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Who would you buy?

Iluvatar

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How? "Yes Mr Klopp as I was saying Mr Mane has really really overplayed recently, hes in what we call the red zone. Maybe if you field Mr Lallana instead for a game or two? Oh yes hes injured isn't he? How about Alex? When is he back? Moreno? Does Origi offer anything from that position... yes I know you've played him there a few times already like we asked and I understand he stunk the place up with his limited build up play but. ... well.... he did score a few goals for you...."!

At the moment we are literally in a position where Liverpool play some of the best football on the planet. Providing Firmino, Mane and Salah are all playing and in at least ok form. When that isn't the case we may have the odd cracking result here and there but a run of 5-15 games or something? Not a chance. Anymore than a handful of games without them starting and we really start creaking. We certainly don't play anywhere near as good when them three are tired like the start of the year when all three were looking sluggish.

The staff are only human not miracle workers, they'll keep the players fit, get them back up to speed asap after injuries and keep Klopp updated on who is tired and at risk of injury (as I'm sure they were doing before Firmino got injured), but Klopp has to use what he has. If, for arguments sake, Mabappe 2020 is a real thing then Klopp will just do his best to get through this next year till he can bring him in. During that year Klopp will have to decide on a game by game basis on whether to risk overplaying players and risking injuries or jeopardising results by resting players when he doesn't really have perfect cover to come in for them.
What a strange response, Klopp has his players welfare above everything else. If they were at risk of injury from fatigue (as advised by the huge sports science team we employ) he’d rest them.

If you bothered to do some research you’d find Salah and Firmino in the top 10 players in the world for durability and ability to keep fit.
 

KYRed18

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The point remains that we achieved what we did with the current squad because those for whom there is not adequate back up didn't get injured last season.

That isn't the level of depth necessary to ensure competitiveness if one player for the forward department goes down for any length of time.

The front three, in particular, have not had a summer off and are going to feel it at some point this season, by way of fatigue or potential overuse based injuries.

I agree that Robertson is a tricky one because we're talking about very specific and direct back up for one position. But it doesn't mean it shouldn't be addressed somehow.

The front three is a different situation. In a 60 match season that's 180 required appearances for the three positions, enough for 45 matches each for four similar level players.

Without a 4th proven quality forward we are very vulnerable to a long term injury to one of the front three, and for me such a forward should be being signed this summer.
So you think a star player (Salah, Mane type, hell even Bobby) would be happy sitting out 25% of the games? That's what you are arguing for correct?
 

Speckydodge

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What a strange response, Klopp has his players welfare above everything else. If they were at risk of injury from fatigue (as advised by the huge sports science team we employ) he’d rest them.

If you bothered to do some research you’d find Salah and Firmino in the top 10 players in the world for durability and ability to keep fit.
Also Klopp has a background qualification in sports science himself and is acutely aware of the importance of it, he also completely trusts MR Origi and Mr Lallana and who are we doubt his judgement.
 

Claymenza

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Origi, Sturridge, shaqiri, lallana, keita, gomez were more than capable subs.
They were reliable enough that we could loan out a very capable clyne.

I'm with the sentiment that if klopp trusts the likes of lallana/henderson/lovren, we should give them the benefit of the doubt.
 

Mascot88

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The point remains that we achieved what we did with the current squad because those for whom there is not adequate back up didn't get injured last season.
No. We achieved what we achieved because we have a boss gang of lads who are better at football than all the other teams in Europe.

It’s about time you got to grips with that, and it’s about time you got to grips with the way Klopp wants to manage this team, which thus far has been hugely successful.

You basically keep posting the same thing over and over again. But it doesn’t change the fact that Klopp will not churn players, will not spend money when there are other options within the squad, will give young players a chance, and values a tight knit squad of players he can cultivate a close bond with.

At some point you need to have the courage of your convictions and actually admit that you don’t support the manager and want him replaced. Everything about the way you want to go about this football lark is conpletely at odds with the man.

