LB in the squad, assuming of course that he'd be happier to be a squad player for us rather than play in the Championship.

Overall I can see the club actually making a healthy profit this summer, even if expenditure on new signings goes over £100m.

Out -----------------> In
Karius ........ £7.25m
Lovren ........ £10m --> Ben White ...... ~£35m
Clyne ........... free ----> Jamal Lewis ... ~£10m
Grujic ........... £30m
Chirivella ..... free
Ejaria ............. £5m
Kane .............. £3m
Lallana ......... free ---> Buendia ....... ~£30m
Shaqiri ........ £25m --> Minamino ... £7.5m
Wilson ........ £30m
Ojo ............... £5m
Origi ............ £30m --> Werner ........ £25m (i.e. €30m/release clause)
Awoniyi ...... £4m

Loaned Out
Grabara
Woodburn
Brewster

Transfer fees in: £149.25m
Expenditure: £107.5m (including Minamino)
Net Spend: -£41.75m

Squad for 2020/21:

---------------------------------------------------------------------
----------- Mané (28) ---------------------------- Salah (27) -----
---------- Werner (23) -------------------------- Elliott (16) -----
------------------------------ Firmino (28) -------------------------
----------------------------- Minamino (25) -----------------------
---------------------------------------------------------------------
-------------- Keita (24) ------------------ Wijnaldum (29) --------
--------------- Ox (26) -------------------- Buendia (23) ---------
-------------- Jones (18) ------------------ Milner (34) ------------
----------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------ Fabinho (26) -------------------------
----------------------------- Henderson (29) -----------------------
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Robertson (25) --- Van Dijk (28) --- Gomez (22) ------- Trent (21)
J. Lewis (21) ------ Matip (28) ----- White (22) ---- Williams (18)
--------------------------------------------------------- Hoever (17)
----------------------------- Allison (27) ----------------------------
----------------------------- Adrian (33) -----------------------------
---------------------------- Kelleher (21) ----------------------------
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

The squad above for 2020/21 might be a player too heavy compared to what Klopp usually runs with, but that would be acceptable for two reasons:
  1. In the short term this allows the new young arrivals to get eased in for one season before taking on more prominent roles when key players entering their 30's start moving on in 2021 (eg. Wijnaldum, Milner, etc). This patient approach was beneficial for Fabinho, Robertson, Keita, and Ox as well.
  2. It's also important to factor in the AFCON in midseason, where Salah, Mané, and Keita will miss over a month of the season in January 2021, so carrying a slightly heavier squad for next season would be sensible. Numerous other players will also feature in Euro2020 and Copa America in the summer as well, and so allowing some scope for additional fatigue and extra rest days for key players will be essential.

In terms of the Uefa Squad in 2020/21 it would look like this:
  1. Allison
  2. Adrian
  3. Van Dijk
  4. Matip
  5. Robertson
  6. Fabinho
  7. Wijnaldum
  8. Keita
  9. Buendia
  10. Firmino
  11. Minamino
  12. Mané
  13. Salah
  14. Werner
Association-trained (minimum of 4)
15. Gomez
16. Ben White
17. Henderson
18. Ox
19. Milner
20. Jamal Lewis
21. Elliott (will be considered 'club-trained' once he's been at the club 2 years, so from June 2021 onwards)

Club-trained (born before Jan 1st 1999, and at the club at least 2 years prior to turning 21)
22. Kelleher
23. Trent Alexander Arnold
24. Hoever
25.

List B (born after Jan. 1st 1999 and at the club at least 2 years)
  • Williams (can be on List B for 3 more years).
  • Jones (can be on List B for 3 more years).
Omitted
  • Van den Berg - becomes "club trained" in summer 2021. On the evidence of the league cup game vs Villa he has at least 2 years of physical development to do, so that timing is fine.
Looking even further ahead, the squad would be in a good position for a smooth long-term transition in other positions too, without many big signings needing to be made:
  • Wijnaldum ---> Buendia
  • Milner --------> Jones
  • Matip --------> Van den Berg/Hoever
  • Salah ---------> Elliott
  • Firmino -------> Brewster
For what it's worth, 5 signings ahead of the 2020/21 season (including Minamino) would be in line with the amount of signings Klopp has typically made each year since he arrived.
  • 2016: 7 - Karius, Manninger, Matip, Klavan, Grujic, Wijnaldum, Mané.
  • 2017: 5 - Van Dijk*, Robertson, Ox, Solanke, Salah (*delayed until Jan. 2018).
  • 2018: 4 - Alisson, Fabinho, Keita, Shaqiri.
  • 2019: 4 - Adrian, Lonergan, Van den Berg, Elliott.
  • 2020: 5 - White, Lewis, Buendia, Minamino, Werner
@Richard88 Great post, but I think you need to add in the costs of the contract renewals that happened over the past 18 months... its brill that they happened but the are expensive
 

Mascot88

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@Richard88 Great post, but I think you need to add in the costs of the contract renewals that happened over the past 18 months... its brill that they happened but the are expensive
This is a point that should be remembered. We all like to engage in a bit of fun speculation about how much we have to spend and who we could bring in, but football finances are nothing like this.

