• This website uses cookies. More information.
  • The This Is Anfield Forums community is moving to a new home. Click here for more information on the transition.

TIA Opinion: Suarez, Diver or Dedicated?

News Bot

I'm not a real person, I just add news!
Joined
Oct 19, 2009
Messages
585
A cheat and a diver, these are the words being used to describe Luis Suarez recently but are these words reflective of our number 7?

View the full article
 

AnfieldCat

TIA Squad Member
Joined
Sep 28, 2008
Messages
3,959
You are spot on with the Michael Owen reference, it would be a different story if Rooney dived for England and won a penalty in an important game, it would probably be laughed off and they would say how it was 'out of character' for him or something. At times I do think Luis overdoes it but theres also other times when he doesn't get glaringly obvious decisions, I've accepted the fact everyone but us hates him and I won't be reading any more media pieces on him as they just make me angry. As long as we support him then I don't care about others small-minded sheep-like opinions.
 

Mascot88

Bootroom Member
Admin
Joined
May 24, 2007
Messages
24,404
I don't care if he dives, waves imaginary cards and otherwise tries to influence the referees.

I see no difference between this and players appealing for decisions like corner, throw ins, or yes, offside decisions that they know they are not entitled to.

Why we expect players to police themselves in some situations but not others, I don't know. Maybe we could demand players be honest about everything that happens in the game, then we wouldn't need a ref at all.

In the pressure cooker of premier league football, players are going to do anything to gain a competitive edge. It's up to the authorities to keep that in check. And they could do so without breaking sweat.

Introduce a delayed video feed for the fourth official and have him relay a second opinion to the ref. All done and dusted in five seconds, and with most incidents that require an intervention the game will have stopped anyway.

But I'm sick of players been expected to behave like paragons of virtue in certain respects, while everyday 'cheating' in so many ways in completely ignored.
 

lfc.eddie

"¿Plata... O Plomo?"
Joined
Sep 18, 2006
Messages
53,286
I don't care if he dives, waves imaginary cards and otherwise tries to influence the referees.

I see no difference between this and players appealing for decisions like corner, throw ins, or yes, offside decisions that they know they are not entitled to.
One step further, I see no difference between what he did and what the managers before the match is doing in their prematch interview. Leading the referees with the same mantra, swaying perceptions before the ball was even kicked. So how is that different?
 

TFC

TIA Squad Member
Joined
Jul 6, 2011
Messages
7,464
One step further, I see no difference between what he did and what the managers before the match is doing in their prematch interview. Leading the referees with the same mantra, swaying perceptions before the ball was even kicked. So how is that different?
Exactly. Moyes and others trying to create a prejudice against Suarez to sway the referee's opinion in favor of refusing him the benefit of the doubt is just as bad as a player trying to sway the referees judgement during the match.

When it comes to this diving bullshit I always remember one Barca match I watched, I forget who they were playing since it was a few years ago, but there was one point in the match that has stuck with me:
Messi was in the box, there was clear contact but rather than going to the ground he fought to keep his footing and tried to play the game. The commentators at the time, and even afterwards showed a replay to reiterate their point, said that Messi was actually hurting his team by not exaggerating the contact and that he clearly should have gone to the ground once the contact was made to draw the penalty.

They are all hypocrites. Its an unfortunate part of the game, but it is part of the game. I honestly would be surprised if it wasn't something that was coached and encouraged at some point during players careers.
 

DanLFC

Strafing ground targets
Joined
May 27, 2011
Messages
2,126
Here in Australia we have a match review panel which can ban players retrospectively for diving for upto 3 games if the dive has resulted in a pen or red card. Wouldn't be against this option also but as said above a fourth official with the ability to look at replays and tell the main ref the correct decision during the game is the ultimate solution. Then issues can be sorted there and then and all this rubbishh can cease.
 

Mascot88

Bootroom Member
Admin
Joined
May 24, 2007
Messages
24,404
I remember a game from a few years back where Benayoun got clearly fouled in the penalty area, but rather than take the foul and go down, he stayed on his feet and tried to score. Trouble is he was so off balance by that point he just shinned it wide.