That isn't the level of depth necessary to ensure competitiveness if one player for the forward department goes down for any length of time.

The front three, in particular, have not had a summer off and are going to feel it at some point this season, by way of fatigue or potential overuse based injuries.
I think you need to give the medical and sports science team a bit of credit. There is a reason Klopp has brought in the best in the business. You can’t do anything about impact injuries, they can happen to anyone at anytime, and you certainly can’t stockpile players on the offchance one happens. But we won’t be pushing lads into the red and risking strains and tears.

I agree that Robertson is a tricky one because we're talking about very specific and direct back up for one position. But it doesn't mean it shouldn't be addressed somehow.
Like looking within the existing squad for solutions? Or do you just mean buy a player?

The front three is a different situation. In a 60 match season that's 180 required appearances for the three positions, enough for 45 matches each for four similar level players.

Without a 4th proven quality forward we are very vulnerable to a long term injury to one of the front three, and for me such a forward should be being signed this summer.
And we should probably see how it pans out before jumping to conclusions.

Besides as Ubermick said, Origi has absolutely deserved to be considered a front six player, and everyone at the club seems to really believe in Brewster. He might have the kind of breakout year that renders this conversation void.

Also I think we will play 4231 on occasions with allows Salah, Mane or Firmino to get a game off while still putting eleven quality players on the pitch.

There are options, even without signing anyone. I think the club should have earned your trust, and Klopp in particular. If the boss says he is fine with what he has, his performance so far should be enough for any fan to accept that and look forward to the season.
 

Mascot88

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At the moment we are literally in a position where Liverpool play some of the best football on the planet. Providing Firmino, Mane and Salah are all playing and in at least ok form.
Not sure, but I seem to remember our boys delivering Barcelona the kind of thumping that they may not recover from, and I’m sure that Firmino and Salah weren’t playing.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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Not sure, but I seem to remember our boys delivering Barcelona the kind of thumping that they may not recover from, and I’m sure that Firmino and Salah weren’t playing.
I did say we may have the odd cracking result here and there. Or do you believe that's how we will play every time we face that circumstance? Because seriously if that was a normal game and what we can expect why aren't we always playing that line up?
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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What a strange response, Klopp has his players welfare above everything else. If they were at risk of injury from fatigue (as advised by the huge sports science team we employ) he’d rest them.

If you bothered to do some research you’d find Salah and Firmino in the top 10 players in the world for durability and ability to keep fit.
Firmino played a run of 5 games over 17 days in April. He only got rests in 2 of them playing 88% of the minutes available. He then picked up the kind of muscle injury associated with fatigue and being overplayed.
 

Flobs

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Firmino played a run of 5 games over 17 days in April. He only got rests in 2 of them playing 88% of the minutes available. He then picked up the kind of muscle injury associated with fatigue and being overplayed.
Which kind of muscle injury was that?
How do you know it was the kind of muscle injury associated with fatigue and overplaying?
Couldn't it have been one caused by being kicked in training or tackled in training or ...?
 

Mascot88

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I did say we may have the odd cracking result here and there. Or do you believe that's how we will play every time we face that circumstance? Because seriously if that was a normal game and what we can expect why aren't we always playing that line up?
It was an outstanding performance, possibly the best Anfield has seen. But we don’t need to play to that level every week.

A Liverpool starting Origi and Shaqiri over Salah and Firmino still has enough to beat most teams in the league.

A front three of Mane Salah and Firmino is still obviously the best we can put out. But I don’t think the drop off is quite as severe as you make out. Origi and Brewster, with Shaq and Ox able to drop in as well is still pretty good, and those options increase again if we move to a 4231.

Not saying we shouldn’t sign another forward - I think we should. But, like with Robertson, it isn’t the end of the world if we don’t.
 

Chewbazza

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It was an outstanding performance, possibly the best Anfield has seen. But we don’t need to play to that level every week.

A Liverpool starting Origi and Shaqiri over Salah and Firmino still has enough to beat most teams in the league.

