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Who would you buy?



Iluvatar

Allez (x6)
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I'd rather have an "Andy Robertson signing"...
It's an interesting point one that may be a bit of fun looking at. Who would you take from 1 of the relegated teams?

Fulham - Sessegnon (easy)
Cardiff - Etheridge (back up keeper)
Huddersfield - Bacuna
 

William Clarke

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It's an interesting point one that may be a bit of fun looking at. Who would you take from 1 of the relegated teams?

Fulham - Sessegnon (easy)
Cardiff - Etheridge (back up keeper)
Huddersfield - Bacuna
From all accounts Sessegnon is Spuds bound, so don't believe we have a chance of landing him. That's a good call on Etheridge, but would he, being a young, upcoming keeper, play second fiddle to Allison for possibly many years to come? The surprise package to me is your choice of Bacuna. His name would never have come up in my thinking of players we could bring in. What made you think of him? I ask the question because to me he is so left field and, as I commented earlier, I would never have given him a second thought.
 

Iluvatar

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From all accounts Sessegnon is Spuds bound, so don't believe we have a chance of landing him. That's a good call on Etheridge, but would he, being a young, upcoming keeper, play second fiddle to Allison for possibly many years to come? The surprise package to me is your choice of Bacuna. His name would never have come up in my thinking of players we could bring in. What made you think of him? I ask the question because to me he is so left field and, as I commented earlier, I would never have given him a second thought.
Basically the game we played against Huddersfield he impressed me; really athletic, passes well, pressed well, tackled well. He stood out massively over the rest of the team who seemed to go through the motions, he fought till the end.

Also his first name is Juninho.. What's not to like about a Dutch player with a legendary Brazilian name.
 

GermanRed

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Hopefully Community Shield, European Supercup, Club World Cup (2 games)
+ actually trying to win both domestic cups could mean that we will have much more games than this season.

Could this have an effct on the numbers of signings this summer?
 



William Clarke

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Basically the game we played against Huddersfield he impressed me; really athletic, passes well, pressed well, tackled well. He stood out massively over the rest of the team who seemed to go through the motions, he fought till the end.

Also his first name is Juninho.. What's not to like about a Dutch player with a legendary Brazilian name.
From your assessment of Bacuna, he sounds a very Liverpool-like player who gives 100% effort. I must admit having watched the game that he didn't stand out to me, but I can only put that down to my bias seeing nothing but red shirts. Sounds like a good call to me, though, so all you'll have to do now is convince Kloppo, which will be no easy matter.
 

William Clarke

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Hopefully Community Shield, European Supercup, Club World Cup (2 games)
+ actually trying to win both domestic cups could mean that we will have much more games than this season.

Could this have an effct on the numbers of signings this summer?
I think you know of Kloppo's ways more than I do, but it's my thinking he will only sign a player or two and go with what we have on the books already. Having said that, who knows our manager's mind?
 

Zinedine Biscan

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It's an interesting point one that may be a bit of fun looking at. Who would you take from 1 of the relegated teams?

Fulham - Sessegnon (easy)
Cardiff - Etheridge (back up keeper)
Huddersfield - Bacuna
From Cardiff, how about that Mendez-Laing (sp?) kid - scored two against United at OT on the last day and if memory serves he's the same one who gave Trent such a torrid time when we played them, pace to burn.

Edit: checked and he's 27, no idea why I thought he was a youngster lol
 

RedForever2014

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So we were lucky cos 5 of our players didn't get injured, 1/2 of our team, 50% of the 1st 11? On that reasoning you need a back up back up for the back up.
I'm saying that take out any of City's best players for an extended run of games and they'd still compete, and still probably win trophies. A bit like they did despite De Bruyne missing half the season.

Take out VVD, Robertson or one of the front three for an extended run of games and we'd probably fall away, a bit like Spurs did actually.

The point is that if we are actually looking at how we can improve and solidify our position as year in year out title contenders, even if we are less lucky with injuries, we would do something about the issues outlined.

The issues are that the front three can rarely be rotated and the loss of one of them to injury would derail us. Origi, Shaqiri and Brewster are not good or ready enough to be regular starters for a side looking to win the title in the City era.

