Timo Werner (CF) RB Leipzig

What will Werner be leaning on?

  • The Wall of Champions, pointing at the newly installed 6

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Nabil Fekir's knee

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • A bog standard table, with a bog standard pen, and a sheet of random paper

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • The Champions League trophy for some weird reason

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Sadio's jockstrap

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • The railing at Melwood

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Ralf Rangnick's animosity

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • A giant can of Red Bull, cos he's not coming

    Votes: 1 100.0%

  • Total voters
    1

Elessar

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2016
Messages
3,332
If we sign Timo Werner then we don't need to sign a new attacking mid because Firmino can play in that position.

--------------------------Firmino---------------------
--------Salah------------Werner----------Mane-------
 

Joined
Mar 3, 2019
Messages
59
Klopp IMO changed his role because Firmino is one of the most complete attacking players in the world and we have don't have that creative central midfield.
I think he changed his role due to Sturridge Origi Ings and Solanke not being good enough to do the press and be capable enough strikers also. I believe you are right he is a complete attacker and can play anywhere in an attacking role including attacking midfield.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
11,306
I think he changed his role due to Sturridge Origi Ings and Solanke not being good enough to do the press and be capable enough strikers also. I believe you are right he is a complete attacker and can play anywhere in an attacking role including attacking midfield.
You keep ignoring that guy Salah. The record setter/breaker and all round goal scoring mega star. Firmino plays number 10 (quite a fair way further back than when he plays 9/false 9) when Salah (not Sturridge or Origi) plays as the 9. It's to accommodate getting one of the best goal scorers in the game closer to goal. Nothing to do with Firmino and his performance.
 
Joined
Mar 3, 2019
Messages
59
You keep ignoring that guy Salah. The record setter/breaker and all round goal scoring mega star. Firmino plays number 10 (quite a fair way further back than when he plays 9/false 9) when Salah (not Sturridge or Origi) plays as the 9. It's to accommodate getting one of the best goal scorers in the game closer to goal. Nothing to do with Firmino and his performance.
False 9 is a deeper role allowing Salah and Mane to go ahead of him at times. 10 role is not behind Salah at all unless Salah is playing as lead striker and Shaqiri is out wide in a 4231. How do ya play as a number 10 in a 433 exactly? 10 plays behind a striker not ahead of 2 wide attackers. They all interchange anyway we know this but you are totally confusing what a false 9 an actual number 9 and a number 10 do. Firmino has played lead attack most of this season which as not seen him as good as last season. False 9 is as close to AM as you get from an attacking role for the simple reason your licensed to come deep and allow the wide attackers to go infront of you more. The false 9 was his best role so far but it is closer to the 10 role than actual lead striker purely because of where on the pitch you receive the ball most being a far deeper area.
 

Iluvatar

Allez Allez Allez
Joined
Sep 13, 2015
Messages
7,074
If Werner is available I’d think we’d be in the mix.

As others have said we lack quality depth up front, he is that.

Would add an extra dimension to our attack.

