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Who would you buy?

redbj

hurry up, July 1st, let's get the show on the road
Joined
Jun 23, 2003
Messages
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What would you lads say to something radical this summer? I'm picturing a scenario like this:

Salah and Mane sold to Barca/Real/Bayern/Juve/Whoever for a combined intake of around 250mil

We bring in Havertz, Werner, Sancho, and another backup CB after selling Lovren. Werner and Sancho start up top with Bobby, Havertz plies his trade in the middle of the park.

Advantages are we make money on the deal, we get a LOT younger with some of the top young talent in the world, we don't have to worry about AFCON fucking us in Jan, and we don't have to worry about Mane and Salah agitating for the higher salaries they will rightly deserve after winning the league.

Disadvantage is obviously losing two world class players who score ~20 league goals a season each. Also risk upsetting the squad which is currently very settled and very balanced.

I just think you have to be prepared to make moves like this to stay at the top. Ferguson fucked united by selling their best asset in Ronaldo and never properly replacing him, constantly using the tired old "no value in the market" excuse. We are never going to be a more desirable location than we are now. Securing 3 top young talents like this could see us dominate for years to come, but it's not without massive risk.


Apologize if someone's already suggested this before.
We’d still smash everyone else, for they are all shit
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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What would you lads say to something radical this summer? I'm picturing a scenario like this:

Salah and Mane sold to Barca/Real/Bayern/Juve/Whoever for a combined intake of around 250mil

We bring in Havertz, Werner, Sancho, and another backup CB after selling Lovren. Werner and Sancho start up top with Bobby, Havertz plies his trade in the middle of the park.

Advantages are we make money on the deal, we get a LOT younger with some of the top young talent in the world, we don't have to worry about AFCON fucking us in Jan, and we don't have to worry about Mane and Salah agitating for the higher salaries they will rightly deserve after winning the league.

Disadvantage is obviously losing two world class players who score ~20 league goals a season each. Also risk upsetting the squad which is currently very settled and very balanced.

I just think you have to be prepared to make moves like this to stay at the top. Ferguson fucked united by selling their best asset in Ronaldo and never properly replacing him, constantly using the tired old "no value in the market" excuse. We are never going to be a more desirable location than we are now. Securing 3 top young talents like this could see us dominate for years to come, but it's not without massive risk.


Apologize if someone's already suggested this before.
I'm sorry but no. Add a fourth this summer. Then as and when the others start wanting to move on (inevitable but hopefully few years away) as each of them leaves we replace them. At that point we are still having a settled 3 top class forwards for a front 3 in 433 and adding a fourth each time to see how they settle.
 

Sweeting

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Jun 2, 2008
Messages
9,374
What would you lads say to something radical this summer? I'm picturing a scenario like this:

Salah and Mane sold to Barca/Real/Bayern/Juve/Whoever for a combined intake of around 250mil

We bring in Havertz, Werner, Sancho, and another backup CB after selling Lovren. Werner and Sancho start up top with Bobby, Havertz plies his trade in the middle of the park.

Advantages are we make money on the deal, we get a LOT younger with some of the top young talent in the world, we don't have to worry about AFCON fucking us in Jan, and we don't have to worry about Mane and Salah agitating for the higher salaries they will rightly deserve after winning the league.

Disadvantage is obviously losing two world class players who score ~20 league goals a season each. Also risk upsetting the squad which is currently very settled and very balanced.

I just think you have to be prepared to make moves like this to stay at the top. Ferguson fucked united by selling their best asset in Ronaldo and never properly replacing him, constantly using the tired old "no value in the market" excuse. We are never going to be a more desirable location than we are now. Securing 3 top young talents like this could see us dominate for years to come, but it's not without massive risk.


Apologize if someone's already suggested this before.
Havertz, Sancho and Werner could all be shite. They play in a pub league and we know nothing about their character.

Sounds like risk for the sake of risk.
 