There is also no left footed alternative for left back anywhere near Robertson's level and the whole defence relies on VVD's organisation and would suffer greatly in his absence.

We might not be able to get like for like players for those five, but you can mitigate your risk.

Firstly, by having better alternatives you can rotate your best players more and thus you reduce the risk of them getting injured. Bobby's injury was clearly a fatigue related injury. VVD and Andy have visibly been tired during the run in, even if their level is still extremely high.

Second, you address related issues.

For example, the impact of a VVD injury would be exacerbated by the fact that Gomez, Matip and Lovren cannot be relied upon to remain fit. So you potentially face a double whammy of VVD being out for three months and the other centre backs chopping and changing every week. So you take one of them out and sign a centre back who is not injury prone.

You also ensure you have the players in midfield to put a more protective shield in front of a weakened defence.

If one of the front three is out for an extended period, a unit that creates as well as scores goals, you not only ensure you have at least one near like for like player, but you also add a creative midfielder who can create chances for less gifted forwards like Origi or Shaqir if they end up being used often too.

Nobody is saying we need 50 players, 10 centre backs, 5 full backs, 25 strikers, or back up to the back up to the back up.

I am saying, quite simply, that the way to improve this squad to one which is insured against injuries, which can rotate in other departments the way we can in midfield, and which has more depth to compete on more fronts, is quite simply to take out the final 3 or 4 players from the Rodgers era who are not useful any more (Sturridge, Moreno, Lallana, Lovren), and sign 3 or 4 quality players to leave us with a 20 man outfield squad that has usable depth in all departments.

By the way, continuing to build also sends important signals to your squad that you are looking to help them achieve their ambitions here, and it keeps your club's stock high amongst players you are looking to attract.

I really hope we do actually sign a few quality players, whether they cost 1p or £50m, because if we don't then it will be a wasted opportunity and we won't yield the same success as we would with that extra depth.
 

Kopstar

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I'm saying that take out any of City's best players for an extended run of games and they'd still compete, and still probably win trophies. A bit like they did despite De Bruyne missing half the season.

Take out VVD, Robertson or one of the front three for an extended run of games and we'd probably fall away, a bit like Spurs did actually.

The point is that if we are actually looking at how we can improve and solidify our position as year in year out title contenders, even if we are less lucky with injuries, we would do something about the issues outlined.

The issues are that the front three can rarely be rotated and the loss of one of them to injury would derail us. Origi, Shaqiri and Brewster are not good or ready enough to be regular starters for a side looking to win the title in the City era.

There is also no left footed alternative for left back anywhere near Robertson's level and the whole defence relies on VVD's organisation and would suffer greatly in his absence.

We might not be able to get like for like players for those five, but you can mitigate your risk.

Firstly, by having better alternatives you can rotate your best players more and thus you reduce the risk of them getting injured. Bobby's injury was clearly a fatigue related injury. VVD and Andy have visibly been tired during the run in, even if their level is still extremely high.

Second, you address related issues.

For example, the impact of a VVD injury would be exacerbated by the fact that Gomez, Matip and Lovren cannot be relied upon to remain fit. So you potentially face a double whammy of VVD being out for three months and the other centre backs chopping and changing every week. So you take one of them out and sign a centre back who is not injury prone.

You also ensure you have the players in midfield to put a more protective shield in front of a weakened defence.

If one of the front three is out for an extended period, a unit that creates as well as scores goals, you not only ensure you have at least one near like for like player, but you also add a creative midfielder who can create chances for less gifted forwards like Origi or Shaqir if they end up being used often too.

Nobody is saying we need 50 players, 10 centre backs, 5 full backs, 25 strikers, or back up to the back up to the back up.

I am saying, quite simply, that the way to improve this squad to one which is insured against injuries, which can rotate in other departments the way we can in midfield, and which has more depth to compete on more fronts, is quite simply to take out the final 3 or 4 players from the Rodgers era who are not useful any more (Sturridge, Moreno, Lallana, Lovren), and sign 3 or 4 quality players to leave us with a 20 man outfield squad that has usable depth in all departments.