A front three of Mane Salah and Firmino is still obviously the best we can put out. But I don’t think the drop off is quite as severe as you make out. Origi and Brewster, with Shaq and Ox able to drop in as well is still pretty good, and those options increase again if we move to a 4231.

Not saying we shouldn’t sign another forward - I think we should. But, like with Robertson, it isn’t the end of the world if we don’t.
Yes and just because we start with Orgi or Brewster or Ox or Shaqiri instead of or in combination with Mane/Salah/Bobby, doesn't mean they can't be on the bench and come on if needed.

Is it so unlikely that think of starting Origi or Shaqiri against the likes of Norwich, Brighton or Sheffield Utd and having a fresh Mane or Salah to bring on for the last 30 mins against a tiring defence IF needed.

If it were up to me entirely I would be looking to bring in a forward to play both wings, but if for whatever reason Klopp does not bring one in, then so be it.

Anyway, god forbid if we don't buy someone and then don't win a trophy, this place will be a nightmare.
 

Dutch

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The problem for me will not be mixing it up now and then but if serious injuries happen. Are going to play Shaq or Brewster for 6 months? Still, think we need an extra outstanding attacker as City have.
 

Iluvatar

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Firmino played a run of 5 games over 17 days in April. He only got rests in 2 of them playing 88% of the minutes available. He then picked up the kind of muscle injury associated with fatigue and being overplayed.
You still miss my original point. I'm not saying we don't need rotational options. I think it is;

Brewster
Origi
Kent or Wilson - If they prove themselves in pre-season and if they don't we go to market.

Unless a target of opportunity comes up.
 

Chewbazza

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You still miss my original point. I'm not saying we don't need rotational options. I think it is;

Brewster
Origi
Kent or Wilson - If they prove themselves in pre-season and if they don't we go to market.

Unless a target of opportunity comes up.
But Brewster CANNOT start more than 5 games because he's only 13 years old. Origi is only capable of scoring in high pressure situations and Kent/Wilson looked a bit leggy against Bradford for 45 minutes.

It is ESSENTIAL we buy Mbappe AND Icardi AND Neymar.

If Salah or Mane fall off a barstool and miss half the season we will definitely be relegated.
 

Iluvatar

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But Brewster CANNOT start more than 5 games because he's only 13 years old. Origi is only capable of scoring in high pressure situations and Kent/Wilson looked a bit leggy against Bradford for 45 minutes.

It is ESSENTIAL we buy Mbappe AND Icardi AND Neymar.

If Salah or Mane fall off a barstool and miss half the season we will definitely be relegated.
Our squad depth is so bad we are 2 injuries away from an emergency loan to get this guy https://www.linkedin.com/in/johnterry26/?originalSubdomain=uk in.
 

KYRed18

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The problem for me will not be mixing it up now and then but if serious injuries happen. Are going to play Shaq or Brewster for 6 months? Still, think we need an extra outstanding attacker as City have.
Who are you classifying as outstanding Mahrez or Jesus? Out of curiosity.
 

KYRed18

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Jesus, but they often start without Sané too. Hope Brewster will be the real deal but he is still unproven.
Sane is the real deal so I am not arguing there but I see him starting more this year with D Silva getting phased out pushing B Silva to MF and opening a winger spot, now to Jesus

In the EPL/CL Jesus (22 years old) played 1395 mins and scored 11 goals and 3 assists (I ignored the two domestic cups because of the shit competition)

This results in 1 goal every 127 mins played or 1 key (goal or assist) every 100 mins.

Divock's stats (24 years old) 6 Goals and 1 assist in 583 mins played in EPL/CL

Results in 1 goal every 97 mins and 1 key (goal or assist) every 83 mins.

I know how stats work and sample sizes are drastically different, but I am one of those who don't rate Jesus highly. I think he's an athletic talented forward who has temper issues which cause him to lose composure. I also believe he's a flat track bully who beats up on less talented teams. Last year he scored against Huddersfield, Everton (3 times, guess I do like him more for that), Wolves, and Palace (1 of two away goals).