There is a wealth of young German talent available. Brandt and Werner would be unbelievable summer business.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
11,306
False 9 is a deeper role allowing Salah and Mane to go ahead of him at times. 10 role is not behind Salah at all unless Salah is playing as lead striker and Shaqiri is out wide in a 4231. How do ya play as a number 10 in a 433 exactly? 10 plays behind a striker not ahead of 2 wide attackers. They all interchange anyway we know this but you are totally confusing what a false 9 an actual number 9 and a number 10 do. Firmino has played lead attack most of this season which as not seen him as good as last season. False 9 is as close to AM as you get from an attacking role for the simple reason your licensed to come deep and allow the wide attackers to go infront of you more. The false 9 was his best role so far but it is closer to the 10 role than actual lead striker purely because of where on the pitch you receive the ball most being a far deeper area.
I think you need to pay attention more. We've been chopping and changing from 433 to 4231 all season. When in the 4231 it has been Salah as the CF and Firmino as the 10 almost exclusively and Firmino has been almost where the most advanced 8 plays in midfield in our 433. It's a significantly different role than the one he plays in 433, a lot further back and has a CF directly in front of him as well as the two wide players able to push on either side. He's not been anywhere near as effective this season as last despite mostly playing as you are asking him to play. There are reasons to bring in another CF, some of them good reasons. To get the best out of Firmino by changing him to a permanent number 10 is most definitely not one of them. 9 or (slightly) false 9 that he played consistently week in week out for nearly every game last season is proven to be his most effective role. There's not really a debate here. Did he even take any penalties or free kicks? I can't remember maybe a couple here and there. Most 20 goal a season strikers take their teams penalties and direct free kicks helping to boost them up to those figures. Firmino was phenomenal last season. His main purpose in that role isn't even to score. He's there to press from the front, open up space and facilitate the team scoring goals. The fact he scored so many goals whilst doing so was proper elite level play. And no it wasn't done from a number 10 role or attacking midfield. He played where a number 9 would play. He just didn't play like a traditional "fox in the box" style, goal hanger would.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
11,306
Are you sure about that?
I am. In my eyes if Klopp wanted a traditional CF to hang around, get on the end of chances and knock as many in as possible he'd have bought that player by now. He's had several summer's and he's stuck with Firmino despite last season being the only real season Firmino has achieved real decent numbers. CF and RB are the only positions Klopp hasn't bought for. Firmino plays how Klopp wants him to. Most of what Firmino does is facilitate those around him to score through pressing and opening up space. Mane doesn't have such a seamless introduction to the side when he arrives and then moved to the left without that. Salah doesn't have that record first season without it. It's why so many still incorrectly refer to him being a false 9 and assuming he can do the same from the number 10 role. But he played where a 9 plays he just didn't do it the traditional way. The fact he scored lots whilst doing it is a sign of his quality not a sign of the role and instructions on playing style he was carrying out. All my opinion of course but it seems obvious to me.
 

lfc.eddie

"¿Plata... O Plomo?"
Joined
Sep 18, 2006
Messages
52,392
I am. In my eyes if Klopp wanted a traditional CF to hang around, get on the end of chances and knock as many in as possible he'd have bought that player by now.
Uhm, so what I am hearing is Klopp doesn't mind Firmino or his strikers not getting goals, as long as he press the opposing players?
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
11,306
Uhm, so what I am hearing is Klopp doesn't mind Firmino or his strikers not getting goals, as long as he press the opposing players?
No you're not you're putting words into my post to win an argument you've tried to start. Pretty sure Klopp wants every player on the pitch to score as many goals as he can even Alisson as long as the teamwork isn't sacrificed whilst the player is attempting to score. He certainly celebrates like he enjoys the goals. Firmino is part of a unit designed to play a certain way. In the 433 formation his part is to play in the CF role and for the unit to play in a certain way to maximise the teams offensive potential and increases the chances of our team to score goals. Whilst playing that way it's the responsibility of every member of that attack to score as many as possible without breaking the team dynamic. It's why we saw Mane (who could come closest to replicating the role Firmino performs) play centrally not Salah, Origi or Sturridge. It's why we've not had any serious links to any traditional CF types. As I've said this is all my opinion only. Feel free to disagree but don't try and say I'm saying something I'm not in an attempt to start/win petty, immature arguments.
 

lfc.eddie

"¿Plata... O Plomo?"
Joined
Sep 18, 2006
Messages
52,392
No you're not you're putting words into my post to win an argument you've tried to start. Pretty sure Klopp wants every player on the pitch to score as many goals as he can even Alisson as long as the teamwork isn't sacrificed whilst the player is attempting to score. He certainly celebrates like he enjoys the goals. Firmino is part of a unit designed to play a certain way. In the 433 formation his part is to play in the CF role and for the unit to play in a certain way to maximise the teams offensive potential and increases the chances of our team to score goals. Whilst playing that way it's the responsibility of every member of that attack to score as many as possible without breaking the team dynamic. It's why we saw Mane (who could come closest to replicating the role Firmino performs) play centrally not Salah, Origi or Sturridge. It's why we've not had any serious links to any traditional CF types. As I've said this is all my opinion only. Feel free to disagree but don't try and say I'm saying something I'm not in an attempt to start/win petty, immature arguments.
I am not putting any words into your post. Read your own post carefully. You mentioned Firmino’s main purpose is to press and open space up for his teammates as a striker. You followed up by saying in this very post I quoted that Klopp would want everyone to pitch in on scoring goals, only if their primary role for the team isn’t compromised. So in your own words you believe Klopp’s view on his striker scoring goal is secondary, primary role is to press and open space up for his teammates. Hence why I said Klopp “doesn’t mind” Firmino not scoring goals.

