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Who would you buy?

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Dave-D

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Lemar! Di Marzio just reported that Roma are still trying to get Shaq, and even though I like the guy, it's becoming pretty obvious that Jurgen is not THAT interested in keeping him. So I'd let him go and bring in Lemar as a backup option for Sadio + we might convert him into number 8 like Pep did with Silva/De Bruyne which means he could also be part of the midfield trio against weaker opponents. All in all, would really love to see Lemar at the club!
Why would Liverpool get rid of Shaqiri halfway through the season for a player who Atletico are looking to offload as he has done nothing for them. He has ONE assist and zero goals why would Liverpool want him.
 

Sweeting

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Any of which you think could fit the profile Sweeting set out and could be useful options for us (providing they worked out obviously)?
I don't know enough about European football to know players from other countries but there a few examples of the "type" of player I think we may go after (not that it would necessarily be these exact guys but they fit the mould)

1. Emi Buendia - has come through the FL with Norwich, inconsistent but superb on his day. Creates nearly two chances a game for a team with very little attacking threat.

2. Philip Billing - headed towards his second relegation in two years but is a shoe in for Bournemouth POTY and his stats are strong.
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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I don't know enough about European football to know players from other countries but there a few examples of the "type" of player I think we may go after (not that it would necessarily be these exact guys but they fit the mould)

1. Emi Buendia - has come through the FL with Norwich, inconsistent but superb on his day. Creates nearly two chances a game for a team with very little attacking threat.

2. Philip Billing - headed towards his second relegation in two years but is a shoe in for Bournemouth POTY and his stats are strong.
Sorry must have misunderstood, I was thinking you were meaning more "former prospects" that it hasn't all been plain sailing for and now ready for a move to the right environment where they can kick on and finally hit that elusive peak. Guys like VvD and Wijnaldum were always fancied when younger but never quite enough to get picked up by a top team willing to take a chance so ended up taking a longer, tougher route to get here (although VvD never had a diminished reputation, just went strength to strength). I was thinking more like how Lemar two years ago was 22 and we were apparently willing to pay 75 million for him, he's then had the wrong move and it's gone a bit wrong for him and at 24, no longer a prospect, probably available at just over half what we were willing to pay, if we were still interested and confident of getting out of him what we predicted back then it would seem like a good move under what I thought you were putting forward.

For the record I no longer think we would be looking at Lemar, i think he dates back to when we were looking at 4231 moving forward and leaving 433 behind. Although I may be wrong. Maybe we are looking at;

Henderson, Wijnaldum, Fabinho, Milner, Keita and Grujic for the 2.

Ox, Keita, Firmino, Mane, Minamino, Elliot, Jones and maybe Shaqiri, Wilson or a new signing for the 3.

Salah, Origi and Brewster for the 1.

Could go that way. Personally prefer 433 though.

But only used Lemar as a high profile example of what I thought you meant.
 

Nikola

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I don't know enough about European football to know players from other countries but there a few examples of the "type" of player I think we may go after (not that it would necessarily be these exact guys but they fit the mould)

1. Emi Buendia - has come through the FL with Norwich, inconsistent but superb on his day. Creates nearly two chances a game for a team with very little attacking threat.

2. Philip Billing - headed towards his second relegation in two years but is a shoe in for Bournemouth POTY and his stats are strong.
Both look the type of transfers Southampton or Tottenham would have made five years ago or so. Or the types of transfers I'd be desperate for Liverpool to complete, erm, five years ago... But half-joking aside, there are some rather decent players about to get relegated, so maybe Liverpool will pounce again. I can't really pick between Cantwell and Buendia, I really liked both (though I'm not sure how they'd fit into Klopp's 4-3-3), while Aarons and Lewis also looked decent (though I've paid more attention to Lewis because Liverpool don't have a natural second left back at the moment). I'm afraid that Norwich will be picked apart once they go down, which is a real shame because of their fearless but naive football.