I just don't classify him as elite (aka no drop off between him and Aguero) because what Aguero does for that club is truly unreal. Reminds me a lot of a certain striker who used to play for us.
 

GermanRed

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I realise it's not a popular opinion, but both are better than Origi
Sané, Jesus and Mahrez all 'better' to our last seasons bench players Shaqiri and Origi.

Wouldn’t say that their three played a big part in winning them the league.

Our two helped us winning the CL.

Jesus cost them double the prize of Shaqiri and Origi combined. They paid £120m for Mahrez and Sane combined.

Their three were unhappy over the course of the season and thought and maybe are still thinking about leaving.

Our two delivered whenever we needed them.
 

GermanRed

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Yea but I was what happens if we get long injuries, that is my point. Four WC attackers are not strange for a top club as Liverpool is.
I‘m relaxed.

The manager would find solutions. We all know that.

Injuries to one player mean opportunities for others.
 



KillerBeeLFC

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Theres been a lot of stuff said about us falling behind if we dont buy but if city lose Sane I would deffo say they have got weaker. Him and Sterling are the 2 players they have with the lightning pace. They will still win the vast majority of games but defending against them may be easier with one less player with scary pace. Could cost them a couple of points through the season.
All wishful thinking of course but we lost the league by small percentage last year maybe we can win it by a small percentage this year
 

ILLOK

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What's all this about everybody else improving?

Chelsea have lost their best player, Tottenham's defence looks like it's getting ripped up and City have lost Kompany and Delph, bringing in Angelino and Rodri.

Where is the major improvement?

United and Arsenal are too far away to care about. Everton will spend the GDP of a small African nation and will manage to go backwards.

We have had players return from loan and injury to bolster the squad. The players who were bought last season will be ready from day one this season, particularly Fabinho but also Keita should be in a better position to contribute, and you could include Origi and Shaqiri in that group too. Bernardo's improvement from season 1 to 2 is the most obvious example of this.
 

KillerBeeLFC

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What's all this about everybody else improving?

Chelsea have lost their best player, Tottenham's defence looks like it's getting ripped up and City have lost Kompany and Delph, bringing in Angelino and Rodri.

Where is the major improvement?

United and Arsenal are too far away to care about. Everton will spend the GDP of a small African nation and will manage to go backwards.

We have had players return from loan and injury to bolster the squad. The players who were bought last season will be ready from day one this season, particularly Fabinho but also Keita should be in a better position to contribute, and you could include Origi and Shaqiri in that group too. Bernardo's improvement from season 1 to 2 is the most obvious example of this.
Yea Kompany is massive for them, its almost like losing Van Dijk for them I'd say. They've been trying the find his replacement for years with no luck. Plus, hopefully losing Sane too.
Hilarious that Peps whinging about not having money to spend ha maybe if you hadn't of bought 150 mills worth of full backs last year you'd have some money left you daft c*nt.
Just holding on to our best players would be a massive step in the right direction for us though and as you say, players are already bedded in plus Ox is back. It really is looking like we are in the driving seat this year
 

Zinedine Biscan

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Yea Kompany is massive for them, its almost like losing Van Dijk for them I'd say. They've been trying the find his replacement for years with no luck. Plus, hopefully losing Sane too.
Hilarious that Peps whinging about not having money to spend ha maybe if you hadn't of bought 150 mills worth of full backs last year you'd have some money left you daft c*nt.
Just holding on to our best players would be a massive step in the right direction for us though and as you say, players are already bedded in plus Ox is back. It really is looking like we are in the driving seat this year
While I don't think Kompany has been anything like as key for them in recent years - he's been injured so often they had to learn to mostly play without him - I think going into the season with only three senior CBs (two of which, Stones and Otamendi, are hardly top-drawer either) looks like the sort of thing that could potentially derail a season.