Not putting words in your post. And your post dwell into other areas and widened the topic of debate to Alisson, which has no bearing to whether we should be having Werner the goal getter or not.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
11,306
I am not putting any words into your post. Read your own post carefully. You mentioned Firmino’s main purpose is to press and open space up for his teammates as a striker. You followed up by saying in this very post I quoted that Klopp would want everyone to pitch in on scoring goals, only if their primary role for the team isn’t compromised. So in your own words you believe Klopp’s view on his striker scoring goal is secondary, primary role is to press and open space up for his teammates. Hence why I said Klopp “doesn’t mind” Firmino not scoring goals.

Not putting words in your post. And your post dwell into other areas and widened the topic of debate to Alisson, which has no bearing to whether we should be having Werner the goal getter or not.
You are still making up meanings for my post that fit roles within an argument you are trying to have with me. In the 433 Firmino has the task to play a certain way and score as many goals as he can whilst playing that way! Is that now simple enough for You? His task isn't just to score. He is to play a certain way and then score as many as he can whilst playing that way. Playing the correct way is the most important thing but if he couldn't score whilst doing it then Klopp would have brought someone in who could. He's bought for every other position except right back.
 

lfc.eddie

"¿Plata... O Plomo?"
Joined
Sep 18, 2006
Messages
52,392
You are still making up meanings for my post that fit roles within an argument you are trying to have with me. In the 433 Firmino has the task to play a certain way and score as many goals as he can whilst playing that way! Is that now simple enough for You? His task isn't just to score. He is to play a certain way and then score as many as he can whilst playing that way. Playing the correct way is the most important thing but if he couldn't score whilst doing it then Klopp would have brought someone in who could. He's bought for every other position except right back.
I sure hope Klopp is not using the same way that you do to instruct his players. I am now not even able to make anything out of this one. Not to score is his task, but score as many as possible playing the right way? Goodness me, I sure as hell hope whoever you coach or giving instructions can decipher your codes.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
11,306
I sure hope Klopp is not using the same way that you do to instruct his players. I am now not even able to make anything out of this one. Not to score is his task, but score as many as possible playing the right way? Goodness me, I sure as hell hope whoever you coach or giving instructions can decipher your codes.
I'm now 100% sure you're just trolling on purpose. Read my post as carefully as you like to find where I said his "not to score" was his task. I'm done.
 

Semmy

tho your dreams be tossed and blown
Joined
Sep 2, 2013
Messages
8,504
You guys may all a bit off base. Firmino’s scoring rate this season likely has more to do with our more defensive setup (backtracking) and having to play against more teams set up in the low block.

The entire team is scoring less goals, but also being scored on far less than last season. Individual numbers may be down but overall team performance based on league points and position matter far more

Just my opinion. Likely wrong
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
11,306
You guys may all a bit off base. Firmino’s scoring rate this season likely has more to do with our more defensive setup (backtracking) and having to play against more teams set up in the low block.

The entire team is scoring less goals, but also being scored on far less than last season. Individual numbers may be down but overall team performance based on league points and position matter far more

Just my opinion. Likely wrong
Possible but according to the season comparison thread we've scored the same number of goals as last season in the corresponding fixtures.
 

santana

Active Member
Joined
Nov 4, 2018
Messages
142
werner is a very good striker a finisher with cold blood but he may not fit liverpool style play so test him befor buy !
 

Red over the water

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 13, 2018
Messages
1,588
I think we want him but know we have a lot of competition, and Bayern have a lot of form for cherry picking the best German players. I’m sure we have other options as well. Maybe we will go in for Luka Jovic (competition for him too, with Barcelona looking most likely).

Or another way to skin this cat might be on the wing. Since all three of Firmino, Salah and Mane can play in the middle as needed, maybe the solution is a pacy, goalscoring winger, like say Bergwijn. Plus a more creative sort, who also weighs in with goals, like Brandt.

Lots of options in stuff we could all name, not to mention the stuff that comes out of nowhere, ala Fabinho.