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The Unreliable Rumours Thread

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Anfield rd Dreamer

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If we are selling Matip too, then yes I would get someone with similar quality of Matip, which is not that easy, and I am not sure Kabak for his potential, is anywhere near Matip's level yet, considering how good Matip was whenever he is in the team.
I didn't mean an immediate departure for Matip. But if the kid is switched on enough to see a progression over a couple of years it could be proper succession planning going on. (Note this isn't the plan I'd have chosen just trying to understand the plan if this is it.

So first 6-12 months 1st VvD, 2nd Gomez, 3rd Matip, 4th Kabak, 5th Hoever.

12-18 months after that 1st VvD, 2nd Gomez, 3rd Kabak, 4th Matip, 5th Hoever.

Then 31 year old Matip leaves like Lovren is now and 20 year old Hoever becomes 4th choice.

Eventually VvD would get older and the mid-late 20s pairing of Gomez and Kabak would be first choice with experienced veteran VvD (in his early 30s) and young talent Hoever (in his early 20s) would be the back ups. Within 5 years Kabak could be a starter at one of the top clubs on the planet after developing with the best coach on the planet for unlocking player potential all whilst being mentored by his idol VvD. That could appeal more than going to a lesser club, as he is, being a contender for starting games but be at the kind of club the manager and players regularly change at and he could be replaced by the latest shiny new toy at any time.
 

ILLOK

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The signing of a player like Kabak makes more sense given Gomez' recent form. Klopp has often played Matip or Lovren ahead of Gomez anyway and he's just gone through his worst period of form for about 3 years.

He's not a guaranteed starter, so any centre back coming into the club has the chance to stake a claim for the position.
 

redfanman

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Thats interesting to me as in the article he quotes the reason he didn’t join Bayern was that he wanted to play matches and chose to join schalke instead because of Wagner and the technical team in schalke.
I think Klopp has demonstrated that young players will get a chance to play regularly if they are good enough, we are not as deep at CB as Bayern are (with three of our four CBs often missing significant period's of the season) - and last summer Bayern signed both Hernandez and Pavard which would have been enough for most young CBs to think twice about joining them.

I agree we should not sell Matip but I doubt Matip himself will be pleased that we are bringing in a 20 year old centre back when his game time has already been compromised by Gomez being present. But either way I do believe we need 4 functioning centre backs for the reasons everyone has mentioned so on that end I agree with you we should hold on to Matip as well.
I think Matip will be understanding of the situation. Almost all clubs have at least 4 CBs on their books. Given how frequently he alone has been injured, i dont think he could complain about that. Given the age of Kabak, i would expect him to feel less threatened by him than by a more experienced pro. If anything, Matip may see it as an opportunity to mentor the youngster.

Hoever is a interesting one , mainly because while I haven’t seen him really have bad performances. Somehow Neco Williams has creeped through the vine to get even first team appearances towards the end of the season. Maybe its something we are not seeing with Hoever, or maybe there are loan plans put in place for him next season. Either way IF the club moves in a differing direction at centre back, it would be something telling about Hoever.
From those watching him on this forum, i think Hoever has been inconsistent. Against good players, he can stand out and have a really good performance, but against lesser players he has a tendancy to switch off. He also missed a chunk of the season through injury i think. Again, i dont see anything here to worry him. He is still young and developing and may not have the attributes to make him a CB (he looks a little small). I'm sure we will see more of him next season.
 

redfanman

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The signing of a player like Kabak makes more sense given Gomez' recent form. Klopp has often played Matip or Lovren ahead of Gomez anyway and he's just gone through his worst period of form for about 3 years.

He's not a guaranteed starter, so any centre back coming into the club has the chance to stake a claim for the position.
I'm starting to wonder if it is the layoff. I've not noticed it with defenders before, but Gomez was relatively poor early in the season too.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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Might well come back to haunt me saying this but I'm actually starting to think we are going to see a fair bit of business, more than we expected.

None of the following situations would now surprise me;

1; Lovren leaving overdue and Kabak coming in as proper succession planning, seems too much smoke on both for their to be nothing going on.

2; Wijnaldum has talked to Klopp and wants a new challenge and that's why he's not extending his deal, there are interested parties and Thiago (not exactly a like for like replacement but definitely an alternative in many of the same positions) is available. So maybe Jurgen has agreed with Gini he can go if the Thiago deal can be secured and someone stumps up the cash.

3; Klopp had a look at Williams at LB to judge the potential and is losing Larouci the only real "maybe" for the next few years at LB in the academy. Klopp has decided someone does need bringing in although this may still be a multifunctional player not someone who is a LB only. My guess will be a promising talent on the verge of the first team of the club he is currently at, a LB Curtis Jones style. This "need" may also be linked to 4.

4; Milner could well want to go to Leeds to be a player-coach, learn from another great manager after Klopp, help them survive that first couple of seasons in the Prem. He's won it all with us and his role on the pitch will be decreasing as he gets older. I believe Klopp would respect him enough to let him move on if its what he wants.