I think it cost us the three points, and most of us here were absolutely livid at him. The commentators praised him for trying to stay on his feet, of course - which I'm sure was great comfort to Benitez.

Your absolutely spot on though Eddie. If exaggerating a foul or diving is disgusting because it cons the referee, then the 'mind games' managers indulge in before the kick off is no different.
 

Mascot88

Bootroom Member
Admin
Joined
May 24, 2007
Messages
24,404
Here in Australia we have a match review panel which can ban players retrospectively for diving for upto 3 games if the dive has resulted in a pen or red card. Wouldn't be against this option also but as said above a fourth official with the ability to look at replays and tell the main ref the correct decision during the game is the ultimate solution. Then issues can be sorted there and then and all this rubbishh can cease.
I've always thought retrospective punishment is bollocks. It's the opposite of fair.

Lets say Fellani gets a retrospective ban for kicking out at Allen. Hypothetically he could then be banned for games against all our direct competitors, meaning not only has the wronged team not benefit from the punishment, but the wronged team gets the double whammy of their rivals getting to play a weakened side.

I would sooner the ban take place for the next domestic fixture between the two sides. That would sort of work. So instead of getting a ban for any random fixtures, Fellani would be banned for the Anfield fixture.
 

Barnestormer

Left wing.
Joined
Jul 10, 2007
Messages
5,967
The problem is he embellishes being fouled. He falls beyond the force applied to bring him down and it looks false.

Whilst it isn't cheating, it is perceived inauthentic and thus ripe for the chants of the mob.

I must say I am worried that if he keeps being abused by this song at every game by every set of fans, he will have no alternative than to quit the premier league. Regardless of his resolve, no man can take on the whole nation of opposition fans. And if we do not bring him some support in January - Its odds on he will be thinking about moving. Someone tempting him away would have an almost irresistible reason to say leave the Premier league and get back to being able to focus on your game.

There is a very difficult dynamic emerging and it is getting stronger game by game................its going to be a shame and a victory for the mob if we are not careful. He has to be told to keep his head down..........I just don't think he can. He would lose his vitality.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Ad-free Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
13,395
I don't care if he dives, waves imaginary cards and otherwise tries to influence the referees.

I see no difference between this and players appealing for decisions like corner, throw ins, or yes, offside decisions that they know they are not entitled to.

Why we expect players to police themselves in some situations but not others, I don't know. Maybe we could demand players be honest about everything that happens in the game, then we wouldn't need a ref at all.

In the pressure cooker of premier league football, players are going to do anything to gain a competitive edge. It's up to the authorities to keep that in check. And they could do so without breaking sweat.

Introduce a delayed video feed for the fourth official and have him relay a second opinion to the ref. All done and dusted in five seconds, and with most incidents that require an intervention the game will have stopped anyway.

But I'm sick of players been expected to behave like paragons of virtue in certain respects, while everyday 'cheating' in so many ways in completely ignored.
I completely agree with this. Nearly every single debatable call in the sport the play has stopped or slowed enough that a video replay referee would have the chance to see as many as three replays within seconds without slowing the game down at all. Its actually quite shocking that those in power do not want this as the only reason not to want it is if you are happy with an imperfect system. An imperfect system that it is possible to hide corruption in.
 

Dane

Adios!
Ad-free Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
7,120
He does get a bit theatrical now and then, but his effort levels and attitude are first class.

So you know what?

Fuck the rest of them.

The more they get on his back, the more we'll defend him.
 

Prolix

Long Time Nemesis™
Ad-free Member
Joined
Sep 17, 2012
Messages
3,297
There's been a question nagging at my mind for a while now, and this seems like a good place to ask it:

What do you consider a dive/what do 'divers' do that makes them divers?

To me, a diver is someone who simulates contact (entirely) and goes to ground looking for a call (see: Ashley Young against Chelsea; I am convinced that Ivanovic didn't actually make contact with him). A player like Suárez doesn't constitute a 'diver' for me simply because 99 times out of 100 there is some sort of contact made when he goes down. I don't find 'embellishing' a foul to be unsportsmanlike inherently, although being overtly theatrical is uncalled for. But a player who is tripped up and lets himself go down rather than fighting to stay on his feet is not guilty of diving, in my opinion.
 