By the way, continuing to build also sends important signals to your squad that you are looking to help them achieve their ambitions here, and it keeps your club's stock high amongst players you are looking to attract.

I really hope we do actually sign a few quality players, whether they cost 1p or £50m, because if we don't then it will be a wasted opportunity and we won't yield the same success as we would with that extra depth.
They struggled (comparatively) whenever Fernandinho was missing.
 



Iluvatar

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I'm saying that take out any of City's best players for an extended run of games and they'd still compete, and still probably win trophies. A bit like they did despite De Bruyne missing half the season.
Can you please stop peddling utter lies. You are choosing your own specific's to push an agenda which is fundamentally wrong.

I will prove your statement wrong with 1 example.

City with Fernandinho win rate 74.1%
City without Fernandinho win rate 64.3%


"The manager’s assessment that the Brazilian is indispensable is supported by City’s results with and without the midfielder in the starting XI under Guardiola. Of the 14 league outings for which Fernandinho has been absent, City have won nine – a success rate of 64.3%. In 81 matches with him, City have recorded 60 victories, or 74.1%. After the defeat to Leicester Guardiola said: “It is not necessary to lose three games from four to say how important Fernandinho is to us. It is a specific position, we don’t have his qualities again. He is an incredible player.”

What does that tell you? Yes City has depth if they lose De Bruyne (Mahrez, Silva, Silva, Foden etc.) but not all over the park. Just like us. They had to play Stones at DM 1 game for example.

You use Van Dijk as an example every single team will have players that if they get injured the team will potentially suffer, every team. You cannot have a back up to Van Dijk who comes in and sees no drop in quality, it took us long enough to get him, imagine trying to get another.

Certain players simply cannot be replaced or backed up easily, thats the nature of some players and some positions. It's very easy to mask over an injury to a forward because you can adapt your formation accordingly. It's also completely unrealistic to think you can have top quality backup's in every department - I again used the example of Left Back for City which again you ignore. Mendy got injured and they played Delph ffs. Thats' not quality depth, thats using a flexible player to fill a void - We use Milner in exactly the same way.

You aren't realistic at all, and underneath it all screams of a poster who still has a beef with FSG and that underpins every single post into agenda driven nonsense sadly.
 

Kopstar

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Can you please stop peddling utter lies. You are choosing your own specific's to push an agenda which is fundamentally wrong.

I will prove your statement wrong with 1 example.

City with Fernandinho win rate 74.1%
City without Fernandinho win rate 64.3%


"The manager’s assessment that the Brazilian is indispensable is supported by City’s results with and without the midfielder in the starting XI under Guardiola. Of the 14 league outings for which Fernandinho has been absent, City have won nine – a success rate of 64.3%. In 81 matches with him, City have recorded 60 victories, or 74.1%. After the defeat to Leicester Guardiola said: “It is not necessary to lose three games from four to say how important Fernandinho is to us. It is a specific position, we don’t have his qualities again. He is an incredible player.”

What does that tell you? Yes City has depth if they lose De Bruyne (Mahrez, Silva, Silva, Foden etc.) but not all over the park. Just like us. They had to play Stones at DM 1 game for example.

You use Van Dijk as an example every single team will have players that if they get injured the team will potentially suffer, every team. You cannot have a back up to Van Dijk who comes in and sees no drop in quality, it took us long enough to get him, imagine trying to get another.

Certain players simply cannot be replaced or backed up easily, thats the nature of some players and some positions. It's very easy to mask over an injury to a forward because you can adapt your formation accordingly. It's also completely unrealistic to think you can have top quality backup's in every department - I again used the example of Left Back for City which again you ignore. Mendy got injured and they played Delph ffs. Thats' not quality depth, thats using a flexible player to fill a void - We use Milner in exactly the same way.

You aren't realistic at all, and underneath it all screams of a poster who still has a beef with FSG and that underpins every single post into agenda driven nonsense sadly.
City lost 4 league games. Half of them were in the 9 games Fernandinho missed and those were against Crystal Palace and Leicester.

With Fernandinho they went 8 wins, 1 draw and 1 loss in the 10 games against the top six [GF 20, GA 5]. 2.5pts/game (2.66 overall, 101 points extended over a season).