I think that Watford are about to save themselves, otherwise I would have liked Liverpool to have a look at Sarr. He's electric, even if pretty inconsistent in the final third. I'd be surprised if they weren't already tracking him, though.
 

Sweeting

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Sorry must have misunderstood, I was thinking you were meaning more "former prospects" that it hasn't all been plain sailing for and now ready for a move to the right environment where they can kick on and finally hit that elusive peak. Guys like VvD and Wijnaldum were always fancied when younger but never quite enough to get picked up by a top team willing to take a chance so ended up taking a longer, tougher route to get here (although VvD never had a diminished reputation, just went strength to strength). I was thinking more like how Lemar two years ago was 22 and we were apparently willing to pay 75 million for him, he's then had the wrong move and it's gone a bit wrong for him and at 24, no longer a prospect, probably available at just over half what we were willing to pay, if we were still interested and confident of getting out of him what we predicted back then it would seem like a good move under what I thought you were putting forward.

For the record I no longer think we would be looking at Lemar, i think he dates back to when we were looking at 4231 moving forward and leaving 433 behind. Although I may be wrong. Maybe we are looking at;

Henderson, Wijnaldum, Fabinho, Milner, Keita and Grujic for the 2.

Ox, Keita, Firmino, Mane, Minamino, Elliot, Jones and maybe Shaqiri, Wilson or a new signing for the 3.

Salah, Origi and Brewster for the 1.

Could go that way. Personally prefer 433 though.

But only used Lemar as a high profile example of what I thought you meant.
Yeah I wasn't specifically thinking about players who were considered the next big thing but have fallen away, just guys who have had to show resilience and grit to get to where they are. That could be that they had to come up through the league system or that they struggled to turn teenage talent into adult football - either way really.

There aren't many examples of those in the English game that spring to mind right now probably because teams are holding on to players a lot longer.
 

StevieJayUSA

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I’ll throw a name into the hat.

One of the nice things about living in the USA is the amount of footy that is available on the television. One player I’ve gotten to watch a couple times now, and has impressed me as a “Klopp” type signing—and also has experience in England— is Jeremie Boga. Signed by Sassoulo from Chelsea, he has pace, technical nous, an eye for a pass, and is 23. Imagine he could be had for around £12-15M, though Chelsea does have a buy back clause, I believe
 

Danny Sarge

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Klopp has been really clear that nobody leaves in January, so shaq is going nowhere.

I think he and Lallana will move in the summer, and we’ll look to add a quality midfielder.
Grealish possibly. Think he'd be a great addition to our midfield.
 

The Infamous

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Just looking at up and coming CB prospects in the top 5 leagues (and the Championship). The criteria I used was the assess our four main CBs on their whoscored.com stats and find a common trend.

>1.0 INT & <1.0 FOUAGETAKINTFOUCLRDBPBLKKEYAVP%LNG
MATIP29.01.71.70.95.31.00.60.170.183.12.9
VAN DIJK28.00.71.10.44.80.20.40.182.588.85.5
LOVREN30.01.31.00.34.60.50.80.168.383.92.9
GOMEZ22.00.91.10.81.50.30.30.357.789.32.3
AVERAGE27.31.21.20.64.10.50.50.269.786.33.4

All of our CBs have >1.0 INT (interception) per game with <1.0 FOU (Fouls committed). Gomez's clearances and passing stats are reduced by his appearances at RB but otherwise he is roughly in line with the others. In terms of passing all our CBs are over 83% completion and average roughly 70 passes per game (Gomez's stats in this area increase when only considered at CB).

Therefore I looked at all the CBs under the age of 25 in Europe who are averaging more than 1.0 interceptions and less than 1.0 fouls per game (they also must be regular starters). There are 55 that match these criteria. At this point I factored in the other stats.

Passing I have tried to be more generous with as few will have the volume of passes we do because of the way we play, and the quality of the team.