TassieRed

TIA Regular
Joined
Apr 12, 2009
Messages
1,985
Suarez rarely cheats in my view. Sometimes he dives, but more often than not he goes down easily when contact is made. He does this to increase the chances of a foul being given. This is not cheating. It's just making the most of the situation to benefit the team.

Gary Neville explained it very very well on Sky

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNx5ok60U6A

God I used to hate Neville as a player, but as a commentator, well, apart from his Nevillegasm, he is actually pretty sensible.\


"Was it a dive? Yes. Was it a penalty? Yes."
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Ad-free Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
13,395
There's been a question nagging at my mind for a while now, and this seems like a good place to ask it:

What do you consider a dive/what do 'divers' do that makes them divers?

To me, a diver is someone who simulates contact (entirely) and goes to ground looking for a call (see: Ashley Young against Chelsea; I am convinced that Ivanovic didn't actually make contact with him). A player like Suárez doesn't constitute a 'diver' for me simply because 99 times out of 100 there is some sort of contact made when he goes down. I don't find 'embellishing' a foul to be unsportsmanlike inherently, although being overtly theatrical is uncalled for. But a player who is tripped up and lets himself go down rather than fighting to stay on his feet is not guilty of diving, in my opinion.
I share this view point. It also makes me clench my firsts the way pundits wheel out the "there was contact so he had a right to go down" for some players whilst using the "he clearly made a meal of it to buy the decision and therefore it had to be a dive" for others. And we are sometimes talking bout the same pundit on the same show it can be that inconsistent.
 

RichLFC

Always one of us. RIP.
Joined
Apr 15, 2009
Messages
11,649
On the diving thing, well, to be frank, hes actually quite shit at it. That may be what people who dont watch him a lot dont quite get

I think hes a great player but he is and always will be a bit of a panomime villain. We arent really all that used to having these sorts of characters play for the club, we have kind of got used to clean living [yet with not a great deal of ingrained loyalty] heroes like owen or Torres etc. The trouble attracters tend not to have lasted too long and success for them hasnt been forthcoming. Suarez is a bit different. he is the type of player who feeds on controversy, it seems to lift his game, but he seems to find a way of being able to be effective despite the baggage he inevitably ends up collecting along the way

hes unusual. He sticks out. On the whole though I dont tend to bother defending him too much to outsiders. Sometimes he gets a bit carried away and it is an undeniable cast iron 100% reality that if he didnt play for us, we would pretty much all hate him just as much and be nodding in agreement with all the negative press coverage, scathing comments and 'well he deserves it' comments. No point being hypocritical and denying that, its as true as night follows day

that is not to say that we could be doing a better job at defending his reputation on a club level. The fans will support him on the pitch but we seem a bit weak off it. i think though that there is some degree of humour creeping in to things, like the Moyes swan dive [which gollum actually found amusing] and the ironic cheers after a FK against reading that went on for several minutes. You catch more flies with honey than you do with vinegar

ultimately though, the patrice evra thing has pretty much killed any chance of him ever being viewed particularly fondly, and that we will just have to accept, unless something comes out about how the case was handled which casts more doubt on the fairness of proceedings. But as racism has become a bit of a 'guilty until proven innocence' matter [such as being accused of being a communist in 50's america, or being a kiddie fiddler now, people dont want to hear about interpretations when it comes to these things, they just dont] it could be a long wait before anyone really digs deep in to that. i has condemned him in to virtually permanent pariah status, it was something we perhaps should have realised closer to the time but we were a bit out of touch with it and didnt protect the player enough. So now basically hes on his own out there

Admire him hugely, because hes our player and we know more about him than others do, but am realistic enough to know why the situation surrounding him is as it is. We could though do him and us a rather big favour and get someone else to help him win games for us. Hes too much on his own out there in that regard as well and its a mistake we seem to keep on making, being too reliant on one or two players to provide the magic
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Ad-free Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
13,395
On the diving thing, well, to be frank, hes actually quite shit at it. That may be what people who dont watch him a lot dont quite get