The other one that I see a lot is We pocketed 100m for winning the Champions League - we have loads to spend. In real life LFCs Rewards culture, in which we pay relatively modest wages but load on the add ins for success means a lot of the CL windfall will have ended up in players pockets.

I love that by the way. I’d sooner be paying players the equivalent of huge salaries for delivering trophies rather than paying a 300k weekly base rate incentivising failure like United.
 
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The fact that we are consistently linked with these 3 players appears to demonstrate such consideration, or is this the press talking FM....... YOUR THOUGHTS?
Bit strange that you need thoughts shouted back

So your saying increased numbers of insane click-bait articles & tweets should make those who actually manage the recruitment strategy at LFC to, at the exact point that it's working beautifully, change to the Man Utd school of buying horrifically expensive marque players who turn out not to care about much about the club
 

Iluvatar

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He’s told you his thoughts.

Mine are that selling all three of the best attacking trio in world football - the one that’s enabled us to knock home 92 points from 94 - is such epic stupidity it beggars belief.

Especially as trust and team building are so critically important to Klopp’s way of working. Are the entire midfield thinking they are going to be binned off next? What does that do for team spirit and collectivity?

Like he said, it’s the kind of thing you do on footy manager, not real life.
Mate Liverpool are that good that you dont do it on FM either.. For the last few years playing Liverpool is like cheat mode tbh. No challenge at all.
 

Not Worthy

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The fact that we are consistently linked with these 3 players appears to demonstrate such consideration, or is this the press talking FM....... YOUR THOUGHTS?
Press rumours mean very little, possibly absolutely nothing. Linking 3 almost valueless rumours into a single narrative thread gives them less weight/value, not more. They 'demonstrate' nothing. And, yes, the press does talk FM, because they know it excites clicks.

My thoughts are that it won't happen because it makes little sense. If you want to believe it and argue for it, that's finse.

If you do, can you please not do the CAPITALS thing; it comes across as a bit demanding and stroppy.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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This is a point that should be remembered. We all like to engage in a bit of fun speculation about how much we have to spend and who we could bring in, but football finances are nothing like this.

The other one that I see a lot is We pocketed 100m for winning the Champions League - we have loads to spend. In real life LFCs Rewards culture, in which we pay relatively modest wages but load on the add ins for success means a lot of the CL windfall will have ended up in players pockets.

I love that by the way. I’d sooner be paying players the equivalent of huge salaries for delivering trophies rather than paying a 300k weekly base rate incentivising failure like United.

There is no way our club is run so poor from a business point of view that our expenditure increase for being successful matches or beats our income increases. Yes, we all know and have for awhile, that our wage bill will increase with success due to our bonus scheme on player contracts. But we also know FSG/Gordon are also committed to bringing/keeping that wage bill within a certain percentage of operating costs as well. To the 31st May 18 our wage bill was £264 million 58% of turnover. How much are people really expecting our wage increase to have been? Players wages wouldn't have doubled, they probably haven't even increased by 50%. And not all wages are going to be in line with that or effected by our success. This gets rolled out as an excuse as to why we didn't spend much last year but there are two other possible reasons which seem to fit the facts better. 1: FFP seems to work better if you spend big every other year as it operates on a 3 year cycle. This year and 2 years ago we operated at a net profit the year in between we operated at a net loss. 2: There are very few players who could improve this side and we had a lot of "he'll do for now" style players in the squad that were good enough to get by with. Klopp won't buy for the sake of buying and will wait for his chosen target if need be like with VvD and Keita. As long as who he wants will be available he will wait till he is instead of go for an alternative which he only seems to do once an option is ruled out for the foreseeable. I think it's a combination of those two things, loose operating model to spend big every other year (matches the scouting and recruitment plans of a rolling 2 summer plan) whilst being open to opportunities that would bend/break that (operating well within FFP rules and wage rules gives us room to maneuver) and also keeping up to speed on when these targets are most likely to be at their optimum availability.
 

Zinedine Biscan

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But playing for Klopp could well see him become a better player than Dembele and then be the yardstick for all Dembeles. Don’t you think ;)
If anyone can achieve peak-Dembele, it's Klopp. Perhaps by combining all the Dembeles into a single Ultra Dembele, the final form in the evolution of Dembele.
 

cynicaloldgit

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Mine are that selling all three of the best attacking trio in world football - the one that’s enabled us to knock home 92 points from 94 - is such epic stupidity it beggars belief.
What are you talking about?

Mané, Firmino and Salah out; Sancho, Werner and Mbappé in. D’uh.

Piece of piss, this management lark. God knows why Klopp gets paid so much.
 

Not Worthy

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What are you talking about?

Mané, Firmino and Salah out; Sancho, Werner and Mbappé in. D’uh.

Piece of piss, this management lark. God knows why Klopp gets paid so much.
Add a splash of Dembele-concentrate, stir and bake for 6 months, et voila !!!!