5; Shaqiri, Grujic, Wilson, Karius, Ojo, Ejaria and Awoniyi all likely to move on, possible not all of them do but wouldn't be surprised if none of these are owned by Liverpool by the end of the transfer window.

6; Origi seemed to be saying goodbye to Anfield or maybe he just had to take a quiet minute after the trophy presentation. But he could be the starting CF at a team at a reasonable level, he could well feel its time to move on. When he signed his contract extension it seemed his time at Liverpool was finally going to start opening up. That doesn't seem the case now. I still believe we would get good money for him.

7; Brewster could be with us next season or on loan at a more advanced side than Swansea (and hopefully in the Prem). Either way this could be regardless of what happens with Origi.

8; We might be bringing in a forward still. I look back at when we were looking at Dembele and Mbappe the summer before they both exploded onto the scene and think maybe that is the kind of thing we might do again? Or possibly a past target who has hit bad times but the recruitment team still believes has potential and who could be available on a loan with option to buy. Contenders off top of my head are Draxler, Dembele and Lemar, still believe Klopp could turn such players into mega stars. But don't see a mega money deal for someone like Sancho unless our hand is really forced.

We could see a shocking amount of departures for any of Karius, Lovren, Phillips, Clyne, Larouci, Grujic, Wijnaldum, Ejaria, Lallana, Shaqiri, Ojo, Awoniyi and Origi. We could yet see lots of incoming fees, even if mostly on the low end, along with significant room freed up on the wage bill.

With only Kabak, a young LB prospect, Thiago and a forward of some type coming in. I thought we would go again next season with largely the same maybe one or two incoming at most. I'm now not too sure. We might see a lot of change but actually a positive on the old net spend still.
 

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I'm starting to wonder if it is the layoff. I've not noticed it with defenders before, but Gomez was relatively poor early in the season too.
With Gomez it appears to be game concentration, if you look at it objectively and it was Lovren making the sorts of mistakes Gomez does, he would rightly be vilified. The Sterling foul for example, it was a soft penalty but Gomez is better than that, he has the ability to read Sterling and not need to have his arms all over him.

However Gomez for certain periods was better than Van Dijk and saved his bacon a few times, so the player is in there.

Probably my biggest frustration with Gomez is his inability to head the ball to safety, guess it's a small margin but Van Dijk rarely wastes a header, it either goes to one of our team or goes so long there is no direct threat after, Gomez typically heads it to one of their team etc.
 

Walshy07

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Why do people keep saying Milner wants to go to Leeds? I dont see that happening yet if at all.
From champions of everything to a possible relegation battle at 34/35? no chance. Yes he supported them but at the moment he is still getting games for us.
 

Dave-D

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Why do people keep saying Milner wants to go to Leeds? I dont see that happening yet if at all.
From champions of everything to a possible relegation battle at 34/35? no chance. Yes he supported them but at the moment he is still getting games for us.
Depends on if Klopp and him agree on what he wants after finished playing. Does he expect to be a coach in the first team or work his way up. Player/ first team coach at Leeds maybe more interesting to him than squad player at Liverpool.

I don’t expect him to leave but wouldn’t rule it out
 

Iluvatar

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Depends on if Klopp and him agree on what he wants after finished playing. Does he expect to be a coach in the first team or work his way up. Player/ first team coach at Leeds maybe more interesting to him than squad player at Liverpool.

I don’t expect him to leave but wouldn’t rule it out
Correct, especially if we did sign Thiago, he could look at his options being back up left back as not what he wants.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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Why do people keep saying Milner wants to go to Leeds? I dont see that happening yet if at all.
From champions of everything to a possible relegation battle at 34/35? no chance. Yes he supported them but at the moment he is still getting games for us.
He's seemed to find it very hard to answer that question in the past and ended up with a non committal "if Leeds need me and Liverpool don't" kind of answer, that was a couple of years ago. Klopp warned him few years ago that his game time would start reducing, at the time he was our 3rd most used player. Hes been falling further and further down that list now he is 13th. There will come a time when he may consider that move to his emotional first club hes always been invested in. Their first season back in the prem and making sure they survive it may be the time.
 

nobluff

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We are in negative net spend, unacceptable. Get into that candy store and start buying before those fat kids clean the place out. I would love to Havertz me some candy.

£280k off the weekly wage bill. Lallana, Clyne and Lovren.
 
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Anfield rd Dreamer

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Highly doubt Klopp will want Milner to leave in the same summer as Lovren and Lallana.
Agree. You do not want to create a vacuum, or at least a massive drop in leadership department for the team.
Really not sure Lovren is any type of leader other than the loveable oaf full of self importance that everybody loves to play up to without actually listening to. Might harm the banter but not the leadership. If Thiago is coming in that makes up for some of the experience we would be losing if Milner left. Got to remember as well experience/leadership isn't a closed book, people are constantly earning it, everyone in the squad has a lot more than they had 2 years ago or even last year. Especially Henderson. We don't necessarily need replacements for dressing room leaders if we lose some as we will have had a fair few develop over this last couple of years.
 

