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Timo Werner (CF) RB Leipzig

What will Werner be leaning on?

  • The Wall of Champions, pointing at the newly installed 6

    Votes: 14 15.9%
  • Nabil Fekir's knee

    Votes: 11 12.5%
  • A bog standard table, with a bog standard pen, and a sheet of random paper

    Votes: 8 9.1%
  • The Champions League trophy for some weird reason

    Votes: 3 3.4%
  • Sadio's jockstrap

    Votes: 2 2.3%
  • The railing at Melwood

    Votes: 3 3.4%
  • Ralf Rangnick's animosity

    Votes: 3 3.4%
  • A giant can of Red Bull, cos he's not coming

    Votes: 40 45.5%
  • "Brazilian shit from beaches"

    Votes: 4 4.5%

  • Total voters
    88
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SithBaare

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Hello fellas. My first post here.

I am a die hard Liverpool fan since the era of Kenny Dalglish, Graeame Souness and Bruce Grobbelaar. I would like to participate in this discussion for one of my favorite players at this moment - Timo Werner.
Werner is arguably the best striker in Europe at the moment and he can play equally well on both flangs and as a central forward. Unfortunately, he signed a contract extension just prior of the 2019 season till 30.06.2023. And any team, that is willing to have the German national must pay about 30 million euro "exit clause fee" on the top of his current price of 80 million euros. If Urgen Klopp can convince the Liverpool ownership that he really want this guy, then we are going to be set for years to come.
Welcome to the forum
 

SithBaare

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So they keep him for another year while giving him an exit that wont hinder his chances of going where he wants while guaranteeing at least some money coming in when he leaves. Makes sense.
Think there might be a scaling down of spending after the coutinho and dembele disasters.
 

CymruRed

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Hello fellas. My first post here.

I am a die hard Liverpool fan since the era of Kenny Dalglish, Graeame Souness and Bruce Grobbelaar. I would like to participate in this discussion for one of my favorite players at this moment - Timo Werner.
Werner is arguably the best striker in Europe at the moment and he can play equally well on both flangs and as a central forward. Unfortunately, he signed a contract extension just prior of the 2019 season till 30.06.2023. And any team, that is willing to have the German national must pay about 30 million euro "exit clause fee" on the top of his current price of 80 million euros. If Urgen Klopp can convince the Liverpool ownership that he really want this guy, then we are going to be set for years to come.

From what i've heard,his initial release clause is around 30mill euro's but RB Leipzig have added add on clauses for games played,goals scored,leagues/cups won and internationals,so the total price will end up being around the 50/60mill mark if he hits all those targets at his new club.
 

redfanman

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From what i've heard,his initial release clause is around 30mill euro's but RB Leipzig have added add on clauses for games played,goals scored,leagues/cups won and internationals,so the total price will end up being around the 50/60mill mark if he hits all those targets at his new club.
I dont think add on clauses would usually be included in his contract but negotiated separately with the buying club wouldnt they?
 

ubermick

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Nah, they can be preset - remember Coutinho's sale to Barca included a fair few, the price was £106m rising to £142m with random addons (£4.4m for each 25 games he plays, £4.4m for Champions League qualification, etc.)
 

redfanman

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Nah, they can be preset - remember Coutinho's sale to Barca included a fair few, the price was £106m rising to £142m with random addons (£4.4m for each 25 games he plays, £4.4m for Champions League qualification, etc.)
They were negotiated as part of the transfer though werent they? I dont recall reading anywhere that they were already built into his contract if he were to be sold.
 

CymruRed

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They were negotiated as part of the transfer though werent they? I dont recall reading anywhere that they were already built into his contract if he were to be sold.

First i'd heard of it was yesterday on skys transfer talk,i thought it was just 30mill euros and thats it (thats the initial fee to make a bid i guess) but one of the sky journalists,who was sat around the table mentioned it would be ideal for Chelsea to go in for him,then broke down what the costs would be,saying RB Leipzig had agreed with Werner in his last contract of a 30mill euro release fee with certain add ons,which could cost the buying club 50-60mill if all targets are met,i'd imagine thats about right as 30mill always sounded a little low to me,there had to be some catch.
 

Jimmyscase

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This just makes me think we were very very wise to not get involved further than we did. If we are still involved despite what Werner has said recently, I will back our recruiters to the hilt to land him at a much better price than the rivals can.
 

JibJab

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They were negotiated as part of the transfer though werent they? I dont recall reading anywhere that they were already built into his contract if he were to be sold.
Yes, and that's different than a release clause in form but not in practice. One is built into the contract signed with the player, the other is built into the transfer agreement. But practically, it means the same thing. They set a baseline release clause of 30M, but that it could rise based on some present benchmarks. The new club would have to agree to match the specific elements of that release in order to trigger it.

