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Who would you buy?

CymruRed

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Any player who turns us down,as they don't see themselves being a first team starter,doesn't deserve to be given the opportunity anyway,as far as i'm concerned.

It's a squad game,as others have posted in here and are better at it than me,i don't know the exact numbers of games/minutes each player would/could get over the season,but for any player with ambitions of winning things or making a name for themselves, would jump at the idea of playing for LFC right now.Our first 11 almost picks itself, but i'd like to see young hungry players come in and want to push themselves to not only get to the level of our first 11 but to get better and force them out,thats the players i want to see come in.

EDIT* Forgot to mention aswell,by having the attitude of not coming to LFC because they won't be first choice,also tells me they aren't mentally strong enough or back their own ability to be better than what we have to force there way in aswell.
 
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Anfield rd Dreamer

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Point it out all you want, historically having tonnes of players is not Klopps approach. He has a small close knit first 18 or so with some experience and youth filling in gaps.

How many games does Messi play? Or Ronaldo? Or any great player? They play when fit 99 times out of 100 because they want to, they want minutes to break records, they strive to be the best and will do everything to achieve it.
Klopp likes a close knit group yeah so swapping a season and a half of cover players for one flexible player makes sense yeah?

There are leagues that require less rotation than ours. During his time with United how many games was Robaldo starting per season? Even though he's famous for being one of the most physically impressive players (practically a freak of nature) I still don't think he'd have been starting 50+ games per season during his time there. Certainly not 60+ like some seem to be hinting may happen with some of our players. I'll be surprised if Klopp and the fitness team want to start anyone except Alisson in more than 45 games. They may take the odd risk when they have to that leads to that happening but its increasing the risk of injuries to do so.
 

redfanman

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Not sure what the overriding arc is here, the situations would never be the same, how could they?

If we wanted a direct comparison as a template we have to follow then someone has to ask robbo to under perform for eighteen months and then we need to sign a fullback from a relegated team.

Jokes aside, obviously no two situations will ever be the same, I get improving on Moreno is fundamentally easier than improving on robbo himself, but that’s not what we are trying to achieve, I would have thought having three fullbacks over sixty games playing for a club that is reigning champions of Europe and went deep into a title race wouldn’t be an impossible sell.
No one is saying it is an impossible sell - just a difficult one.

You brought up Robbo as an example of where we brought in someone and gave him 30 games. I was pointing out that the circumstances were different and that even he wasn't happy with a lack of game time until he got the regular starting birth.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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No one is saying it is an impossible sell - just a difficult one.

You brought up Robbo as an example of where we brought in someone and gave him 30 games. I was pointing out that the circumstances were different and that even he wasn't happy with a lack of game time until he got the regular starting birth.
Yet he still "only" started 49 last year and definitely looked leggy at times.
 

melbournered

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Any player who turns us down,as they don't see themselves being a first team starter,doesn't deserve to be given the opportunity anyway,as far as i'm concerned.

It's a squad game,as others have posted in here and are better at it than me,i don't know the exact numbers of games/minutes each player would/could get over the season,but for any player with ambitions of winning things or making a name for themselves, would jump at the idea of playing for LFC right now.Our first 11 almost picks itself, but i'd like to see young hungry players come in and want to push themselves to not only get to the level of our first 11 but to get better and force them out,thats the players i want to see come in.

EDIT* Forgot to mention aswell,by having the attitude of not coming to LFC because they won't be first choice,also tells me they aren't mentally strong enough or back their own ability to be better than what we have to force there way in aswell.
What a good post. You're edit is very relevant as well. I would like to add that, we all know the premium that Jurgen places on players having good character.
An ambitious player with that attribute, who is willing to be a team player, will prosper in the culture that Jurgen has developed in his short time with us.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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Not sure why that is relevant. The point under discussion is of the difficulty in bringing in suitable players not in the merits of having said players.
But the argument of how hard it is, I believe, only in the minds of fans. I don't believe any professional footballer would see it that way. A top team in every competition with only 2 players for 2 positions a player isn't going to think "but when will I play"! He'll think "not much competition for places, great manager, good quality teammates and great chance of winning medals....oh and competitive salary too!"!

Robertson got played into the ground, there was definitely talk of looking tired after some games towards the end of the season. That was with him starting 49, could play as many as 20 games more than that. Probably at least 10 more. That's assuming Robertson goes a second season with no injuries, if he gets even a short term injury he won't get as many starts next season as this. That figure really is the maximum.
 

redfanman

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But the argument of how hard it is, I believe, only in the minds of fans. I don't believe any professional footballer would see it that way.
Then by extension, you must also think that Klopp and Edwards are not trying to fill that gap, despite the club saying there were trying to?
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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Then by extension, you must also think that Klopp and Edwards are not trying to fill that gap, despite the club saying there were trying to?
I think we are. I think what the club says and does are not always the same. Its fans that listen to the press releases then argue the wisdom of it and deny the worry the others feel.
 

scouseheadross

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In summary, we're going to play a lot of games but decent players possibly might not come here to be backup and Klopp likes working with a small core anyway.