I think hes a great player but he is and always will be a bit of a panomime villain. We arent really all that used to having these sorts of characters play for the club, we have kind of got used to clean living [yet with not a great deal of ingrained loyalty] heroes like owen or Torres etc. The trouble attracters tend not to have lasted too long and success for them hasnt been forthcoming. Suarez is a bit different. he is the type of player who feeds on controversy, it seems to lift his game, but he seems to find a way of being able to be effective despite the baggage he inevitably ends up collecting along the way

hes unusual. He sticks out. On the whole though I dont tend to bother defending him too much to outsiders. Sometimes he gets a bit carried away and it is an undeniable cast iron 100% reality that if he didnt play for us, we would pretty much all hate him just as much and be nodding in agreement with all the negative press coverage, scathing comments and 'well he deserves it' comments. No point being hypocritical and denying that, its as true as night follows day

that is not to say that we could be doing a better job at defending his reputation on a club level. The fans will support him on the pitch but we seem a bit weak off it. i think though that there is some degree of humour creeping in to things, like the Moyes swan dive [which gollum actually found amusing] and the ironic cheers after a FK against reading that went on for several minutes. You catch more flies with honey than you do with vinegar

ultimately though, the patrice evra thing has pretty much killed any chance of him ever being viewed particularly fondly, and that we will just have to accept, unless something comes out about how the case was handled which casts more doubt on the fairness of proceedings. But as racism has become a bit of a 'guilty until proven innocence' matter [such as being accused of being a communist in 50's america, or being a kiddie fiddler now, people dont want to hear about interpretations when it comes to these things, they just dont] it could be a long wait before anyone really digs deep in to that. i has condemned him in to virtually permanent pariah status, it was something we perhaps should have realised closer to the time but we were a bit out of touch with it and didnt protect the player enough. So now basically hes on his own out there

Admire him hugely, because hes our player and we know more about him than others do, but am realistic enough to know why the situation surrounding him is as it is. We could though do him and us a rather big favour and get someone else to help him win games for us. Hes too much on his own out there in that regard as well and its a mistake we seem to keep on making, being too reliant on one or two players to provide the magic
Brilliant post Rich I particularly agree with the fact Suarez is actually rubbish at diving haha he just doesnt convince when he tries to make a meal out of a legitimate contact. Also 250% agree that Suarez is simply hated and nothing can ever change that we just have to get on with it.
 

ricardito

New Member
Joined
Oct 31, 2012
Messages
11
I've always thought retrospective punishment is bollocks. It's the opposite of fair.

Lets say Fellani gets a retrospective ban for kicking out at Allen. Hypothetically he could then be banned for games against all our direct competitors, meaning not only has the wronged team not benefit from the punishment, but the wronged team gets the double whammy of their rivals getting to play a weakened side.

I would sooner the ban take place for the next domestic fixture between the two sides. That would sort of work. So instead of getting a ban for any random fixtures, Fellani would be banned for the Anfield fixture.
The problem with this is that punishment is not meant to be seen as a reward for the other team.

The punishment is for the player involved, the team involved. If the referee misses it, he misses it. You can't go around ambiguously banning players from matches months in advance, what if the offence warrants a three match ban? The player can't play against Liverpool for next season too? What if they move to a different club in January?

There are too many variables that make that idea completely unfeasible.

Unfortunately you have to look at things from the outside and not just from a Liverpool perspective; retrospective bans would be great to deter people from breaking the rules in the first place, whether they think they get away with it on the day or not.

For example: if I stamp on your face when the ref isn't looking, its all good. There needs to be a deterrent to the player to do it in the first place (i.e. he's gonna miss the next 3 games and cost his team points) and if the referee misses it then the player still needs to be culpable to HIS OWN team - and not do it in the first place.