Centre back is probably the hardest position to judge on the rudimentary stats provided to the public - a good centre back might not need to tackle, for example - but the idea is the find a list of players that should be scouted further, or that people on the forum will know more about and can fill in some blanks that data cannot.

I decided interceptions and fouls was the best measure as this implies a level of awareness and control in situations that could be missing if going off tackles, for example.

Of the 55 players who hit the first criteria I then narrowed that down by removing players with very poor passing statistics, very high dribbled past ratio and those with foul counts on the high end of the acceptable ratio (unless high "activity", which I have deemed as TAK+INT, makes up for it).

This has left now 25 players across Europe's top five leagues who could potentially be fits in our system. I have listed them in no particular order below. Their transfermarkt.co.uk value is in the comments section (this is unreliable but an interesting measure).

AGETAKINTFOUCLRDBPBLKKEYAVP%LNGCOMMENTS
WHITELEEDS22.01.82.50.93.50.40.70.258.485.03.1GOOD PASSING AND INT RATE. HIGHER FOUL COUNT THAN IDEAL BUT INT RATE IS HIGH. £2.25M.
WEBSTERBRIGHTON25.01.21.60.42.80.60.80.464.285.13.8LOW FOUL RATE WITH GOOD DEFENSIVE ACTION. HIGH PASS VOLUME AND %. £13.5M.
TOMORICHELSEA22.02.01.50.52.50.50.30.564.586.03.3LOW FOUL RATE COMPARED TO HIGH ACTIVITY. GOOD PASSING VOLUME AND %. £18M.
SOYUNCULEICESTER23.01.61.40.95.10.60.70.169.489.82.9WELL ROUNDED. HIGH TACKLE AND INTERCEPTION RATE PER FOUL. GOOD PASSING. £36M.
AKEBOURNEMOUTH24.01.11.40.34.20.20.70.348.589.11.9RARELY FOULS DESPITE GOOD TAK & INT RATE. HARD TO DRIBBLE PAST. WOULD LIKE HIGH PASS VOLUME BUT GOOD PASSING %. £31.5M.
GODFREYNORWICH21.00.91.10.44.80.31.40.053.789.32.9RARELY COMMITS FOULS. TOUGH TO DRIBBLE PAST. GOOD ON THE BALL. VERY YOUNG. £11.7M.
FELIPELAZIO22.01.51.60.62.10.40.70.140.987.92.6PASSING INDICATES SIGNIFICANT CHANGE IN STYLE BUT % SHOWS POTENTIAL TO GROW. GOOD DEFENSIVE STATS. £10.8M.
AIDOOCELTA VIGO24.01.41.50.74.30.30.50.146.587.92.8PROMISING PASSING STATS AND GOOD DEFENSIVE EFFICIENCY. £7.2M.
GIMENEZATLETICO24.01.41.30.63.40.40.30.041.885.24.0NEEDS TO DEVELOP PASS VOLUME BUT STRONG DEFENSIVE STATS. £63M.
ELVEDIGLADBACH23.01.72.20.63.50.60.40.049.992.21.9NOT AN ENTERPRISING PASSER BUT IS SAFE. HIGH POINTS ON DEFENSIVE STATS. £31.5M.
SCHONLAUPADERBORN25.02.42.10.96.90.80.50.271.589.32.9HIGH DEFENSIVE NUMBERS OFFSET 0.9 FOUL COUNT. VERY STRONG PASSING. £1.35M.
ST JUSTEMAINZ23.02.22.00.83.30.70.80.139.486.22.1EXCELLENT DEFENSIVE ACTIVITY OFFSETS HIGHER FOUL COUNT. PASSING VOLUME IS LOW BUT SHOWS POTENTIAL. £8.1M.
UPAMECANOLEIPZIG21.02.51.50.83.20.80.50.571.788.85.0AGGRESSIVE PASSER WITH HIGH %. HIGH DEFENSIVE OUTPUT PER FOUL. £45M.
REKIKHERTHA BERLIN25.01.41.50.72.70.30.70.148.687.74.3GOOD DEFENSIVE OUTPUT. PASSING GRADE IS OK BUT IN NEED OF HIGHER VOLUME. £10.8M.
LIENHARTFREIBURG23.00.51.50.53.50.30.70.255.384.53.5HIGH NUMBER OF INTERCEPTIONS WITH PROMISING PASSING NUMBERS. £9.9M.
AKANJIDORTMUND24.01.31.10.62.50.50.60.167.191.03.1GOOD ACTIVITY TO FOUL RATE. USED TO HIGH VOLUME PASSING. GOOD %. £31.5M.
SARRNICE20.00.72.00.21.40.50.30.159.690.23.5VERY LOW FOUL RATE WITH HIGH INTERCEPTIONS. VERY GOOD PASSING %. £16.2M.
MUKINAYIMONACO18.01.11.70.82.80.30.70.256.884.93.4DEFENSIVE NUMBERS SHOW POTENTIAL DESPITE RAISED FOUL COUNT. STRONG PASSING STATS. £18M.
PELMARDNICE19.02.21.50.32.60.20.40.058.490.91.5SAFER PASSER BUT HIGH DEFENSIVE NUMBERS WITH LOW FOULS. HARD TO DRIBBLE PAST. £3.6M.
GELINRENNES22.01.11.30.52.80.50.60.240.686.74.2AGGRESSIVE PASSING CB WITH GOOD OUTPUT TO FOUL RATIO. £5.4M.
DIASBENFICA22.01.31.10.62.40.40.40.565.189.75.6ENTERPRISING PASSER WITH OK FOUL COUNT. ROOM TO IMPROVE. £34.2M.
MEULENSTEENWAALWIJK20.01.41.90.43.50.91.50.155.585.24.6GETS DRIBBLED PAST TOO EASILY BUT TAK AND BLK SUGGESTS HAS PACE TO MAKE UP FOR IT. GOOD PASSING. £360K.
VEENDORPEMMEN22.01.91.70.73.70.50.60.151.982.45.5DEFENSIVE OUTPUT IS STRONG. OK PASSER, NEEDS TO IMPROVE HERE. £540K.
BOTMANHEERENVEEN20.01.51.40.55.20.20.60.365.883.83.9SHOWS PROMISE IN BOTH PASSING AND DEFENDING. DOESN'T CONCEDE TOO MANY FOULS. HARD TO DRIBBLE PAST. £1.13M.
DOEKHIVITESSE21.01.21.10.45.30.10.60.254.988.72.2LOW FOUL RATE WITH GOOD ACTIVE DEFENDING STATS. SOLID PASSING NUMBERS. £810K.