I haven't seen another agreement like this - I am not especially well-versed in these contract structures - but it sounds like a plausible arrangement.
 

waldaz

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First i'd heard of it was yesterday on skys transfer talk,i thought it was just 30mill euros and thats it (thats the initial fee to make a bid i guess) but one of the sky journalists,who was sat around the table mentioned it would be ideal for Chelsea to go in for him,then broke down what the costs would be,saying RB Leipzig had agreed with Werner in his last contract of a 30mill euro release fee with certain add ons,which could cost the buying club 50-60mill if all targets are met,i'd imagine thats about right as 30mill always sounded a little low to me,there had to be some catch.
Tbf even at 50/60m he'd still be worth it imo, that's half a Sancho we're talking about.
 

Garibaldi

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The exit clause fee is the price. It isn't added onto €80m.
As I have mentioned, Timo Werned just extended his contract for another 4 years, till 2023. I can't believe that his price tag will be just 30 million euro. RB Leipzig were in hurry to have him sign an extension just for that reason. To get about 110 million euro if Bayern or Liverpool wants him.
31 y.o. Arturo Vidal from Barcelona has price tag of 25-30 million euro, so do you really thing, 23 y.o. striker (the best in Europe at the moment) will cost as much? I don't think so.
 

Garibaldi

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He was going to be out of contract wasn't he? Signing a new deal woth a low fee makes sense for both parties
Exactly. Before the signing of the new contract, Werner value as of Transfermarkt was 60-65 million euros. After he signed it and based on his recent performance, his price tag went up to 80 million. Yes. RB Leipzig were risking to lost him this summer as a free agent. That is why, they rushed his extension which includes that "exit clause fee" of approximately 30 million. But even 100-110 million price is not something that dramatic today. K.Mbappe for example cost over 200 million euro at the moment. Lautaro Martinez price is 91.2 million at the moment and that is just the price, not including any fee.
 

Garibaldi

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Tbf even at 50/60m he'd still be worth it imo, that's half a Sancho we're talking about.
Exactly. He is considered at the moment as the best striker in Europe and that price tag is even kind of lower than many other big names on the market. If we get this guy, he and Minomino can form a deadly striking duo, especially with the midfielders we have and the attacking stile of Alexander-Arnold and A.Robertson.
 

Garibaldi

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On July 1, 2016 RB Leipzig signed Timo Werner from Stuttgart for a fee of $ 15,960,000. If they decide to sell him this summer, the German side will take at least $ 120 millions for him, including the exit clause fee. That is what I call smart management.

I would like to make some comparisons of Werner and the other top strikers in Europe at this moment. Please, pay attention on their price tags and the stats as well.

T.Werner (RB Leipzig) - $ 85.5 mil. ............ ( 17 games - 18 goals - 6 assists )

Lautaro Martinez ( Inter ) - $ 91.2 mil...... ( 18 games - 10 goals - 3 assists )
Marcus Rashford ( M.Utd.) - 91.2 mil....... ( 22 games - 14 goals - 4 assists )
Gabriel Jesus ( M.City ) - $ 80 mil............... ( 18 games - 9 goals - 4 assists )
Anthony Martial ( M.Utd.) - $ 68.4 mil...... ( 16 games - 8 goals - 3 assists )
Tammy Abraham ( Chelsea ) - $ 57 mil.... ( 21 games - 13 goals - 3 assists )

No one has more goals and assists than him, but some of them are even more expensive on the current market.
 

Speckydodge

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As I have mentioned, Timo Werned just extended his contract for another 4 years, till 2023. I can't believe that his price tag will be just 30 million euro. RB Leipzig were in hurry to have him sign an extension just for that reason. To get about 110 million euro if Bayern or Liverpool wants him.
31 y.o. Arturo Vidal from Barcelona has price tag of 25-30 million euro, so do you really thing, 23 y.o. striker (the best in Europe at the moment) will cost as much? I don't think so.

The only reason he agreed to sign the new contract was if RB put a low release clause in it allowing him to move on when he decides without them having the chance to stop him. They would have lost him for free if they didn't agree to this, at least now they will get 30m.
So whether you believe
 

gasband

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As I have mentioned, Timo Werned just extended his contract for another 4 years, till 2023. I can't believe that his price tag will be just 30 million euro. RB Leipzig were in hurry to have him sign an extension just for that reason. To get about 110 million euro if Bayern or Liverpool wants him.
31 y.o. Arturo Vidal from Barcelona has price tag of 25-30 million euro, so do you really thing, 23 y.o. striker (the best in Europe at the moment) will cost as much? I don't think so.
Its always possible. Either his previous contract had a much lower exit clause and the club was eager to lock him in to a higher clause but that clause could be only valid say after 12 months of new contract or only valid until a certain date.

It is logical to think that Werner has the upper hand and any new contract he signed would not make it more difficult for him to leave the club in the future. So its highly impossible that he would sign a contract that sends his price skyhigh. He might still fetch a high price but he will not agree to have it fixed in the contract
 

Garibaldi

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From what i've heard,his initial release clause is around 30mill euro's but RB Leipzig have added add on clauses for games played,goals scored,leagues/cups won and internationals,so the total price will end up being around the 50/60mill mark if he hits all those targets at his new club.
That is true. If he hits all this targets with his new club, the release fee may go very high. Red Bulls knew that he is going to leave them in the summer of 2020. That is why they rushed his extension so they can cash in, when the time comes. As of now, rumors are that Mach. Utd, Chelsea, Real M and Bayern are interested in Werner, but that may change just overnight.
 