The solution to me seems a flexible squad with players like Milner and talented youth coming through.

Where is that youth? Lijnders is a great youth coach, Klopp a great senior manager whos been here three years and isn't scared of blooding kids, Michael 'fucking' Edwards doing transfers but only Trent has really come through.

Other kids like Curtis Jones look to have a bright future. Camacho was nearly at the level. Brewster an unknown. Wilson can't do a lot more to prove himself so we're doing a lot of things right.

Nothing for lb yet though apart from that Colombian kid Arroyo. Physical and quite talented by all accounts but no chance of a work permit yet.
 

Mascot88

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I think we are. I think what the club says and does are not always the same. Its fans that listen to the press releases then argue the wisdom of it and deny the worry the others feel.
Well, the club tried for Lloyd Kelly, so we clearly are in for a left back.

I do think some of the frustrations are bourne in part by a sense of ‘unconcious incompetence’ amongst fans. Not so much here, but certainly out on Twitter, where there is much panic and gnashing of teeth and why don’t we just fucking sign someone!

I do think the club are trying to be opportunistic. Not panic into signing players who aren’t ideal. We might have to wait and be patient. I think the club is looking and keeping track of what is happening, and if the right player becomes available we go for it. But the club is also confident that with Milner and Gomez, and possibly Clyne, we can cover.

Whatever, I trust the club know what they are doing.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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Klopp likes a close knit group yeah so swapping a season and a half of cover players for one flexible player makes sense yeah?

There are leagues that require less rotation than ours. During his time with United how many games was Robaldo starting per season? Even though he's famous for being one of the most physically impressive players (practically a freak of nature) I still don't think he'd have been starting 50+ games per season during his time there. Certainly not 60+ like some seem to be hinting may happen with some of our players. I'll be surprised if Klopp and the fitness team want to start anyone except Alisson in more than 45 games. They may take the odd risk when they have to that leads to that happening but its increasing the risk of injuries to do so.
Just to build on this I've only just had the chance to check the figures. Whilst at United Ronaldo didn't start more than 50 games ever. Two seasons he started more than 45. At Juve he started less than 45 probably due to his age even though it is a slower league. Whilst at Real it was about 50% on seasons he started 50+ games or seasons he started less than 50. This is a guy who is famous for being about as physically gifted as it gets and has always been undisputed star everywhere he goes. Still never made it to the realms of 55+ starts even when in Spain where some of his games were walk in the park jobs. In fact the other player famous for always playing and carrying teams on his back Messi has only hit 50 or more starts 3 times in the last 10 seasons. So even in less physical leagues famous for needing less rotation it's still rare for even the very best to get more than 45 starts. As it stands half our ideal starting 11 may need to do it next season to see us through such a fixture heavy year.
 

rab

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Don't buy the "it's difficult to find someone of quality who'd accept being viewed as a backup."

Firstly, we shouldn't be looking for backup, we should be looking at competition.

Secondly, it's a squad game. No one expects that Robertson can start and play every minute of every game. Same with Trent. Arguably, the reason Trent got into the team in the first place was because of injuries to others. Robertson wasn't bought as a guaranteed starter but took his chance when it came.

No one can convince me that there isn't a player anywhere in the world who is 90% as good as Robertson who wouldn't be ecstatic at the chance to come here and compete to be in this team.
 

Bonus

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Everyone seems to be assuming that there won't be any injuries all season. If Robbo is missing for a month or two it could completely derail our chances. I like the Tierney option and don't think he'd only get meaningless league cup games. It's quite possible that he'd replace TAA in situations where we need more defensive solidity

I am a big fan of Tierney,
but I am not a fan of him at RB, dont get me wrong he can play there,
but he never fills me with confidence when he plays there for Scotland.
(or maybe its just because its Scotland and we are crap)

For me, he's best suited to playing on the left, LB, LCB, LMF or even LCM

he is a very talented player though, fearless.
 

Prolix

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[...]
No one can convince me that there isn't a player anywhere in the world who is 90% as good as Robertson who wouldn't be ecstatic at the chance to come here and compete to be in this team.
Then why haven't we signed them?
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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Then why haven't we signed them?
Loads of our signings weren't made by this stage. Robertson was signed "quite early" on 21st July. VvD for special reasons took an extra 6 months and Keita we had to wait a year for. Alisson was 19th July. Ox wasn't till 31st August.
 

SadiosMio

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I’ve had enough of this kind of thing. You’ve been warned time and time again.

Two days off.
If you're going to ban me for disengaging from people that are trying to make trouble, then it's obvious you have it out for me and you're going to do what you had your mind set on for a while.

It's wrong, but you won't care, as long as you protect your little fiefdom (very little, very few regular posters compared to, say, redcafe, which is much better run and tolerant despite being a manc site) and the people who pay patronage to your fake power, just like you were a fake mascot rightly told by Kenny to fuck off.