My personal favourites are the Nice centre backs Malang Sarr & Andy Pelmard, Adam Webster, Nico Elvedi and Nathan Ake.

Andy Pelmard and Malang Sarr have the added bonus of being extremely young. Dayot Upamecano, Sven Botman and Ben Godfrey are extremely promising also.

Sebastien Schonlau's stats are outstanding but I am unsure if this is simply an unusual season and would need more details.
Ben white is class. Reminds me of Gomez. Would sign him he would still get plenty of minutes if Degsy leaves. Only seen him twice but he’s a rolls Royce defender with physicality and recovery pace. Hopefully Brighton get relegated and we can get him for the low :)
 

The Infamous

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I’ll throw a name into the hat.

One of the nice things about living in the USA is the amount of footy that is available on the television. One player I’ve gotten to watch a couple times now, and has impressed me as a “Klopp” type signing—and also has experience in England— is Jeremie Boga. Signed by Sassoulo from Chelsea, he has pace, technical nous, an eye for a pass, and is 23. Imagine he could be had for around £12-15M, though Chelsea does have a buy back clause, I believe
He was better than Sterling and Suso at academy level. Probably the best player of his generation. Weird how he’s career has developed but happy to see he is doing well. Victim of the Chelsea conveyor belt. Mane esque player as a kid.
 