In the 9 games he missed, all against teams who finished 8th or lower, they went 7 wins, 2 defeats [GF 17, GA 8]. 2.33pts/game (89 points over a season).
 

lfc.8

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The broader point is City are pretty well equipped in most positions. More so than Liverpool anyway. Regarding Fernandinho, according to reports, they're looking at Rodri who's a very good player and will further improve their team.

Our midfield needs to improve, attacking options need to improve and similar in defence also. There's more work which needs doing. Hopefully a few key players are signed.
 

Kopstar

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I agree with the sentiment but they did try and get Jorginho in the summer to give them depth there. I'm sure they'll rectify it in the next few weeks as well.
If we can include the players we tried to get but didn't our squad is way better than theirs.

On the other hand this discussion is better if just focusing on reality.
 



Limiescouse

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They struggled (comparatively) whenever Fernandinho was missing.
@RedForever2014 The above is important. It is commendable how well City did without such a good player. However, regardless of how good he is City have the specific players to step in and have them not lose much. You can actually argue the added responsibility was the making of Bernardo Silva and so worked in their favour a little bit.

However, if you took out Aguero or Fernandinho they would be in trouble. You can probably put Sterling in that category, especially in the scenario in which KdB is already out. Essentially what you have done is to compare our most vulnerable element to City's strongest. If you compared our squad to theirs by saying that we are able to cope by losing Gomez and Ox for essentially the whole season, but they've be fucked if they lost Fernandinho and Kun, you can make it look like we are the more robust squad.
 

Hope in your heart

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Where Jürgen comes from in Germany the people there are very similar to the Scots in that they are very careful with money, so he won't be throwing money around like it's going out of fashion. He knows the worth of money and will not be frivolous with it. Careful is the optimum word.
They also have another quality: they mostly act accordingly to what they say. He has said that there won't be big new incomings, and that he'll build on what he has. That's what he'll do then. I for one expect zero new big signing like last summer. I don't even believe that Lallana and Sturridge , if they decide to go, will be replaced by new incoming players.

Sturridge's place will be taken in by Brewster, Lallana's by Wilson, that's it. Two older and fading players being replaced by two young super-talents who are ready to break in. What's not to like about that? As a back-up for TAA, Hoever seems to be the one earmarked by Klopp. Fine with me. With Gomez being able to play at right back and if Milner stays with us a further season, that will provide largely enough depth for that position.

The player who might want to go and maybe can't be replaced from the inside is Moreno. Not sure that we have what it takes at the club for him. Rumours about Lloyd Kelly doing the rounds currently, certainly an interesting one to follow.

As for Mignolet, we'll have to see. Kelleher is surely a talented lad, but is he ready to be second goalkeeper at 21? Not sure. If Migs decides to leave, we might need to bring in an experienced hand as a back-up for Allisson (or bring back Karius?).

But for the rest, go with continuity. No need to rip up what seems to be a fantastic squad in terms of togetherness and moral strength. Of course, we shouldn't exclude any genuine opportunity, and I'm sure Klopp will watch what happens with interest. Bringing another 'x-factor' player would be pleasing for us fans, and a potential boost for the squad. If De Ligt becomes available, he shoud be considered, as he'd instantly provide better quality than Lovren for instance, and be a super-investment for the future, albeit an expensive one probably.

Let's see how it goes. I'm totally relaxed and confident that Klopp and co. will take the right decisions. They have a plan and work on it, but as shown in the past, they can also be flexible and take money in their hands if need be. If no big-name signing comes in, I'll be totally confident that the right depth for the next season will be provided from the inside, and that we will be stronger as a result.
 

Red over the water

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I am saying, quite simply, that the way to improve this squad to one which is insured against injuries, which can rotate in other departments the way we can in midfield, and which has more depth to compete on more fronts, is quite simply to take out the final 3 or 4 players from the Rodgers era who are not useful any more (Sturridge, Moreno, Lallana, Lovren), and sign 3 or 4 quality players to leave us with a 20 man outfield squad that has usable depth in all departments.
Good post, and I especially like the distilled part here. I’m seeing a fair amount of consensus emerging in this sort of direction, obviously how we get there remains to be seen.