Go on then, do us both a favor. I've already proven right about everything I've said here, so my work here is done, really. Pepe, Fernandes, De Ligt...was right about it all. Look forward to the big 2020 signings after a champions league/league double. :-)
 
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Anfield rd Dreamer

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Because it's the 8th of July.
Not to mention Klopp is highly particular on targets. Just because we haven't brought a player in doesn't mean we don't want to or that we aren't working on it. If there is a player out there Klopp wants for a position he wants to fill he may well wait for perfect timing even if that is a delay. That doesn't mean there aren't players who could do the job available, wanting to come and at a decent price. But Klopp will ignore those good options if the perfect option is going to be available to him at some point soon.
 

Mascot88

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Why is it that you ban me every time I block someone? It's like you'd rather let the rabble rousers keep rousing.


If you're going to ban me for disengaging from people that are trying to make trouble, then it's obvious you have it out for me and you're going to do what you had your mind set
on for a while.

It's wrong, but you won't care, as long as you protect your little fiefdom (very little, very few regular posters compared to, say, redcafe, which is much better run) and the people who pay patronage to your fake power, just like you were a fake mascot rightly told by Kenny to fuck off.

Go on then, do us both a favor. I've already proven right about everything I've said here, so my work here is done, really.
Said like a sad bastard, for whom this ‘open an account, lose the plot, get banned’ routine has taken in the dreary monotony of a tired heartbeat.

If only banning you could cure you if this affliction. As is, we’ll just bid you farewell for now, and see you in a while under you 745th new name. And maybe you’ll last a bit longer before you blow your cover by throwing insults and snide a people for daring to have a different opinion about the football.
 

SadiosMio

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Said like a sad bastard, for whom this ‘open an account, lose the plot, get banned’ routine has taken in the dreary monotony of a tired heartbeat.

If only banning you could cure you if this affliction. As is, we’ll just bid you farewell for now, and see you in a while under you 745th new name. And maybe you’ll last a bit longer before you blow your cover by throwing insults and snide a people for daring to have a different opinion about the football.
Still not whoever this is that lives rent-free in your head.

If you ever meet me, you'll know. I'll give you the courtesy of introducing myself before you decide to run or not.

Quite ironic that blocking someone that's being a dumbass to avoid further confrontation to you = "lose the plot". You are really fucking thick.
 

Mascot88

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:celebrating:
 



bazza66

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I banged on about this player (and Dendoncker) previously. Still to early for that letter to Santa, but I'd still quite like Tielemans. Yes he's another box to box midfielder, but he seems to have an eye for goal; and the opportunity for him to learn from Milner, at such a young age, would be great. He's also not work-shy or afraid of defensive work. Rabiot without the baggage? Anyway, i think his permanent move to Leicester is due soon, as personal terms are agreed.
 

Zinedine Biscan

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I banged on about this player (and Dendoncker) previously. Still to early for that letter to Santa, but I'd still quite like Tielemans. Yes he's another box to box midfielder, but he seems to have an eye for goal; and the opportunity for him to learn from Milner, at such a young age, would be great. He's also not work-shy or afraid of defensive work. Rabiot without the baggage? Anyway, i think his permanent move to Leicester is due soon, as personal terms are agreed.
Yeah, seems set for Leicester. Did very well for them last season and looked to have adapted immediately to the PL.
 

Mousecat

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Personally, I think city knew exactly what they were doing allowing that ball all but 11mm over their goal line. Luck had nothing to do with it. :D
Think we let Newcastle go blow for blow with us as well... just to make it interesting.
 

Mousecat

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So obvious and yet you didn't accept that it contributed towards City's 98 points but we were lucky to get 97.
This is about game control. The end. You can define luck in different ways, you're free to do that. I'm defining it as winning in games where you didnt have control. You say injuries etc, I say they are more variables whereas the amount of game control you have is a constant. This is the logic I'm using. I think it's pretty solid logic. I would. I'm the one saying it.

Whereas you, on the other hand, think focusing on Fernandinho is the logical thing to do. And Mascot thinks Kompany scoring a goal because City had Leicester so penned into their own half that he was afforded a free shot from outside the area, also constitutes the same kind of luck.

Both things I find illogical. Am I allowed to say illogical? Is it a banning offence? If it is, well, so be it, but I must stand by what I believe. Because to expect to control things outside of your own ability to control is illogical.

If you believe in gods, you are free to pray to them. Is there a god of injuries? Have a word about Naby Keita if you get in touch with him.

Anyway... like I say, City had more control of their games. If they again have as much more control over their opponents than we did, we won't finish as close to them this time around. That's my belief. So that defines my stance on "luck" That's a logical perspective I would think. Which is why I believe we will look to improve this area of our play, whether by investing in the players we've already got to be fit, or in the market.

The transfer market that is, not the tea leaf one.