Richard88

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Ben white is class. Reminds me of Gomez. Would sign him he would still get plenty of minutes if Degsy leaves. Only seen him twice but he’s a rolls Royce defender with physicality and recovery pace. Hopefully Brighton get relegated and we can get him for the low :)
He only has 2 years left on his contract after this summer, so Brighton will have a tricky decision. Do they sell him with 2 years left, before he has had the opportunity to play in the PL (thereby increasing his value) - but at which stage they are still in a strong position with 2 years left on the contract to not NEED to sell.... or, do they wait until he has gained PL experience but only has 12 months remaining on his contract (thereby weakening their negotiating position)? ...

Either way I think it's a situation that leaves a clear opportunity for a club to make a move without necessarily paying over the odds. Either the buying club can say that he's not PL proven (if buying this summer), or they can say that he only has 12 months remaining on his contract next summer even if he has had a good season in the PL.
 

The Infamous

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He only has 2 years left on his contract after this summer, so Brighton will have a tricky decision. Do they sell him with 2 years left, before he has had the opportunity to play in the PL (thereby increasing his value) - but at which stage they are still in a strong position with 2 years left on the contract to not NEED to sell.... or, do they wait until he has gained PL experience but only has 12 months remaining on his contract (thereby weakening their negotiating position)? ...

Either way I think it's a situation that leaves a clear opportunity for a club to make a move without necessarily paying over the odds. Either the buying club can say that he's not PL proven (if buying this summer), or they can say that he only has 12 months remaining on his contract next summer even if he has had a good season in the PL.
very good player with matip,vvd,Gomez,white,Hoever,VDB we have a good mix of center backs. 2 fast ones,2 aerially dominant and experienced ones and 2 young apprentices with potential. Very big fan of Ben White prefer him to a unknown defender like Upamencano. He was a monster against Arsenal they couldn’t get passed him. I think he’s the next big defender and now is the best time to sign and develop him into a LFC player. Seems pretty under the radar as well he would do very well at spurs or arsenal
 

Richard88

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very good player with matip,vvd,Gomez,white,Hoever,VDB we have a good mix of center backs. 2 fast ones,2 aerially dominant and experienced ones and 2 young apprentices with potential. Very big fan of Ben White prefer him to a unknown defender like Upamencano. He was a monster against Arsenal they couldn’t get passed him. I think he’s the next big defender and now is the best time to sign and develop him into a LFC player. Seems pretty under the radar as well he would do very well at spurs or arsenal
From Ben White's perspective he might be looking at our CB options and thinking that he'd struggle to get in the team. Even after Matip moves on in a few years he'd still have Gomez to compete with, not to mention Hoever who looks extremely promising as well. If I were Arsenal or City I'd be pushing for him quite a bit as their need for a young CB is greater than ours.
 

Sweeting

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very good player with matip,vvd,Gomez,white,Hoever,VDB we have a good mix of center backs. 2 fast ones,2 aerially dominant and experienced ones and 2 young apprentices with potential. Very big fan of Ben White prefer him to a unknown defender like Upamencano. He was a monster against Arsenal they couldn’t get passed him. I think he’s the next big defender and now is the best time to sign and develop him into a LFC player. Seems pretty under the radar as well he would do very well at spurs or arsenal
By that do you mean unknown to you?

It is hard to argue to Ben White has achieved more than Dayot Upamecano. One has been loaned out by Brighton and the other is top of the Bundesliga.
 

The Infamous

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From Ben White's perspective he might be looking at our CB options and thinking that he'd struggle to get in the team. Even after Matip moves on in a few years he'd still have Gomez to compete with, not to mention Hoever who looks extremely promising as well. If I were Arsenal or City I'd be pushing for him quite a bit as their need for a young CB is greater than ours.
:) they will sign a overrated defender or a flavour of the month. It’s not glamorous to sign a Brighton and hove loanee. Even if they sign him doubt he would start over Laporte and a big signing. Because you know just adding 22 year old Ben white would result in meltdown. They will just get Koulibaly and turn him into shit.
 