ILLOK

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Really not sure Lovren is any type of leader other than the loveable oaf full of self importance that everybody loves to play up to without actually listening to. Might harm the banter but not the leadership. If Thiago is coming in that makes up for some of the experience we would be losing if Milner left. Got to remember as well experience/leadership isn't a closed book, people are constantly earning it, everyone in the squad has a lot more than they had 2 years ago or even last year. Especially Henderson. We don't necessarily need replacements for dressing room leaders if we lose some as we will have had a fair few develop over this last couple of years.
You can ignore Lovren then if you want, but Klopp isn't going to want to lose Lallana and Milner in the same window. All he ever talks about is their leadership qualities and how they affect our training.

You can say others will step up but it's not a given. As long as Milner keeps producing on the pitch then Klopp will want to keep hold of him. He made 37 appearances this year, he isn't just a cheerleader.

Ideally you phase these players out at different times, not in clusters.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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You can ignore Lovren then if you want, but Klopp isn't going to want to lose Lallana and Milner in the same window. All he ever talks about is their leadership qualities and how they affect our training.

You can say others will step up but it's not a given. As long as Milner keeps producing on the pitch then Klopp will want to keep hold of him. He made 37 appearances this year, he isn't just a cheerleader.

Ideally you phase these players out at different times, not in clusters.
I'm not saying Klopp wants to lose Milner but Klopp also puts high regard on the players personal and emotional motivations too. Klopp has already, at least once, had a conversation with Milner about whether he still wants to stay here as his playing time reduces. Klopp has already asked Milner if he wants to leave and be more important elsewhere. As such I can't imagine him rejecting Milner if he came to the boss and said he wanted to finish his playing career helping the club of his heart retain prem status and settle here. This is a completely different thing from Klopp saying he doesn't need him anymore its just, with a manager who really cares about his players personal lives, its more believable to me Klopp saying yes than no.
 

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Milner isn't going anywhere this summer. He recently signed a new deal in December so we'd demand a fee for him and he'd have to be willing to take a huge pay cut given he makes about £100k a week more than their current highest earner.

We've lost Lallana and Gini is down to his last twelve months. He's going to be looking at another title run with us as or a relegation battle with Leeds. Whilst he's still contributing and able to play at a CL level I can't see him going or us wanting to let him go.
 

Ahmed Hussain

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Linked with Barnes from Leicester. He needs to stay where he is right now. Great English winger and needs game time. He'll be in the same situation as Shaqiri if he comes. He ain't getting ahead of that front three.
 

Gone Kloppo

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I think its fairly clear from Klopp's comments that if we do anything, it will be to trim more fat from the squad rather than add to it. He's said he likes to work with a small squad. He likes to have players with the capability of playing multiple positions as a means to cover for injury. It's also clear that in the past, when we consistently finishing the season in 6th or worse, we naturally were bloated with players as we were trying to get the jigsaw to fit. You need to purchase players to find the ones that work.

We are now in a completely different phase of Klopp's tenure. We are one of the best teams to have existed. We need to fine-tune what we have. I truly believe we are not going to replace Lovren. I think 3 CBs is ideal. We know Fab is pretty good there. And then we have some promising youngsters behind him. I guess the only question mark is Matip's injury record. I prefer him over Gomez particularly with how much more solid we are defending corners and set pieces. But we aren't losing a whole lot partnering Gomez with Virg.

In midfield even with Lallana gone we are still bloated there. We still have 7 players for 3 positions before we even get to the kids. Klopp's comments really have me believing there is something in the Thiago rumour. But I just don't see room for him. Even with Fab acting as a cover for defence. Surely there is at least 1-2 players moving on for that to happen? That might be Shaq and Gini if they both choose to leave. Ideally we want 7 midfielders down to 5 and allow room for CJ to develop.

I think in attack we have good cover for all. Minamino and Ox are up for covering the wide role and Origi, Salah and Mane can all cover for Bobby. I think the forward line has Klopp's ideal squad size to get the job done. 'Rona has been bad for Brewster as he is going to have only a short preseason to impress but I wouldnt be surprised to see him finally being integrated into the squad.

As I say, the Thiago rumour has me a little flustered, but the only spot I can see us moving for is at LB. If Klopp believes Gomez and Milly can cover that position then I'll trust him on that.


If tl;dr for anyone, basically I would be surprised with any 'first team' signings as they are not necessary and it would go against Klopp's ethos.
 

DanLFC

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Ismaila Sarr anyone?

Just been relegated with Watford, absolutely tore us to pieces for two goals a month or so ago.

Should be a good price, would surely have a relegation clause and where better to come and learn his trade than under his mate Sadio's wing.

Definetly young enough that we wouldn't be pressing for a starting role yet but from the bench and to rotate for Cup games we could do a lot worse.
 
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