Garibaldi

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They were negotiated as part of the transfer though werent they? I dont recall reading anywhere that they were already built into his contract if he were to be sold.
Does it really matter that much? No one knows the details of his new contract. Only his agent and RB Leipzig sporting director know them. It all comes to the total amount at the time of the signing, which will be about 110-120 millions euro. All add-ons are to be paid at a later time.
 

Garibaldi

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Its always possible. Either his previous contract had a much lower exit clause and the club was eager to lock him in to a higher clause but that clause could be only valid say after 12 months of new contract or only valid until a certain date.

It is logical to think that Werner has the upper hand and any new contract he signed would not make it more difficult for him to leave the club in the future. So its highly impossible that he would sign a contract that sends his price skyhigh. He might still fetch a high price but he will not agree to have it fixed in the contract
At the end of the day it will be...Who Gives More. And yes, Timo will have the upper hand to decide where he will continue his career. As of his last interview, he prefer to stay in Germany. Bayern are going to lost Levandovski this summer and are willing to sign Werner as his replacement.
 

redfanman

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Does it really matter that much? No one knows the details of his new contract. Only his agent and RB Leipzig sporting director know them. It all comes to the total amount at the time of the signing, which will be about 110-120 millions euro. All add-ons are to be paid at a later time.
Yes, it does matter - because the price then isnt really £30m.
 

redfanman

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At the end of the day it will be...Who Gives More. And yes, Timo will have the upper hand to decide where he will continue his career. As of his last interview, he prefer to stay in Germany. Bayern are going to lost Levandovski this summer and are willing to sign Werner as his replacement.
He wont have the upperhand. If his price was set at £30m he would get more suitors than if his price was £60m. Now, if he wanted Bayern all along then they may strike a deal at £60m, but it is less certain than it would have been at £30m, and you would think they could have negotiated a deal with him to get him for free this summer like they have done with other players.

He had one concrete offer last summer pricing him at 40m euros which he turned down because he wanted to stay in Germany.
 

Jimmyscase

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When I've seen Werner live (on the pitch or getting off the Leipzig coach, signing autographs with fans of his ex-club etc), he hasn't struck me as a personality in any particular way. He hasn't got that natural strut to him, he struggles in interviews a bit, he's smaller and slighter than you'd think and has hardly any charisma. So unless he's Gerd Müller on the pitch, someone who had a similarly uncharismatic presence and stature off it, I can't see it being a good move to go to Liverpool. I think it would be a bad move to any Premier League team, but that'd be to our advantage were it to occur.
 
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Red Submarine

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When I've seen Werner live (on the pitch or getting off the Leipzig coach, signing autographs with fans of his ex-club etc), he hasn't struck me as a personality in any particular way. He hasn't got that natural strut to him, he has a speech impediment, he's smaller and slighter than you'd think and has zero charisma. So unless he's Gerd Müller, someone who had a similarly uncharismatic presence and stature off the field, I can't see it being a good move to go to Liverpool. I think it would be a bad move to any Premier League team, but that'd be to our advantage were it to occur.
De Bruyne isn't exactly a stand-up comedian though innit.
 

Jimmyscase

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De Bruyne isn't exactly a stand-up comedian though innit.
De Bruyne was, is and always will be a way better player than the level we're talking about with Werner. Mind, if Timo put 30 a season in the back of the net for us over five years, I'd willingly pretend his crap jokes are funny on the after-dinner circuit.
 
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redbj

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He wont have the upperhand. If his price was set at £30m he would get more suitors than if his price was £60m. Now, if he wanted Bayern all along then they may strike a deal at £60m, but it is less certain than it would have been at £30m, and you would think they could have negotiated a deal with him to get him for free this summer like they have done with other players.

He had one concrete offer last summer pricing him at 40m euros which he turned down because he wanted to stay in Germany.

Riddle me this

If his release clause is 30 mil, and he gets to choose, why would anyone offer 30 mil and one dollar, let alone 60 mil?
 

redfanman

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Riddle me this

If his release clause is 30 mil, and he gets to choose, why would anyone offer 30 mil and one dollar, let alone 60 mil?
The 60m figure mentioned above is simply based on what other posters have suggested would be the outcome from including the add-ons that his current contract supposedly require to be inserted into a deal being made by the buying club along with the 30m fee.

It is possible that a buying club would try to negotiate a flat fee to remove the add-ons but that to me removes the assurance and ease the release clause is supposed to provide.
 

Speckydodge

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Does it really matter that much? No one knows the details of his new contract. Only his agent and RB Leipzig sporting director know them. It all comes to the total amount at the time of the signing, which will be about 110-120 millions euro. All add-ons are to be paid at a later time.
No it wont, his release clause, the price at which RB can't refuse a transfer is 30m or 40m whatever, but that is how much he is going to cost whichever club signs him. There will be no bidding war driving up the price as the buying clubs know there is no need, the bidding war could come in the shape of his personal contract , wage , bonuses etc.
 
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