Need to step away from the punishment/reward model and look at prevention.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Ad-free Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
13,395
Also with regards retrospective action if its in place across the league yes Huth may not of been sent off in the game against us but Fellaini for instance may of been banned for the derby due to past instances. Still think a video ref with a 30 second window to call playback or reverse decisions is the ultimate way to be fair though. Play can be called back for an advantage not materialising its the exact same thing.
 

steveo72

TIA Youth Team
Joined
Jan 7, 2009
Messages
220
I'll defend Suarez every day of the week. However, I'd prefer that he and all players in every league at every level just play through these incidences. If you get fouled and knocked down, you get fouled and get knocked down, ref makes the call (I know the state of the refs right now, I'm speaking in generalities), If you get fouled but can stay on your feet and still make a play, do it, be a man. I always admired Kuyt for this; the ref can determine if advantage was lost due to the foul. Taking a shot but being horribly off balance due to a foul means you lost the advantage due to the infraction. Suarez, I think for the most part is getting fouled. When he gets frustrated his point to the ref is embellishing the fouls, which can make him look like an idiot. But, a foul is a foul.

Many, if not all of my friends here in the US who don't like "soccer" always cite diving and players being "pussies" as one of their reasons for not watching or getting into the game. And frankly, it is distracting. These guys are beasts and have some of the best balance in the world for athletes, getting nicked on the foot is small potatoes for them and they should really just play through. I loath when a player gets slightly hit, goes to ground for the foul, when they actually still have the advantage, ie space in front to penetrate.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Ad-free Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
13,395
I'll defend Suarez every day of the week. However, I'd prefer that he and all players in every league at every level just play through these incidences. If you get fouled and knocked down, you get fouled and get knocked down, ref makes the call (I know the state of the refs right now, I'm speaking in generalities), If you get fouled but can stay on your feet and still make a play, do it, be a man. I always admired Kuyt for this; the ref can determine if advantage was lost due to the foul. Taking a shot but being horribly off balance due to a foul means you lost the advantage due to the infraction. Suarez, I think for the most part is getting fouled. When he gets frustrated his point to the ref is embellishing the fouls, which can make him look like an idiot. But, a foul is a foul.

Many, if not all of my friends here in the US who don't like "soccer" always cite diving and players being "pussies" as one of their reasons for not watching or getting into the game. And frankly, it is distracting. These guys are beasts and have some of the best balance in the world for athletes, getting nicked on the foot is small potatoes for them and they should really just play through. I loath when a player gets slightly hit, goes to ground for the foul, when they actually still have the advantage, ie space in front to penetrate.
Do these US fans who dont like soccer because of its "pussies" watch 350 pound men who feel the need to wear armour before playing Rugby?
 

gr_sounder

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 15, 2010
Messages
2,596
Many, if not all of my friends here in the US who don't like "soccer" always cite diving and players being "pussies" as one of their reasons for not watching or getting into the game. And frankly, it is distracting. These guys are beasts and have some of the best balance in the world for athletes, getting nicked on the foot is small potatoes for them and they should really just play through. I loath when a player gets slightly hit, goes to ground for the foul, when they actually still have the advantage, ie space in front to penetrate.
Remind those friends that there is diving in the NFL, the NBA (probably the worst of all professional sports), the NHL and MLB as well as soccer/football.
 

gr_sounder

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 15, 2010
Messages
2,596
Ok, I've put my opinion on the boards before, but I'll restate for the sake of this thread.

In my opinion, Luis is NOT a cheat... far from it, but more to the question of the thread ... he is not a diver.
My opinion is based on FIFA's definitions and interpretations of the Laws of the Game so it's basically what "should" be used for this sport.