PeachesEnRegalia

Epstein didn't kill himself
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Jul 10, 2017
Messages
1,929
All fair statements lads. I’m just envisioning something bold and radical that could happen. I highly doubt those three would be “shite” though, especially not with our top class coaching involved. Their talent is undeniable, but I’d worry about the balance of the team. Will Sancho and Werner chip in defensively as much as Mo and Sadio do? Hard to say.
 

Flobs

FADA
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Apr 20, 2015
Messages
9,695
What would you lads say to something radical this summer? I'm picturing a scenario like this:

Salah and Mane sold to Barca/Real/Bayern/Juve/Whoever for a combined intake of around 250mil

We bring in Havertz, Werner, Sancho, and another backup CB after selling Lovren. Werner and Sancho start up top with Bobby, Havertz plies his trade in the middle of the park.

Advantages are we make money on the deal, we get a LOT younger with some of the top young talent in the world, we don't have to worry about AFCON fucking us in Jan, and we don't have to worry about Mane and Salah agitating for the higher salaries they will rightly deserve after winning the league.

Disadvantage is obviously losing two world class players who score ~20 league goals a season each. Also risk upsetting the squad which is currently very settled and very balanced.

I just think you have to be prepared to make moves like this to stay at the top. Ferguson fucked united by selling their best asset in Ronaldo and never properly replacing him, constantly using the tired old "no value in the market" excuse. We are never going to be a more desirable location than we are now. Securing 3 top young talents like this could see us dominate for years to come, but it's not without massive risk.


Apologize if someone's already suggested this before.
That's not bold that's nuts, correct me if I'm wrong but don't all those players coming in play in Germany, the country where we have had particular problems with the players we have taken from there, how long would it take to get them up to pave if at all?
This would do my already damaged ticker immense harm.
 

Richard88

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Dec 7, 2017
Messages
516
That front 3 would lineup in a similar manner to our current setup, with Havertz in the Firmino role AND Werner and Sancho on the wings.

Werner --- Havertz --- Sancho

I could envisage a setup like that working well, I just dont think Klopp will want to change so much so fast.
 

Sweeting

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Jun 2, 2008
Messages
9,374
I was watching the highlights of the Dortmund win over Frankfurt and thought of what @ILLOK said about Werner, and by extension the Bundesliga, about the time the players have to finish in attacking areas compared to the PL.

Sancho scored for Dortmund when he had the entirety of the left side of the pitch to himself, ran from just inside the halfway line, cut back behind a challenge in the penalty area (that was nowhere near) and had a relatively easy finish into the near post -keeper predictably dove the wrong way.

It does make it a bit tough to judge these players and how they would adapt to PL football. I'm sure they are all very good and would be fine eventually but how can you say any of Havertz, Werner or Sancho is worth £100m when they are playing in a league with such little comparability defensively?

Is it possible to score to a goal where you are the only player in the opposition's half in the PL? Sure, Salah does it. However, Salah does it in the 94th minute to seal a game - those chances are not there in the 64th minute like they are in Bundesliga.

The league is so poor tactically that I think we have to start thinking of it with a similar cynicism to buying strikers from Holland. It won't always work.
 

Alright Now

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Apr 16, 2016
Messages
11,076
What would you lads say to something radical this summer? I'm picturing a scenario like this:

Salah and Mane sold to Barca/Real/Bayern/Juve/Whoever for a combined intake of around 250mil

We bring in Havertz, Werner, Sancho, and another backup CB after selling Lovren. Werner and Sancho start up top with Bobby, Havertz plies his trade in the middle of the park.

Advantages are we make money on the deal, we get a LOT younger with some of the top young talent in the world, we don't have to worry about AFCON fucking us in Jan, and we don't have to worry about Mane and Salah agitating for the higher salaries they will rightly deserve after winning the league.

Disadvantage is obviously losing two world class players who score ~20 league goals a season each. Also risk upsetting the squad which is currently very settled and very balanced.