E.g.
Sturridge - Brewster
Moreno - Kelly
Lallana - Bergwijn
Lovren - ranges from sign De Ligt to do nothing, for now

Depending on what happens with Mignolet we might need a back up goalkeeper too. We’ve got two talented kids, but if something happens to Alisson I’d want someone with experience coming in.
 

Red over the water

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Zaha does indeed look like a very good player. He has a lot of pace and can beat a defender for fun. The numbers aren’t perhaps as good as they should be, in terms of goals and assists, but on the other hand, you would have to think they will improve markedly if he played in an elite team.

I would be happy if we signed him, but the only slight concern is the price. We would have to pay elite player money, possibly a transfer record for us, and he’s not quite that level.

So arguably someone like Bergwijn - fast winger who can beat a man and score goals, at half the price, might be the way to go?
 



William Clarke

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Zaha does indeed look like a very good player. He has a lot of pace and can beat a defender for fun. The numbers aren’t perhaps as good as they should be, in terms of goals and assists, but on the other hand, you would have to think they will improve markedly if he played in an elite team.

I would be happy if we signed him, but the only slight concern is the price. We would have to pay elite player money, possibly a transfer record for us, and he’s not quite that level.

So arguably someone like Bergwijn - fast winger who can beat a man and score goals, at half the price, might be the way to go?
I'm with your way of thinking. Yeah, Zaha's a good player but would be costly, plus it has to be remembered that he didn't do that well at Manure when he was there. It's possible he may have big club syndrome - big fish in little pond, little fish in big pond, if you see what I mean? Therefore, a fast, tricky winger like Bergwijn could be a better option.
 

RedSeven

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Brandt (25mln), Ziyech (25mln), LB & RB cover?, backup for Alisson if Mignolet leaves. Would be good for me.
Throw in Sessegnon and Alderweireld and you have improved the squad hugely for roughly 100mp.
 

zman89

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Throw in Sessegnon and Alderweireld and you have improved the squad hugely for roughly 100mp.
I'm not convinced by Sessegnon but in theory he could cover the LB and LW spot and he's english so he would be perfect. Alderweireld is a tad old now and he would be looking for astronomical wages. Would be ok with him if he asked for reasonable wages though as 25 million is peanuts nowadays.
 



redfanman

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Dwight Mcneil is another who could probably do the left back/left wing thing. Don't think he's played at LB for Burnley yet but I don't see why he couldn't. He's a quality footballer.
Are the players at Burnley coming through their academy or from elsewhere as they seem to be finding several good players recently. We've been in awe of their keepers (bar Joe Hart) and they have that right back/winger who has done well since January, and now this lad you are telling us about!
 

Monument Mark

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First we win the Champions League final. Then put in a world record offer for Mbappe. After PSG's 3-2 CL defeat at Anfield, for me, his body language was screaming - I'd Love To Be A Part Of What Jurgen Is Doing. Revolutionise football with the best ever front four in the Premier League. And win that title next season with those missing extra goals.
 

William Clarke

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First we win the Champions League final. Then put in a world record offer for Mbappe. After PSG's 3-2 CL defeat at Anfield, for me, his body language was screaming - I'd Love To Be A Part Of What Jurgen Is Doing. Revolutionise football with the best ever front four in the Premier League. And win that title next season with those missing extra goals.
I don't think Jürgen would endorse spending big money this summer transfer window and especially on a forward. I think this is a summer of cheaper transfers and not too many of them at that. Personally, I would be made up if we got our hands on Mbappe, but he's at the club he always wanted to be at, so can't see him wanting to leave any time soon.
 

Thomas1195

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Are the players at Burnley coming through their academy or from elsewhere as they seem to be finding several good players recently. We've been in awe of their keepers (bar Joe Hart) and they have that right back/winger who has done well since January, and now this lad you are telling us about!
Burnley also has James Tarkowski - CB, who has quite impressive stats over the last season. Leicester already picked him as a replacement for Maguire, but we can raid him easily if we want.