Diving is simulation/cheating. It is trying to get a call from the referee or to induce a card being given to another play for a foul or infraction that did not actually occur. Luis rarely "dives" or goes to ground without contact. What Luis does is exagerration of the contact to try and win the call. It is a fine line but a distinct line in the minds of FIFA and refs. Basically there is contact and Luis believes he has been fouled so he goes to ground. This is not him trying to win a call based on nothing (which would be diving/simulation) and this is important. By going to ground, Luis is essentially saying, I believe that the contact I have received takes away any advantage I might have by trying to continue on... so the referee is effectively forced to rule immediately on the contact - foul or no-foul. If Luis were to stay on his feet or try to stay on his feet the referee can decide no advantage was gained with the foul and allow play to continue. Unfortunately, often this advantage isn't truly realized and forwards know this. How is it advantage if you get off balance and have to check your run through the defense even if you didn't lose the ball? Luis (and many others) would rather have a free kick 25 yards out from goal than to be held up and allow the defense to re-form between him and the goal in that half-second it takes him to regain full control of the situation.

Now, my personal opinion is that he goes to the ground too often, and he's not very good at it... looking way too theatrical which doesn't help his cause. Also, if I'm to be perfectly fair... while I believe mostly he embellishes rather than dives... he did dive recently and that will also hurt his cause to get more calls.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Ad-free Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
13,395
gr_sounder thats the perfect post on the issue and fully explains everything perfectly mate.
 

supereddman98

Active Member
Joined
Jan 2, 2008
Messages
989
Dive and cheat are strong words these names seems as though nearly every player does it. Suarez imo is a player who will do anything to win but because the media has made him public enemy number 1 every little thing he does is blown out of proportion. Bale dives week in week out and not much is said, yet if a foreigner does it, its wrong and needs kicking out of the game.
 

gr_sounder

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 15, 2010
Messages
2,596
gr_sounder thats the perfect post on the issue and fully explains everything perfectly mate.
Thanks for the compliment (though others may disagree but tha'ts ok... I have at least 1 person agreeing with me which is probably more than normal). I just hoped it made sense... I wrote it up pretty much on the fly.
 

TFC

TIA Squad Member
Joined
Jul 6, 2011
Messages
7,464
On the diving thing, well, to be frank, hes actually quite shit at it. That may be what people who dont watch him a lot dont quite get
He honest to god is terrible at it. When he's fouled he doesn't know how to make his reaction seem like it was from the foul and usually does something over the top and unrelated. For example in the recent match at one point he was on the edge of the box and had his ankle kicked. It wasn't a bad foul, but it was a foul, he hesitated for a second then did some weird flaying body flop rather than simply grabbing his ankle to indicate it was kicked. He was kicked so he wasn't booked for simulation, but his reaction was so over the top and obscure that the referee would have to actually go out of his way not to grant him the foul.

Take Neymar who's the best diver in the world, or even Young...these guys dive like its an art. At times you can't help but to admire the skill they have at fooling the referee. Its pathetic, sad and needs to be disciplined after the matches in order to stop it.
 

ptt

2020, head of the table.
Joined
Oct 11, 2007
Messages
16,542
Luis Suarez is a cheat in my book and a constant embarrassment to our club’s good name. His incredible footballing ability is sadly outweighed by a constant series of mental meltdowns that humiliate him and us. I wasn’t keen on the idea of signing a player who once bit another player whilst on the pitch. I was ashamed with his behavior with Evra and it just goes on and on and on. He goes to ground quicker than my first girlfriend and needs even less physical contact. He is cringingly bad at cheating but it doesn’t stop him doing it every match.

I’d sell him in a heartbeat and if we replaced him with a player 90% as good and not constantly the centre of everybody’s attention for all the wrong reasons, that would be good business IMHO. He is the loosest of loose cannons and I fear for the next Suarez centered media frenzy.

While he remains a Liverpool player, I’ll celebrate his goals and wince and swear at him for acting like Bambi on ice when somebody sneezes in his general direction. Yes, he gets a good kicking at times and doesn’t get the decisions but given his track record, is anybody even vaguely surprised? MOTD do the usual "Suarez is great now let’s watch highlights of him being petulant and falling over” Some would say they do this because they hate Liverpool. I’d say they do it because it’s a true reflexion of his behaviour on the pitch.