I just think you have to be prepared to make moves like this to stay at the top. Ferguson fucked united by selling their best asset in Ronaldo and never properly replacing him, constantly using the tired old "no value in the market" excuse. We are never going to be a more desirable location than we are now. Securing 3 top young talents like this could see us dominate for years to come, but it's not without massive risk.


Apologize if someone's already suggested this before.
What?
 

Anfield rd Dreamer

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I was watching the highlights of the Dortmund win over Frankfurt and thought of what @ILLOK said about Werner, and by extension the Bundesliga, about the time the players have to finish in attacking areas compared to the PL.

Sancho scored for Dortmund when he had the entirety of the left side of the pitch to himself, ran from just inside the halfway line, cut back behind a challenge in the penalty area (that was nowhere near) and had a relatively easy finish into the near post -keeper predictably dove the wrong way.

It does make it a bit tough to judge these players and how they would adapt to PL football. I'm sure they are all very good and would be fine eventually but how can you say any of Havertz, Werner or Sancho is worth £100m when they are playing in a league with such little comparability defensively?

Is it possible to score to a goal where you are the only player in the opposition's half in the PL? Sure, Salah does it. However, Salah does it in the 94th minute to seal a game - those chances are not there in the 64th minute like they are in Bundesliga.

The league is so poor tactically that I think we have to start thinking of it with a similar cynicism to buying strikers from Holland. It won't always work.
Would looking at their European pedigree be better?

Havertz in (senior) European games has a goal or assist every 156 minutes but all 3 goals and 3 assists he has are in Europa League. Hes played 514 minutes in the Champions League without scoring or assisting. Played against Spurs (cameo), CSKA (cameo), Atletico Madrid all when really young. This season Loko Moscow x1, Juventus x2, Atletico Madrid x2.

Werner has a goal or assist every 110 minutes in Europe. He has a goal or assist every 104 minutes in the Champions League! Besiktas x2, Porto x2 (1g), Monaco x2 (2g), Lyon x2 (1g), Benfica x2 (2g + 1a), Zenit x2. Not all that impressive opposition.

Sancho has scored or assisted once every 150 minutes and has only played Champions League games. Sancho has played Barca x2 (1g), Inter x2 (1a), Slavia Prague x2 (1g+1a), Spur x2, Club Brugge x2, Monaco x1 (1a) and Atletico Madrid x2 (1g). Not bad opposition actually.
 

Zoran

Fighting like beavers.
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I'd say the Bundesliga is like a little pool of brave teams (I don't think it's poor tactically, far from it, but you get more clubs with similar ideas and the result is goals and unpredictable outcomes), fun football and great atmosphere. The league in terms of stadiums, prices and atmosphere is probably the best value for money you can get Europe. So you get a lot of modern stuff over there, organized work, trust in youth, progressive ideas. The league of 18 also when sometimes Bayern (they sometimes struggle in terms of wanting to become even more of a global force, more consistent at it) aren't as dominant is pretty close. You get Schalke one year fighting relegation and they can be in the CL next season. Up and down. That type of changes, except for a few clubs who maybe have a different style, simply struggle when they're promoted or are financially somewhat below the rest. Very interesting because there are not many differences between a lot of teams, that fight for European places brings you new stories almost every season. At times it's not the most interesting title fight if Bayern are on their top level (credit to Dortmund for establishing themselves more since Klopp's era), but for those places a bit below it's arguably the best to follow. Sometimes lacks knockout power, a higher ceiling, I don't know how to describe it in different words. So yeah, at times it can look like a safe bet for basically any type of striker who is at a struggling point in his career and needs a good season or two somewhere. I'd say it's the most open league of the big five. Still, like everywhere, we have to focus primarily on player by player and then look at a wider context.
 