The Infamous

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By that do you mean unknown to you?

It is hard to argue to Ben White has achieved more than Dayot Upamecano. One has been loaned out by Brighton and the other is top of the Bundesliga.
upamencano is shit hasn’t even developed in any way. He’s practically the same as his debut season. Everton level defender. Konate and Akanji are way better defenders. In my humble opinion.
 

Sweeting

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upamencano is shit hasn’t even developed in any way. He’s practically the same as his debut season. Everton level defender. Konate and Akanji are way better defenders. In my humble opinion.
I don't know enough about Upamecano to say otherwise but on the face of it you have a 21 year old starting every game for the team currently top of the Bundesliga. By comparison Ben White is 22 years old and has been loaned out by Brighton. When White was Upamecano's age he was playing in League One for Peterborough.

Both are having strong seasons, at least that's what the stats say, but Upamecano is clearly playing in the better quality of league.
 

Zoran

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Cantwell reminds me of Pienaar, don't know if it's just his size, socks, hair and position/zone he plays, in that left half space.

:LOL:
 
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JustHitMyHead

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With our scouting network... I feel that if a potential target is good enough, is priced well and has good resell value we should totally sign them up regardless of whether we have a shortage in that position or not.

Werner, Upamecano, Ben White??? See how much they are going for...

Sign good players, loan them out, bring them back if they reach next level or sell them on if they don't kick on... This could totally benefit us since our target identification process seems so strong. If we don't need them, loan them back or let them go to Bournemouth on loan and take some points off our competitors.
 

Mascot88

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From Ben White's perspective he might be looking at our CB options and thinking that he'd struggle to get in the team. Even after Matip moves on in a few years he'd still have Gomez to compete with, not to mention Hoever who looks extremely promising as well. If I were Arsenal or City I'd be pushing for him quite a bit as their need for a young CB is greater than ours.
I would be moving Matip and Lovren on this summer.
 

Iluvatar

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I don’t think Klopp would, and I don’t think there is a role for him anymore.
I think he'd be an ideal back up to Mane on the left. Maybe if he left his twat agent you never know but I'm sure you're right.

(was watching a compliation of him and boy he was a wizard for us at times.) Nostalgia!
 

Mascot88

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I think he'd be an ideal back up to Mane on the left. Maybe if he left his twat agent you never know but I'm sure you're right.

(was watching a compliation of him and boy he was a wizard for us at times.) Nostalgia!
But look at how hard Mane works down the whole flank.

It would have to be a fucking contrite and humbled Coutinho that ever pulls on a red shirt again.
 

Red over the water

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No to Coutinho for me. Good player, but still a no for me! I didn’t like the way he left. He should live with the career consequences. He backed himself to shine at Barcelona and it didn’t work out. Now Bayern don’t want to pay the money. In a sense I would see us ‘rewarding’ Barcelona if we sign Coutinho, as we would help them out financially. There’s also a sense in which we would reward the player, as he will want big money. To my mind that sort of money should be reserved for the players who have got us to where we are today, not for someone who left the party. Or we should spend good money on new players with new chapters to write in their expanding career when they come to us.

Good player, but don’t go back. We’ve moved on, rather successfully, and we should press on without Coutinho.
 

Iluvatar

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But look at how hard Mane works down the whole flank.

It would have to be a fucking contrite and humbled Coutinho that ever pulls on a red shirt again.
As I said probably a hint of nostalgia, but for £30mil and would integrate quickly.. No no I'll stop sorry :)
 

Richard88

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I would be moving Matip and Lovren on this summer.
Lovren will probably want to leave, and will probably be allowed to do so with just 12 months left on his contract. I think we'll sign a CB to replace him.

That said, I would keep Matip. I think the idea is for Hoever and/or Van den Berg to replace him in 2-3 years time. My bet would be on Hoever doing that, he looks more accomplished than Vd Berg at the same age.
 
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