Not a popular view I know but I am at least consistent.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Ad-free Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
13,395
Thanks for the compliment (though others may disagree but tha'ts ok... I have at least 1 person agreeing with me which is probably more than normal). I just hoped it made sense... I wrote it up pretty much on the fly.
Haha mate I usually agree with what you say on fly or not just only so many likes and comments to go round. And it made sense to me so thats all I care bout!
 

gr_sounder

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 15, 2010
Messages
2,596
Luis Suarez is a cheat in my book and a constant embarrassment to our club’s good name. His incredible footballing ability is sadly outweighed by a constant series of mental meltdowns that humiliate him and us. I wasn’t keen on the idea of signing a player who once bit another player whilst on the pitch. I was ashamed with his behavior with Evra and it just goes on and on and on. He goes to ground quicker than my first girlfriend and needs even less physical contact. He is cringingly bad at cheating but it doesn’t stop him doing it every match.

I’d sell him in a heartbeat and if we replaced him with a player 90% as good and not constantly the centre of everybody’s attention for all the wrong reasons, that would be good business IMHO. He is the loosest of loose cannons and I fear for the next Suarez centered media frenzy.

While he remains a Liverpool player, I’ll celebrate his goals and wince and swear at him for acting like Bambi on ice when somebody sneezes in his general direction. Yes, he gets a good kicking at times and doesn’t get the decisions but given his track record, is anybody even vaguely surprised? MOTD do the usual "Suarez is great now let’s watch highlights of him being petulant and falling over” Some would say they do this because they hate Liverpool. I’d say they do it because it’s a true reflexion of his behaviour on the pitch.

Not a popular view I know but I am at least consistent.
I'm not going to try to get you to love Luis, and you are entitled to your dislike for him, but...
Given his track record? I am going to address this a little.

1. The biting incident was bad... but it wasn't cheating. It wasn't actually any worse than what Zidane did. He was punished for it properly and should get to go on playing.

2. As for his behavior with Evra, that goes both ways and being ashamed of his behavior could be considered judging a South American on a European basis. He is not a racist, and Evra knows that. He was condemned by an unjust system (media, FA) that wanted to make an example of someone and so they picked a South American who we all know are cheats and divers and who had a history of doing things outside the rules (but not cheating by FIFA's definitions- you can use your own but I'm using FIFA's) with the biting and the handball. What the FA did was to consider the term Negrito offensive based on an English/French interpretation of what the word means and not at all caring about what that term meant to Luis or someone from South America/Uruguay where it is not abuse. The decision in itself was prejudicial based not on race but rather on national origin and is quite honestly outside the lines. So Suarez was classified as a racist and suspended... so he was pissed. I would have been too. Yes I would have done things differently than he did, but I'm not him. Now go to a certain John Terry... who was convicted by the FA (not the law - that's immaterial) of the same offense, but got HALF the sentence. What Terry did was worse, because there was no way it was a case of mistake based on national origin because of the national origins of the parties involved. Yet he gets a lighter sentence.

You said he gets a good kicking and doesn't get the calls... but you claim it's because he at times go to ground too easily.
It can go the other way, and he could go to ground more easily because he gets fouled and gets little to no protection from the referees.

I too expect him to move on from England at some point, but it's because the media have prejudged him and are biased against him, and I think referees are too. He is far from the worst offender in the league, yet he gets all the attention.
 

blndcat

TIA Youth Team
Joined
Oct 6, 2010
Messages
163
that would be good business IMHO.
In another thread (PRE Match Swansea) there's a pre-match interview with Brendan Rodgers.
Q: ... there are fears he could walk away from English football. What's your take on that?
A: ... He loves being at Liverpool, he loves the city, he loves the club, and he loves the supporters so I can't see that happening

I came into this thread in two minds. But I've read, watched (Gary Neville, hated him as a player, but talks more sense than most ex-Liverpool pundits) and thought about it.

I don't think Luis is a cheat, he's no angel, but we are lucky to have him and he deserves our support cf. to a Stoke player who is squeaky clean and is a total professional but only has his own personal interests at heart. He also admitted to diving while blaming the problem on foreign players. Ok, I don't want this to turn into one of my ex-player rants, I just wanted to point out that sometimes you have to take a player as a whole.