Nikola

"Oh, history writer, don't close the pages yet!"
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I was watching the highlights of the Dortmund win over Frankfurt and thought of what @ILLOK said about Werner, and by extension the Bundesliga, about the time the players have to finish in attacking areas compared to the PL.

Sancho scored for Dortmund when he had the entirety of the left side of the pitch to himself, ran from just inside the halfway line, cut back behind a challenge in the penalty area (that was nowhere near) and had a relatively easy finish into the near post -keeper predictably dove the wrong way.

It does make it a bit tough to judge these players and how they would adapt to PL football. I'm sure they are all very good and would be fine eventually but how can you say any of Havertz, Werner or Sancho is worth £100m when they are playing in a league with such little comparability defensively?

Is it possible to score to a goal where you are the only player in the opposition's half in the PL? Sure, Salah does it. However, Salah does it in the 94th minute to seal a game - those chances are not there in the 64th minute like they are in Bundesliga.

The league is so poor tactically that I think we have to start thinking of it with a similar cynicism to buying strikers from Holland. It won't always work.
I do wonder if there's a reason for Klopp not buying there or if it was just a turn of events that led the targets to turn down the move to Liverpool (Goetze, Brandt, Goretzka). Beside these three, Matip (an opportunistic move), Klavan (squad depth) and Karius (a rather cheap gamble that failed to pay off on the pitch), I don't think club were in for some Bundesliga-based player who would be an expensive, first eleven option. And even if they are in for Sancho, they already wanted him when he was at Man City.
 

MarcusBerglund

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I do wonder if there's a reason for Klopp not buying there or if it was just a turn of events that led the targets to turn down the move to Liverpool (Goetze, Brandt, Goretzka). Beside these three, Matip (an opportunistic move), Klavan (squad depth) and Karius (a rather cheap gamble that failed to pay off on the pitch), I don't think club were in for some Bundesliga-based player who would be an expensive, first eleven option. And even if they are in for Sancho, they already wanted him when he was at Man City.
Keita???
 

Nikola

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Well, I guess you can imagine my train of thought regarding his injuries when I forget one of the most expensive signings Liverpool ever made, not just from Bundesliga... I stand corrected. And I feel even worse for him, if it's possible.
 

Nikola

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The more I watch Cantwell, the more he looks like a player Rafa would have bought for peanuts ages ago or a player Southampton would have bought under Pochettino and then sold him to Liverpool for extortionate sum of money. I'll be very surprised if he isn't in Premier League next season, I hope Liverpool keep him in their radar. He reminds me of Lallana a lot, covers a lot of ground, does a lot of defending, has pretty nimble feet. Scored against Man City, too!
 

ILLOK

In the Danger Zone.
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The more I watch Cantwell, the more he looks like a player Rafa would have bought for peanuts ages ago or a player Southampton would have bought under Pochettino and then sold him to Liverpool for extortionate sum of money. I'll be very surprised if he isn't in Premier League next season, I hope Liverpool keep him in their radar. He reminds me of Lallana a lot, covers a lot of ground, does a lot of defending, has pretty nimble feet. Scored against Man City, too!
Frustrating player to watch with the constant falling over but he does protect the ball really well.
 

Nikola

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Frustrating player to watch with the constant falling over but he does protect the ball really well.
So... Just like Lallana at Southampton? :D Joking aside, I've only watched him this season in Premier League (can't stress just how impressed I am with Sheffield United and Norwich, even if Norwich's refusal to be disciplined like today continues to baffle me - I don't think it's only down to injuries). He was at heart of everything Norwich did, scored a couple of goals by making late runs into the box, popped up left, right and centre, tracked back without looking twice... Looks a bit too slim, though, needs some bulking up. The next club that snaps him up could turn him into a 50 million player by the going rates.
 

Sweeting

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The more I watch Cantwell, the more he looks like a player Rafa would have bought for peanuts ages ago or a player Southampton would have bought under Pochettino and then sold him to Liverpool for extortionate sum of money. I'll be very surprised if he isn't in Premier League next season, I hope Liverpool keep him in their radar. He reminds me of Lallana a lot, covers a lot of ground, does a lot of defending, has pretty nimble feet. Scored against Man City, too!
Thought he was absolutely terrible. He wasn't diving, he just doesn't have an ounce of strength in him - fell over every time he was breathed on. Good close control but has no pace, no strength, no particularly great stamina or work ethic.

I kept half an eye on him without the ball and he was utterly absent, left Byram and Lewis on an island, reliant on the midfielders to cover across whilst he floated.

All of which could be forgiven if he was a great attacking talent but he is completely lacking in threat. He had a couple of runs at Trent - the only times he "won" was when Trent got a little too eager and fouled him (for things that wouldn't knock most players over). He had absolutely no way of effecting the play or threatening us. It's rare to see a player who so perfectly encapsulates the phrase "flatters to decieve" - a nice touch here, a one-two there but never actually doing anything.

I can see the comparison to Lallana, but he is a poor shade of Lallana.

I really hope, and expect given our record, that we are not the mugs who drop £30m on Cantwell. Let Leicester or United spunk their money on him.
 

ILLOK

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How often has he played there for the first team??
How can anyone base an opinion on his suitability from this point??
He's played there in numerous friendlies and against MK Dons and Aston Villa.

He's played there for the academy more than he's played at CB

He plays there for the Netherlands more than he does at CB.

So why wouldn't he be considered an option at right back?
 

Quicksand

Looking for Clues...
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He's played there in numerous friendlies and against MK Dons and Aston Villa.

He's played there for the academy more than he's played at CB

He plays there for the Netherlands more than he does at CB.

So why wouldn't he be considered an option at right back?
Ok
Sound, you are right. No need to talk about any possible players to sign at RB. Matt Cash isnt needed. Fuck him.
 

GermanRed

from doubters to believers to sky-high achievers
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The few games of Hoever I saw at RB I thought he is already good enough to be a starter there for some PL teams.

Then Neco appeared and he seems to have an even higher potential at RB than KJH. Fantastic job they are doing in the academy.

Think Hoever wants to be a CB in the future. I know some might not agree but for me he needs to still grow a bit (which we don’t know if it will happen) and get physically stronger (which will definitely happen) to be able to make it as a pro.

Even in the worst case he would make it at RB IMO.
 

Nikola

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Thought he was absolutely terrible. He wasn't diving, he just doesn't have an ounce of strength in him - fell over every time he was breathed on. Good close control but has no pace, no strength, no particularly great stamina or work ethic.

I kept half an eye on him without the ball and he was utterly absent, left Byram and Lewis on an island, reliant on the midfielders to cover across whilst he floated.

All of which could be forgiven if he was a great attacking talent but he is completely lacking in threat. He had a couple of runs at Trent - the only times he "won" was when Trent got a little too eager and fouled him (for things that wouldn't knock most players over). He had absolutely no way of effecting the play or threatening us. It's rare to see a player who so perfectly encapsulates the phrase "flatters to decieve" - a nice touch here, a one-two there but never actually doing anything.

I can see the comparison to Lallana, but he is a poor shade of Lallana.

I really hope, and expect given our record, that we are not the mugs who drop £30m on Cantwell. Let Leicester or United spunk their money on him.
Don't get me wrong, I'd very be surprised if Liverpool go in for him at this moment but, given how he played throughout the season, I'd also be very surprised if he dropped down the league with Norwich. Liverpool don't let many players look great against them these days, at least when it comes to Premier League anyway. I think he'll end up at a midtable club, I think Southampton could be a decent destination for him because of their manager's style of football (they do a lot of pressing and they need improvement when it comes to retaining the ball). After that, who knows, I'd very much like Liverpool to keep tabs on him as the club are no longer reliant on taking punts on young players and hoping they develop by playing with the first team.